[Inks]

With grey silicone tips and a deep insertion the W3 can get boosted midbass, but the UM3X does not.  With UM56 tips the W3 does not have too much midbass for me, nor does the UM3X, and the two sound closer to each other if I use the UM56 tips.  For me, the custom silicone tips and vinyl tips alike improve the W3 bass and treble.  Tips are important, as is ear positioning - they improve the W3 bass and the treble alike, at least for me, but do not harm the bass and treble in the UM3X.  The W3 treble is better with Complys than the Westone silicone tips, but I prefer the UM3X treble with the silicone tips over the Complys.  The bass of the W3 with Complys is a bit stronger than the UM3X bass, but I didn't find it to bleed over into the mids.

  Bass levels change with seal, tips that give you a better seal will naturally have better bass. Having said that, if the UM tips give you less midbass, it means the seal isn't as good as some universal tips. Treble improvement, I can see that because the tips will have a much specialized insertion depth, but reducing bass is a bad thing,in the end it's just how the IEM is, unfortunately I think it's bass is excessive. 

 

[Doc-holliday]

My favorite with the W4 is a to take the uncomfortable clear tip that comes with the W4, cut that stalk off, then cut the stalk in half, slide one half over each of the bores and put on a sony hybrid that fits. So comfy, great isolation and doesn't close the bore! 

+1000. I keep wondering why more W4 owners don't use the Hybrids. Probably some of the best tips for them, period. I do think that a solid tube sounds better, so I would rather use a stem from a foam tip rather than the silicone stalks. When you squeeze in a small Shure olive underneath the Hybrids, though, isolation goes through the roof good. Not Ety good, but I find that to be rather undesirable at times.

I finally get it.... you guys are basically making an "adapter" to use bigger bore tips. (sorry I did it wrong the first time you described it twinqy a week ago)

I just did the grey adapter idea and put on some tips I have (either the Senny Cx200 tips or the TF10 tips, they both looks the same).

The difference is not just a little bit. Any of those people out there bytchin that the W4 doesn't have enough bass needs to try this but it also brings out more in the lower midrange. Had my clip on shuffle and UB40 Red Wine came on. The depth of the sound of the loosely tuned snare in that song you could completely visualize (even with the synthetic echo on the mix). Cat Stevens wild world is now on. The richness of the guitar plucks......

Just made the best (universal) IEM I've ever heard even better.

Thanks guys for the tip. Gunna be toying around with this some more today.

 

[Spyro]

No need to crap all over the W3.  Sure, relative to W4 it can be considered sloppy but for the average casual listener out there already spending $300 on Bose, Dr. Dre and Beats, the W3 craps all over those.  Still a fun IEM but I think my tastes are changing a tad.
 
Tip update:  I think it is all about hitting your personal sweetspot between a little EQ, the tip you use and the synergy of your player and amp.
 
I switched to the tri-flange (smallest flange cut off, stem cut 1-2mm shorter than flush with bottom largest flange) and changed EQ to "jazz" setting.  I think this is it!  Been listening most of the day and it's amazing.  Sorry....I simply can't listen to ANY IEM flat or no EQ.   The EQ adds a little vibrance without really changing the sound sig of the W4.
 
So for me it's Ipod Classic on "jazz" EQ setting + analog Ibasso T3, gain 1 setting, plus modified tri flange.
 
FYI...I think the white supplied tri-flange tip opening is a few microns larger than the supplied grey flex sleeves.

 

[treal512]

Quote:

My favorite with the W4 is a to take the uncomfortable clear tip that comes with the W4, cut that stalk off, then cut the stalk in half, slide one half over each of the bores and put on a sony hybrid that fits. So comfy, great isolation and doesn't close the bore! 

 
Quote:

I finally get it.... you guys are basically making an "adapter" to use bigger bore tips. (sorry I did it wrong the first time you described it twinqy a week ago)
I just did the grey adapter idea and put on some tips I have (either the Senny Cx200 tips or the TF10 tips, they both looks the same).
The difference is not just a little bit. Any of those people out there bytchin that the W4 doesn't have enough bass needs to try this but it also brings out more in the lower midrange. Had my clip on shuffle and UB40 Red Wine came on. The depth of the sound of the loosely tuned snare in that song you could completely visualize (even with the synthetic echo on the mix). Cat Stevens wild world is now on. The richness of the guitar plucks......
Just made the best (universal) IEM I've ever heard even better.

 
@Doc and imackler: How does the bore size compare to Olives? And the SQ difference?

 

[imackler]

Quote:

@Doc and imackler: How does the bore size compare to Olives? And the SQ difference?

 
I think they're comparable. The Olives may be slightly more open. But I kept having Olives get stuck on my Westone stocks. And honestly, I think the hybrids are as comfortable as tips get. 

 

[JohnSantana]

Quote:

 
My favorite with the W4 is a to take the uncomfortable clear tip that comes with the W4, cut that stalk off, then cut the stalk in half, slide one half over each of the bores and put on a sony hybrid that fits. So comfy, great isolation and doesn't close the bore! 

is it any better than the Comply Tx-100 foam ?
because I can only rely on Amazon to get it to my town.

 

[Doc-holliday]

is it any better than the Comply Tx-100 foam ?
because I can only rely on Amazon to get it to my town.

I just made the adapters as advised by imackler and twinqy. Here's a pictorial:

Showing the small bore from the stock grey tip compared to the TS-400 comply tip for example here.

First, you turn the tip inside out like this exposing the stem:

Then you measure against the stem on the W4 how much you want to cut off. I found that this is just over half the lenght on my tips (so you will need to cut up 2 tips to do this)

Then you cut! I used scissors but a razor blade or exacto might get you a flatter, straighter cut.

Then you slide the cut off portion of the stalk onto the W4's stem. Will look like this once that is done:

Make sure you slide the rough cut side on first so the factory cut side is facing out (I just thot it looked better. You can see here the Ts-400 Comply tip opening is the same size as you adapter once you have streatched it over the W4 stem.

And there it is... All done

I am using the tips from my Senny CX200 actually but I used the comply's because you mentioned comply.

 

[TwinQY]

Quote:

I just made the adapters as advised by imackler and twinqy. Here's a pictorial:
Showing the small bore from the stock grey tip compared to the TS-400 comply tip for example here.

First, you turn the tip inside out like this exposing the stem:

Then you measure against the stem on the W4 how much you want to cut off. I found that this is just over half the lenght on my tips (so you will need to cut up 2 tips to do this)

Then you cut! I used scissors but a razor blade or exacto might get you a flatter, straighter cut.

Then you slide the cut off portion of the stalk onto the W4's stem. Will look like this once that is done:

Make sure you slide the rough cut side on first so the factory cut side is facing out (I just thot it looked better. You can see here the Ts-400 Comply tip opening is the same size as you adapter once you have streatched it over the W4 stem.

And there it is... All done

That's pretty much it, great photos. The problem with using the stems from the silicone tips is that they can be a bit too wide for some tips. I had to super-glue them when I used a pair of Hybrids because they fit too loosely on the adapter, and kept getting stuck in my ears. Another purely subjective thing I noticed is that the tips have a slightly shallower seal because of the larger, softer stems (only on my ears, can't say the same for everyone else) don't go in your ear as deep. Stems from the stock Complys are narrower, harder, and longer as well, so you can push them deep into the silicone tip you want to use without them the tips popping out all of a sudden. I remember others in the thread before me have hypothesized that a core made from a harder material gives sound benefits as well - so it's not just me swinging wild claims here!

 

[ANDEROAN]

GET OUT! man knowing all of this now, really bites! as I just sold my W4Rs? would have been very very nice to give this mod a listening to before I sold them off? I always just used the grey olives that came along with the W4s? should know better then a newbie on trying different tips/setups? in hearing things in a different manner, and uncovering what is already there?
 
the W4s where aweomse, but a little and only a very very little light  in the bass dept? and nothing that my rig could put back into the sound of them? but who would of thought, but I should have thought? that with altering the sound as it comes out from the IEM is a great place to do it from, from the source of the source of the sound, the IEM itself? not the player/source,
 
everything is a contributing factor, and I guess even more so the obscure? I have sound coming from the IEM, but even how it comes out, or whatever the sound passes thru will make a big diference, from the original file that passes thru player, and then goes to the amp/dac, to the cables it passes thru, and in the end on how/what it passes thru? not electrically, but the actual physical sound entering my ears, I guess even if we have earwax in our ears, even that will make a difference, untill it hits my eardrum,
 
and even then it has to be reprocessed back into an organic elecrtronic signal, all the way to where it has an impact on my cerebral cortex, and then goes thru even more processing? and then to finally settling into my sense of being! my spirit, my soul, and bringing me a sense of comfort, joy, and belonging, that NO other one thing can do for me on the face of the planet, that this little electronic wonder of music that I carry around with me, around my neck everywhere I go can do, hhmmm that's intersting? and you think that that's air that your breathing? hhmmm, go figure! lol,
 
anyways, damn I wish I had known this 5 days ago, maybe I wouldn't have sold them, oh well W4's, I hope the Merlins I will be getting are better still?
 
anyways Happy Listening everyone!

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! gotta love them W4s! or just gotta Love! my brother myself! Peace!

 

[JohnSantana]

Quote:

I finally get it.... you guys are basically making an "adapter" to use bigger bore tips. (sorry I did it wrong the first time you described it twinqy a week ago)
I just did the grey adapter idea and put on some tips I have (either the Senny Cx200 tips or the TF10 tips, they both looks the same).
The difference is not just a little bit. Any of those people out there bytchin that the W4 doesn't have enough bass needs to try this but it also brings out more in the lower midrange. Had my clip on shuffle and UB40 Red Wine came on. The depth of the sound of the loosely tuned snare in that song you could completely visualize (even with the synthetic echo on the mix). Cat Stevens wild world is now on. The richness of the guitar plucks......
Just made the best (universal) IEM I've ever heard even better.
Thanks guys for the tip. Gunna be toying around with this some more today.

Wow that sounds cool, can you show us which Sony hybrids and which tip that you modified to suit W4 ?

 

[JohnSantana]

Doc,
Many thanks for your guidance and sharing here, I appreciate your efforts to educate us in how to modify the tips step by steps.
 
using TS-400 ? I never knew that it is compatible with W4, because this is the website from Comply: http://www.complyfoam.com/categories/Brand/Westone%C2%AE/Westone-4/
as at now, I am using the T-100 which is the original comply foam that ships from the factory. 

 

[Spyro]

No matter how I modify a comply it still seems to veil the W4.  What I have settled on it I am taking a supplied tri-flange and cutting off the smallest top flange.  Then cut off the stem about 1-2mm less than flush of bottom flange.  It's perfect!  Obviously less bass than using a comply but it does NOT sound contrained at all.  Lots of air and treble, still open sounding.  I am using "jazz" EQ with the Ipod Classic, gain 1 with Ibasso T3.  It is surely the sweet spot for me.  I've tried everything (stock) and this is an amazing set-up.  Alternative was using modified comply with "treble booster" setting....but the former set-up just sounds more natural.
 
I'm crazy about the W4 and it's only been 3 days.  Best bass of any universal IEM I have heard.  The extension and tightness is astonishing!  It goes REALLY DEEP without the offensiveness of the W3 mid-bass sound.  Yes, it goes waaaaay deeper than W3 even though W3 seems to have more bass.  Vocals, horns guitars all sing with W4.
 
I have no desire to venture back into customs anymore.  With my synergy and set-up I prefer W4 to JH13 and can't justify JH16 at 3X the cost.  Quite frankely, my JH5 probably sounds closer to JH16 than the W4 does even though W4 is the more refined and advanced sounding IEM.  The W4 is more comfortable than any custom because the custom is much larger and engulfs the entire ear cavity rather than the ear canal (another bonus of W4).
 
SIDE NOTE: Etymotic has probably $1,500 of my money over the last decade so I am a fan and certainly respect them and their products and their customer service.  But I would pay to hear Mead Killiam's comments comparing ER4 to W4 and whether he thinks the W4 is sloppy and problematic with crossovers and so many drivers?  There is NOTHING ER4 can do that W4 can't yet W4 beats it in so many areas.  I am not trying to diss Etymotic.  I WANT them to come out with a multi-driver IEM because I know they would make a GREAT one!!!  Just  DO  IT!!!

 

[Doc-holliday]

Doc,
Many thanks for your guidance and sharing here, I appreciate your efforts to educate us in how to modify the tips step by steps.

using TS-400 ? I never knew that it is compatible with W4, because this is the website from Comply: http://www.complyfoam.com/categories/Brand/Westone%C2%AE/Westone-4/
as at now, I am using the T-100 which is the original comply foam that ships from the factory. 

Did u see the whole tutorial i just made for you!!?

The whole point is to make the hole bigger so u can use bigger bore tips!

The number is bore size. 100<200<300<400<500

Their models go 100 through 500 in sizes.

@Spyro

I completely agree with u on comply tops changing sound signifigantly. I have used them many times to reduce sparkle on lesser iems to get a desireable sound. The ts series (newer round design) however does not affect sound so much. Shorter foam barrel. Not as much material to dampen sound due to the round design. Dont know if u ever tried those. I still like them with the w4. I prefer them over the shure tips as well. Only tip i like similarly are the old style yellow shure tip but i have trouble getting a seal in one of my ears.

 

[saclet]

I just got this a week ago, but i think I don't like it. It's feel like lack of treble .

 

[Spyro]

Quote:

Did u see the whole tutorial i just made for you!!?
The whole point is to make the hole bigger so u can use bigger bore tips!
The number is bore size. 100<200<300<400<500
Their models go 100 through 500 in sizes.
@Spyro
I completely agree with u on comply tops changing sound signifigantly. I have used them many times to reduce sparkle on lesser iems to get a desireable sound. The ts series (newer round design) however does not affect sound so much. Shorter foam barrel. Not as much material to dampen sound due to the round design. Dont know if u ever tried those. I still like them with the w4. I prefer them over the shure tips as well. Only tip i like similarly are the old style yellow shure tip but i have trouble getting a seal in one of my ears.

I have those TS series "ovals" but I dont care for them.  Have tried to use on W3 and UM3X.  They are so short I think it affects soundstage to a large degree.  I really like my modded tri-flange option which has been around a few years.