Watts Up...?
Nov 29, 2021 at 5:33 AM Post #2,836 of 2,949

alxw0w

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Oh really? Did not get this one. Any more information on this?
Its going to be xM Scaler (suppose x means how many millions of taps ?)
Probably in choral range case.
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 5:37 AM Post #2,837 of 2,949

thePhones

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Maybe we need to open a speculation thread for this? Only thing he was able or allowed to tell us was that it will be more complex and have more than a million taps.
And that it will be intended for the Dave, so it will more or less look like a blu 2 (maybe without cd drive this time).
I am guessing that because the chips he needs did not evolve enough he needs to work with multible chips in series or two different chips, something like that. And I would guess that it needs at least two or three times the power to operate.
I am betting either three million taps or 1,5 million with a better algorithm.
Giving the track record of his designs it will most likely sound a lot better than the previous design because he will not release it if it does not.
If not that will be good for my bank account😄
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 5:43 AM Post #2,838 of 2,949

Hifi2jungle

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Maybe we need to open a speculation thread for this? Only thing he was able or allowed to tell us was that it will be more complex and have more than a million taps.
And that it will be intended for the Dave, so it will more or less look like a blu 2 (maybe without cd drive this time).
I am guessing that because the chips he needs did not evolve enough he needs to work with multible chips in series or two different chips, something like that. And I would guess that it needs at least two or three times the power to operate.
I am betting either three million taps or 1,5 million with a better algorithm.
Giving the track record of his designs it will most likely sound a lot better than the previous design because he will not release it if it does not.
If not that will be good for my bank account😄
For me it is important that a new product provides me with a deeper and broader soundstage through my headphones as well. When it comes to tonality, we are all there where we want to be with current mscaler. Soundstage is important.
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 6:08 AM Post #2,839 of 2,949

Kentajalli

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I have a question:
The assumption is that Chord DACs improve by number of taps, say Cutest has about 50000 taps, Hugo TT2 has 100000 taps and Dave has 165000 taps.
Ofcourse mScaler has a million.
By connecting mScaler to any of these dacs, the WTA inside the dac gets defeated in favour of the mScaler, and so do the clocks.
So why choose Dave over TT2 ? for sound quality ofcourse.
why there is no sychronous USB output on mscaler? I understand that optical and coax can't manage 768kHz, hence the need for dual BNC, but USB could?
where am I going wrong?
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 6:26 AM Post #2,840 of 2,949

thePhones

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For me it is important that a new product provides me with a deeper and broader soundstage through my headphones as well. When it comes to tonality, we are all there where we want to be with current mscaler. Soundstage is important.
I think that you will not get a massive improvement when it comes to depth. To me it translates like this: one Meter better depth with speakers is like 5cm better depth on headphones. To me timbre accuracy is also one of the most important factors. The only headphone that can (almost) completely satisfy me in this specific area is the HD800 (after EQ).
So I absolutely hope that the new m scaler also improves timbre because that is the thing that completely hypnotizes me when sitting in my chair.
I have a question:
The assumption is that Chord DACs improve by number of taps, say Cutest has about 50000 taps, Hugo TT2 has 100000 taps and Dave has 165000 taps.
Ofcourse mScaler has a million.
By connecting mScaler to any of these dacs, the WTA inside the dac gets defeated in favour of the mScaler, and so do the clocks.
So why choose Dave over TT2 ? for sound quality ofcourse.
why there is no sychronous USB output on mscaler? I understand that optical and coax can't manage 768kHz, hence the need for dual BNC, but USB could?
where am I going wrong?
Same thing as I said above. The timbre accuracy that the m scaler can bring to the surface gets destroyed by coloration. Coloration is a very strong word for a chord DAC, but every DAC has some coloration. As you go up the line the coloration gets less and less because of better analogue parts and also better filtering (there is more to it than just wta1). So the Dave sounds a lot more transparent to me than Hugo 2. And the changes in timbre I can hear with the Dave are absolutely mesmerizing.
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 6:33 AM Post #2,841 of 2,949

Kentajalli

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Same thing as I said above. The timbre accuracy that the m scaler can bring to the surface gets destroyed by coloration. Coloration is a very strong word for a chord DAC, but every DAC has some coloration. As you go up the line the coloration gets less and less because of better analogue parts and also better filtering (there is more to it than just wta1). So the Dave sounds a lot more transparent to me than Hugo 2. And the changes in timbre I can hear with the Dave are absolutely mesmerizing.
Is that Dave with mscaler vs Hugo2 TT with mscaler?
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 7:09 AM Post #2,842 of 2,949

thePhones

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Is that Dave with mscaler vs Hugo2 TT with mscaler?
No, I meant Hugo 2. TT2 sounds like a warmer smoother more refined Hugo 2 but is not at the Dave level in my opinion. But I would take TT2 if you listen to a lot of not so perfect recordings because it is just a little bit more forgiving. A too fat or too lean recording is very apparent on Dave.
There was one specific recording I always heard with Hugo 2 which I found just a bit to fat (in the upper bass) but it was still ok. With Dave it is very obviously too fat in that region.
 
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Nov 29, 2021 at 7:11 AM Post #2,843 of 2,949

Kentajalli

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No, I meant Hugo 2. TT2 sounds like a warmer smoother more refined Hugo 2 but is not at the Dave level in my opinion. But I would take TT2 if you listen to a lot of not so perfect recordings because it is just a little bit more forgiving. A too fat or too lean recording is very apparent on Dave.
I see, but if you read my question again, you will see that I was not comparing the dacs as they are, but rather what they would be with an mscaler.
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 7:35 AM Post #2,844 of 2,949

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Nov 29, 2021 at 7:40 AM Post #2,845 of 2,949

thePhones

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I see, but if you read my question again, you will see that I was not comparing the dacs as they are, but rather what they would be with an mscaler.
Yes, I heard the Hugo 2 with mscaler for two years and now Dave with mscaler for a year
 
Nov 29, 2021 at 10:45 AM Post #2,846 of 2,949

548184

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Hi @Rob Watts,

I have a few last questions for 2021. Pre-pandemic, did you have an audio "go bag" since you are a frequent flyer?

If so, what were the contents of the bag? ["Hugo2", "HMS", "DCA Noire", "PowerAdd", "MSI Laptop", "KabelDirekt optical cable"]? Anything I'm missing or need correcting? Any specialized audio tools?

Will you be upgrading to the DCA Stealth? It seems like a natural progression since it's a DCA + Closed-Back.

https://danclarkaudio.com/dcastealth.html

You have a nice price/performance baseline for your home setup [TT2/HMS + SC cables + 803D]. It will be interesting if your new price/performance baseline for your travel setup will be [TT2/HMS or Hugo2/HMS + DCA Stealth]?

The products you allow to enter into your ecosystem may influence some of our purchasing decisions on non-Chord gear. If somehow we end up with the exact same chain, it gives us a better understanding when you share impressions.

A RW-approved thumbs up chain is something we will have confidence is absolutely correct minus the subjective tuning. The home setup is already a great example, now I'm wondering if the travel setup will evolve or stay put?
 
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Nov 29, 2021 at 11:10 AM Post #2,848 of 2,949

Christer

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I think that you will not get a massive improvement when it comes to depth. To me it translates like this: one Meter better depth with speakers is like 5cm better depth on headphones. To me timbre accuracy is also one of the most important factors. The only headphone that can (almost) completely satisfy me in this specific area is the HD800 (after EQ).
So I absolutely hope that the new m scaler also improves timbre because that is the thing that completely hypnotizes me when sitting in my chair.

Same thing as I said above. The timbre accuracy that the m scaler can bring to the surface gets destroyed by coloration. Coloration is a very strong word for a chord DAC, but every DAC has some coloration. As you go up the line the coloration gets less and less because of better analogue parts and also better filtering (there is more to it than just wta1). So the Dave sounds a lot more transparent to me than Hugo 2. And the changes in timbre I can hear with the Dave are absolutely mesmerizing.
I tend to agree on all points you make here and I am also still suprised how well the HD800 holds up against many much more expensive newcomers.

I am still on and off using my old battered HD800 pair that I bought on recommendation from a classical recording engineer after having heard it at some of his actual recording sessions.
To be quite honest he now also uses electrostatic headphones at sessions.

My HD800 with Dekoni pads sounding its best and most transparent with a silver cable and is timbrally still very accurate after all these years.
I bought my pair in 2009.
With both acoustic instruments and the human voice when well recorded it is still up there among the best value for money, headphones I have ever auditioned.
I change headphones between my HD 800 and my HEKV2 with an OFC cable dependent on recordings.
I would not say no to a Susvara if it wasn´t so ridiculously expensive.
But nowadays most of my music listening is via my big electrostatic speakers, not headphones.

Regarding all these speculations of new Chord products from Rob Watts my bet is still firmly first Mojo 2, and then later an Mscaler X.
And my guess there is that X actually stands for the number 10 ie 10 m taps.

Also knowing that the guys behind PGGB have stated that they needed to employ 30 M taps! to rival the orginal Mscaler with 1 M taps,unless Rob has some very secret sauce to add, 10 M taps or more is what I suspect from Mscaler X.

Meanwhile I am very happy with my Mscaler/Qutest still reasonably affordable combo,and the sacrifices it involves compared to the even better but imho, VERY overpriced Dave/Mscaler.
Whatever else Chord has coming is of very limited interest for me personally . I only use Chord dacs and the Mscaler for Robs tech.

Cheers CC
 
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Nov 29, 2021 at 11:22 AM Post #2,849 of 2,949

548184

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...this is one of the scariest posts I've ever read. Subjectively speaking, of course.

Yes, I can see how that could be misinterpreted. Nothing is absolutely correct but I trust the 4 decades of RW experience on his pairings. The 803D and Noire are not absolutely correct. But with his extensive experience, they are "correct" for him. I try to balance what Audiophiles/Hobbyists gravitate towards versus Producers of Audio not Consumers of Audio. I'm interested in how Professionals choose their gear as "correct" may differ from Audiophile's "correct". Professionals are a different breed. Especially a passionate professional with 40 years of experience.

That's why I trust his Science on LPS, etc. He has extensively researched the fundamentals of LPS for decades. But there will always be Anti-Science folks that don't trust the Science. I trust due to respecting his research and thus his pairings are more on the "correct" side of things due to extensive experience. But yeah, nothing's perfect or absolutely correct.

Audiophiles are going to rationalize, "Hey, My LPS is different. Not all LPS are the same". "It sounds magnitudes better with an LPS".

No thanks, I'll trust the professional with 40 years of experience. Professionals are a different breed. I'll trust the doctors versus the redditors giving out medical advice.
 
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Nov 29, 2021 at 12:09 PM Post #2,850 of 2,949

The Jester

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I tend to agree on all points you make here and I am also still suprised how well the HD800 holds up against many much more expensive newcomers.

I am still on and off using my old battered HD800 pair that I bought on recommendation from a classical recording engineer after having heard it at some of his actual recording sessions.
To be quite honest he now also uses electrostatic headphones at sessions.

My HD800 with Dekoni pads sounding its best and most transparent with a silver cable and is timbrally still very accurate after all these years.
I bought my pair in 2009.
With both acoustic instruments and the human voice when well recorded it is still up there among the best value for money, headphones I have ever auditioned.
I change headphones between my HD 800 and my HEKV2 with an OFC cable dependent on recordings.
I would not say no to a Susvara if it wasn´t so ridiculously expensive.
But nowadays most of my music listening is via my big electrostatic speakers, not headphones.

Regarding all these speculations of new Chord products from Rob Watts my bet is still firmly first Mojo 2, and then later an Mscaler X.
And my guess there is that X actually stands for the number 10 ie 10 m taps.

Also knowing that the guys behind PGGB have stated that they needed to employ 30 M taps! to rival the orginal Mscaler with 1 M taps,unless Rob has some very secret sauce to add, 10 M taps or more is what I suspect from Mscaler X.

Meanwhile I am very happy with my Mscaler/Qutest still reasonably affordable combo,and the sacrifices it involves compared to the even better but imho, VERY overpriced Dave/Mscaler.
Whatever else Chord has coming is of very limited interest for me personally . I only use Chord dacs and the Mscaler for Robs tech.

Cheers CC
I’m with you on that one, the Qutest/MScaler duo is hard to beat at its price point, interesting that more and more taps gets closer and closer to the ideal reconstruction, but that’s one thing good analogue recorded Vinyl doesn’t have to worry about, it wasn’t “deconstructed” in the first place, sure there are other limitations in the format but by the resurgence in Vinyl sales lately it’s still doing enough things “right” to make an attractive alternative,
Maybe Rob’s Davina project will change that ?.
 
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