[Peter Pinna]

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Monkey /img/forum/go_quote.gif ^ Pinna, what equipment are you using these days? I note that you still have not updated your profile.

Give me a few weeks to get back to you on this. I'm doing some investigating currently. I mean I'm attempting to find the time to listen to equipment. I sold my old amp that had a built in dedicated headphone amp because I realized there is much better out there now. In studios, I still use the 750's which, btw, is probably a very good place for them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif This statement shows that your first instinct is to compare tonalities. Nothing bad about that since that is what most people including me first listen to. You didn't mention realistic/organic sounding instruments though which was the original argument just a few posts ago I can only conclude from reading this that you probably never listened to how accurate the timbres of each instrument sounds in acoustic recordings with both of these cans compared. Pls correct me if I'm wrong, this is just my assumption which I want corrected if mistaken.

No, not at exactly the same time. I have heard the K701's and oddly enough when I noticed that the Pro 750's sounded so similar (compared to the sound of the live instruements) to me, there was a pair of K 701's close by but I didn't think to do that. I have listened to the same recordings using both phones and have always thought the Proline 750's produced the more "natural" sound but I'll have to compare both phones on a recording which I will be involved in to compare timbres. One thing I know I like better about the Pro 750 is the lower end. But, sometime, I will compare both on other instruments as you have suggested
Actually, from what I've been told I really want to do a comparison between the Ed 9 and the Stax 02 ml. I haven't heard either. There is a utilitarian advantage to the Pro line but I'm beginning to believe (based on what I've read and heard ) that the Ed 9 or Stax sounds better.

 

[Peter Pinna]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif You're not wrong at all... I call it, flat FR cans. As balanced FR headphones. You call it, realistic/organic sounding. The headphones can be realistic and organic only if they are flat FR, or balance FR. Pls correct me if I'm wrong...

Acix,
This issue is kind of confusing. I have found that Kwkarth does an excellent job of explaining about "flat" EQ'd headphones. Actually, there really aren't any "flat" EQ'd headphones. There are however headphones that sound "flat". I know that's confusing but write to Kwkarth. I could try to explain it but I think he gives a better explanation.

 

[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif Acix, This issue is kind of confusing. I have found that Kwkarth does an excellent job of explaining about "flat" EQ'd headphones. Actually, there really aren't any "flat" EQ'd headphones. There are however headphones that sound "flat". I know that's confusing but write to Kwkarth. I could try to explain it but I think he gives a better explanation.

The term Flat sounding and having a Flat Frequency Response are two different things altogether.

Flat sounding just means a lifeless sound that lacks dynamics and emotion. A flat frequency response however contributes to having a neutral sound. This applies to speakers, amps, microphones, etc... but not entirely for headphones. I say not entirely since we still base on a flat response to begin with then factor in human HRTF for the "translator" as I call it so that we think that the sound we hear on our headphones are projected from real sounds outside the headphones. A flat response will yield a direct sound. It will sound like all the instruments are coming directly from the headphones instead of a simulated natural space outside of it.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif Acix, This issue is kind of confusing.

Peter,
It's very simple, if you work on a song with Pro 750, the result will be song with more, or a lot of bass. You will take this song that you made with the pro 750 and listen to it on different systems you will find mostly that is still have a lot of bass or just boomy... (+2db on the bass side of the moon)

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif A flat response will yield a direct sound. It will sound like all the instruments are coming directly from the headphones instead of a simulated natural space outside of it.

Not necessarily...

"A flat frequency response however contributes to having a neutral sound".

First come first,
If you master once, you'll have better chance to master the second time.

 

[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif Peter, It's very simple, if you work on a song with Pro 750, the result will be song with more, or a lot of bass. You will take this song that you made with the pro 750 and listen to it on different systems you will find mostly that is still have a lot of bass or just boomy... (+2db on the bass side of the moon)

Acix, quite the opposite. If you work on a song using the k701 for example, you might get a recording with more bass because you compensated for the 701s lack of bass with the eq. In the end, you will get a bassy recording when played back on the average home system. A bassy headphone used for mastering will get you a less bassy recording since you tend to eq it with less bass... etc.... so its really all about knowing how to predict the results with the monitors you use for mastering.

But Acix, what does this have to do with Flat response and flat sounding?

 

[Kees]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Pinna /img/forum/go_quote.gif What would you say the color of the seats on airplane were?

The same colour red as the bus seats, only green.

 

[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif "A flat frequency response however contributes to having a neutral sound".

Like I said that is true, but in headphones we have hrtf to deal with. You have to research on that. If that was true for headphones, it would be so easy to get the sound right for all manufacturers. Remember headphones are a controlled environment without any room acoustic problems. It has its own internal acoustics but it will be very similar for every user. Since that is so, it is probably very easy for manufacturers to make a ruler flat response from their reference headphones... But NO, they do not do that because of hrtf variables.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif quite the opposite.

Hehehee,

NO lack of bass on the 702's... They are very bassy, But not boomy!!!
Boomy As a boost on the Eq, like on 3 band EQ...

 

[donunus]

To put it in a more simple analogy.

Acix and Donunus listens to a live band playing. Acix records it!
Donunus has a badass speaker setup to play the music Acix recorded. Acix and Donunus listens to the recording via the speakers and both agree that it sounds correct! Acix and donunus listens to the same recording via some so called accurate headphones. Acix says it sounds correct. Donunus says it sounds like dog poop

Why is that? They both agreed on the speakers...

The moral of the story? Acix and donunus has different shapes of ears. An accurate sounding headphone for Acix could be shyte for Donunus and vice versa due to this thing we call HRTF.

Note: Personal taste did not play a part here because Acix and Donunus were both listening to the original performance and the badass speaker's reproduction at the same time agreeing in its accuracy.

Hehehehe

 

[donunus]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hehehee, NO lack of bass on the 702's... They are very bassy, But not boomy!!! Boomy As a boost on the Eq, like on 3 band EQ...

oh, well that wasn't really the point.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus /img/forum/go_quote.gif Acix, quite the opposite. If you work on a song using the k701 for example, you might get a recording with more bass because you compensated for the 701s lack of bass with the eq. In the end, you will get a bassy recording when played back on the average home system. A bassy headphone used for mastering will get you a less bassy recording since you tend to eq it with less bass... etc.... so its really all about knowing how to predict the results with the monitors you use for mastering.

Two glasses full of water, they are both 10 cm tall.

Glass one, 3 cm wide.
Glass two, 5 cm wide.

Which glass have more water?

 

[donunus]

you never said if any of them were full of water

hehehe whats the point?

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif The same colour red as the bus seats, only green.

This bus have no driver, and only one pair of cans...

 

[donunus]

you also didnt say if the glasses were cylindrcal in shape or what hehehehe. You have a funny way of changing the topic