Watts Up...?
Aug 23, 2021 at 11:44 AM Post #2,611 of 2,868

Kentajalli

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For fun:
Take Voyager spacecraft.
It is millions of miles away, with a tiny 22W transmitter built 45 years ago, has managed to send error free digital signal to earth from outer reaches of the solar system, in spite of cosmic rays, solar winds freely roaming space between itself and Earth, not to mention an atmosphere jam full of every kind of RFI !
How? did it use good cables ? NO.
It used a simple error correction code system (Reed-Solomon designed in early 1960's) similar to what Sony-Philips used in the design of humble CD.
 
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Aug 23, 2021 at 11:47 AM Post #2,612 of 2,868

griff500

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Aug 23, 2021 at 11:54 AM Post #2,613 of 2,868

griff500

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Analogue by its very definition is a variable signal that is dependant on the original, as voltage goes up in original, voltage will go up at the other end.
Digital is not that!
Digital is a pure square pulse, that is either present (1) or not present (0), it does not vary accordingly.
Any noise on the pulse is ignored by receiver - only its existance is monitored, there could be a Britney Spears song piggy back on it, it won't matter - extreme case is when that noise becomes as big as the pulse, then data gets lost! because there are handshakes between transmitter and receiver and there are error correction codes involved - basically extreme noise and degradation does not spice up the data, it turns it into error, which will be detected.
In case of USB transmission, as well as data connections, there is a constant 5V supply line, which can carry noise, not to digital sections, but it can leak into analogue sections.
Mojo (I believe) is the only Chord DAC that does not have isolation on its USB input. Otherwise manufacturers isolate the possibly nois 5V lines from the rest of the system.
BUT! audiophile ethernet cable is in a league of its own, at such prices - it needs a documentary to be made for TV ( sorry sarcasm just oozes out of me).
You seem to be making the mistake of thinking that this is about data getting lost or corrupted. It's not just about ones and zeros. Perhaps you think it is.

I'm not sure there's any point in discussing this further. You have your point of view and I've heard a difference.
 
Aug 23, 2021 at 3:32 PM Post #2,614 of 2,868

kennyb123

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Digital signals resemble a square wave, whereas analog signals resemble a sine wave. The consequence of this is that bad impedance matching will result in signal reflections in the cable, which may be problematic for the equipment on either end, but in basic terms, deforms the signal.
I’m not disagreeing with you. Quite the opposite. I’m just saying that Shunyata’s approach will achieve this to a better degree than Belkin as it is my impression that they go beyond the spec.
 
Aug 23, 2021 at 9:28 PM Post #2,615 of 2,868

DJJEZ

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@Rob Watts are you able to confirm your working on a new M-scaler?
 
Aug 24, 2021 at 5:01 AM Post #2,616 of 2,868

Rob Watts

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Aug 24, 2021 at 12:35 PM Post #2,620 of 2,868

thePhones

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I had previously disclosed that much more complex M scalers is something I am working on
Just give me a pm one month before it comes out so I can sell my M scaler for a good price…already sold a kidney for Dave so that is not an option anymore…
Jokes aside, awesome to hear you are optimistic that there is still potential for even more natural music representation.
I have not recovered from my last M-Dave music session with decca recordings. Doctor says if I just put the m scaler in passthrough it will eventually get better…😁
 
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Aug 24, 2021 at 1:29 PM Post #2,621 of 2,868

kennyb123

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These new M Scalers are planned to be compatible with other DACs (via USB or i2s) or this tech is intended to stay Chord-only with dBNC interface?
That’s an excellent question. There are more DACs appearing that support 16FS over USB. There’s even one that’s $500 (DacMagic 200M).

I don’t have the quote handy but I do recall Rob saying that USB would have been possible but it would have delayed getting the HMS into people’s hands.

For me, the hope for USB is more about the cost of 2 BNC cables vs 1 USB cable.
 
Aug 24, 2021 at 1:42 PM Post #2,622 of 2,868

Jawed

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These new M Scalers are planned to be compatible with other DACs (via USB or i2s) or this tech is intended to stay Chord-only with dBNC interface?
Rob was, at one point, intrigued by the capabilities of the latest optical fibre systems for connecting audio components. We can see from devices such as:

https://audiowise-canada.myshopify.com/products/dx-optical-isolation-kit

that it's not especially expensive. Hopefully Rob will consider at least making optical an option in addition to dual-BNC.

Dual-BNC, in general, should provide the ability to link an M Scaler that's 5 or 10m away from each digital power DAC. This could be a common setup when each one is really close to the speaker its driving. Doing that with USB or ordinary electrical I²s could be a lot more tricky. An optical connection should easily match a BNC connection.
I'm still hopeful that Rob will aim to go beyond 16FS with WTA1. 32 or 64FS. Or 256FS :beerchug:

Rob uses dual-BNC because a single BNC won't work, so for WTA1 that's higher than 16FS it seems like optical or USB are the only options. Optical looks like it would be far easier to implement.

Rob should be close to having a working Davina. From that he should have a clearer idea of the size of the gulf between M-scaled 44.1KHz that was down-sampled from his 705.6KHz original, and the original 705.6KHz. Hopefully soon we'll hear from Rob about his experiments and find out just how urgently Rob wants to build M Scaler 2.
 
Aug 24, 2021 at 6:08 PM Post #2,623 of 2,868

kennyb123

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Hopefully Rob will consider at least making optical an option in addition to dual-BNC.

That would be awesome as long as optical is found at both ends - with maybe a future DAVE 2 and TT3 supporting it as well.
 
Aug 25, 2021 at 5:16 AM Post #2,625 of 2,868

Jawed

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Thrilling news Rob! It's so exciting to hear that major tangible progress is just over the horizon!
 

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