[439598]

Holy macaroni, Acke!
What an amazing franken-mod!

Are you able to figure the I2S signal lines from D50's USB XMOS to the DAC chip? I noticed I2S markings on some test pad.
Perhaps a great mod to upgrade the USB input is to franken-mod it with Luckit WaveIO as the USB receiver, and output I2S to D50 (or UDA).

It looks like the UDA uses OS-CON caps for the DAC chip. This is part of the magic. Lampizator's old site and DIYaudio is full of amazing mods to replace digital circuit caps with OS-CONs. Perhaps if space allows, replaceing D50's DAC chip caps with OSCONS could bring it closer to UDA's sound as well.

IS2 mods look possible, I was thinking about taking the IS2 signal from D50 XMOS chip to the 9038Pro in the UDA to see how the Interface is influencing sound but didnt bother, almost everything is clearly marked with a test pad in the D50 so there is endless potential for mods. Im thinking about upgrading DAC clock next, or replacing output opamp with a more powerful amplifier, enough to power headphones directly, it may be a simple as taking the input of that op amp directly to a headphone amp, that is if the signal doesn't need too much gain.

I didnt know about OSCON caps and that they could be an influencing sound, they looked just like normal electrolytics, this could be the next step in modding. The D50 DAC chips have very small ceramic caps, I was thinking about replacing them with PP caps but they are a lot buliker for the same capacitance, OSCONs could give a huge boost to capacitance in a small package. could you share a link to those mods?

 

[andrewinukm]

My concern is what happens to the 5V coming through the USB cable when you use an external supply.

The D50 must be powered by an external 5V power supply (USB charger, LPS, iPower, etc), and you can block this 5V on the USB. It is not required for the D50 to be operational. Nothing happens to the USB 5V or DAC when it is cut off.

You may or may not hear an improvement after blocking the 5V from USB. I'm not sure what I heard after blocking the 5V is placebo or not, the difference is too small. Note that ISO Regen also blocks 5V and supplies a cleaner 5V, so the difference for my setup is really too minor. If you're not using a USB filter, you may hear a bigger improvement.

IS2 mods look possible, I was thinking about taking the IS2 signal from D50 XMOS chip to the 9038Pro in the UDA to see how the Interface is influencing sound but didnt bother, almost everything is clearly marked with a test pad in the D50 so there is endless potential for mods. Im thinking about upgrading DAC clock next, or replacing output opamp with a more powerful amplifier, enough to power headphones directly, it may be a simple as taking the input of that op amp directly to a headphone amp, that is if the signal doesn't need too much gain.

I didnt know about OSCON caps and that they could be an influencing sound, they looked just like normal electrolytics, this could be the next step in modding. The D50 DAC chips have very small ceramic caps, I was thinking about replacing them with PP caps but they are a lot buliker for the same capacitance, OSCONs could give a huge boost to capacitance in a small package. could you share a link to those mods?

The colour of the caps looks like Panasonic OSCON's... so I'm guessing those are OSCON's. I think an mod would be to upgrade the 470uF power supply caps to OSCON, Sikorels ,or Mundorf.

http://www.lampizator.eu/lampizator/REFERENCES/DAC Four_TDA/fourTDA_dac.html
http://lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/TRANSPORT/behringer/Behringer.html
http://lampizator.eu/LAMPIZATOR/TRANSPORT/behringer/Ultracurve/Ultracurve.html

You could also search DIYaudio for OSCON and DAC, should have lots of discussions going on there.
Just note that OSCON is good for digital, but most feedback didn't find it good for analogue stage or amps.

*Sanyo was bought by Panasonic years ago, so Panasonic now makes OSCON.

 

[BrotherKathos]

The best improvement I've gotten from the D50 as been using a usb to spdif converter. I've tried just using a ifi idefender to break the ground and get rid of power noise from the usb, but that did not really make any differences in sound quality to me. The Eitr does make an apparent difference. It takes some of the edge or glare off the D50 and gives it just a tad more bass definition. It also makes the music seem more spacious which is a product I'm guessing of it taking the treble edge down a bit. But this has also made me discover another point in regards to price vs performance. For the money I think people would be better off getting a $99 schiit modi 3 and the $179 eitr than getting a $250 d50 and then paying $50 or more on power supplies. You get better sound for the money out of the modi 3 and eitr than a D50 with ifi ipower in my experience.

 

[DjBobby]

The best improvement I've gotten from the D50 as been using a usb to spdif converter. I've tried just using a ifi idefender to break the ground and get rid of power noise from the usb, but that did not really make any differences in sound quality to me. The Eitr does make an apparent difference. It takes some of the edge or glare off the D50 and gives it just a tad more bass definition. It also makes the music seem more spacious which is a product I'm guessing of it taking the treble edge down a bit. But this has also made me discover another point in regards to price vs performance. For the money I think people would be better off getting a $99 schiit modi 3 and the $179 eitr than getting a $250 d50 and then paying $50 or more on power supplies. You get better sound for the money out of the modi 3 and eitr than a D50 with ifi ipower in my experience.

So basically you think that D50's edginess and glare is coming from insufficient power supply filtering?
I have power noise when using iMac and Macbook connected to the AC outlet. However with the Macbook run on battery it is silent, the same applies for the iPad. Unfortunately the edginess and fatiguing treble glare stay the same.

 

[BrotherKathos]

So basically you think that D50's edginess and glare is coming from insufficient power supply filtering?
I have power noise when using iMac and Macbook connected to the AC outlet. However with the Macbook run on battery it is silent, the same applies for the iPad. Unfortunately the edginess and fatiguing treble glare stay the same.

I think the glare is from the usb interface. The Eitr smooths it out and makes the D50 much better for long sessions. The power supply is not a large enough factor imo to make a significant audible difference. At least I can't notice that much of a change when I use a 5v apple power supply or the ifi ipower.

 

[DjBobby]

I think the glare is from the usb interface. The Eitr smooths it out and makes the D50 much better for long sessions. The power supply is not a large enough factor imo to make a significant audible difference. At least I can't notice that much of a change when I use a 5v apple power supply or the ifi ipower.

As I have seen that you have the SMSL M9 as well, which is right now on Massdrop for really crazy price of $139.99, could you please compare the D50 with the M9? Thanks.

 

[BrotherKathos]

As I have seen that you have the SMSL M9 as well, which is right now on Massdrop for really crazy price of $139.99, could you please compare the D50 with the M9? Thanks.

That was a pre emptive addition to my profile hehe. Waiting on that $140 drop

Couldn't pass that one up, but I'll definitely give a comparison when I get it, but if you are interested that is probably the best deal going on a dac right now. I can't imagine the smsl sounding worse than my modi 3 which also uses the akm 4490 but 2 instead of the modi 3's single chip. The SMSL might also have a slightly better spdif processor as well.

 

[BrotherKathos]

I seem to prefer Akm dacs to sabre ones though in my experience. My Audioengine D1 is nice when using the rca outs as a dac. Very smooth presentation, just a bit quirky sometimes depending on windows updates.

 

[DjBobby]

That was a pre emptive addition to my profile hehe. Waiting on that $140 drop

Couldn't pass that one up, but I'll definitely give a comparison when I get it, but if you are interested that is probably the best deal going on a dac right now. I can't imagine the smsl sounding worse than my modi 3 which also uses the akm 4490 but 2 instead of the modi 3's single chip. The SMSL might also have a slightly better spdif processor as well.

Ok, let's wait then, I've joined the drop as 4th or 5th, I think .
What about the SU-8, also pre-emptive?

 

[BrotherKathos]

Ok, let's wait then, I've joined the drop as 4th or 5th I think .
What about the SU-8, also pre-emptive?

All the rest I have in hand. The SU-8 is a little bit brighter than my D50, while also having bigger sound stage and slightly punchier bass. This is when using balanced outs on my THX AAA 789 amp vs the D50 using rca outs on same amp. I prefer the D50 to the SMSL on that amp. Its less dynamic, but smoother.

 

[spacequeen7]

The best improvement I've gotten from the D50 as been using a usb to spdif converter. I've tried just using a ifi idefender to break the ground and get rid of power noise from the usb, but that did not really make any differences in sound quality to me. The Eitr does make an apparent difference. It takes some of the edge or glare off the D50 and gives it just a tad more bass definition. It also makes the music seem more spacious which is a product I'm guessing of it taking the treble edge down a bit. But this has also made me discover another point in regards to price vs performance. For the money I think people would be better off getting a $99 schiit modi 3 and the $179 eitr than getting a $250 d50 and then paying $50 or more on power supplies. You get better sound for the money out of the modi 3 and eitr than a D50 with ifi ipower in my experience.

Hi BrotherK
Long time D50 owner ,I have tried a lot and then some ,since you seem to have a ground loop I would suggest 3-Pin Male XLR to RCA adapter and some good interconnects like this
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Neutrik-NA2MPMF-Adapter-3-Pin-Male-XLR-to-RCA-Jack-Ret/322547596938?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
https://www.ebay.com/itm/RCA-Quad-Shield-RG-6-Coax-Audio-Video-Cable-75-Ohm-with-Solid-Copper-Center/272081601891?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&var=570891560793&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
P.S. imho I think Eitr?,I return it within one day ,try good Toslink cable /Flac or Tidal
Cheers

 

[BrotherKathos]

Hi BrotherK
Long time D50 owner ,I have tried a lot and then some ,since you seem to have a ground loop I would suggest 3-Pin Male XLR to RCA adapter and some good interconnects like this
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Neutrik-NA2MPMF-Adapter-3-Pin-Male-XLR-to-RCA-Jack-Ret/322547596938?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
https://www.ebay.com/itm/RCA-Quad-Shield-RG-6-Coax-Audio-Video-Cable-75-Ohm-with-Solid-Copper-Center/272081601891?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&var=570891560793&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
P.S. imho I think Eitr?,I return it within one day ,try good Toslink cable /Flac or Tidal
Cheers

Thanks for the reply and advice! I might have confused some with my posts so I will clarify. I don't have any audible ground noise issues. I was just stating my experience on what improves the sound quality of the D50. The eitr in my experience is not snake oil. The ifi idefender 3.0 is a ground eliminator and it did not make any significant changes to sound when I used it with the D50. It might have made the sq a tiny bit better, but the difference is so small I can't rule out expectation bias. The eitr is a differernt story however. It makes noticeable changes to the sound quality that I immediately picked up on like reducing treble sharpness or 'glare', and improving bass definition. I've also had similar experiences using usb to toslink like you said to try earlier by using my emotiva big ego as a usb to toslink with a very short 6inch wireworld cable, but the change is not as apparent as the eitr while being slightly more than using the idefender 3.0. I pretty much only listen to high quality flac and tidal now as well, so the quality of the recording should not be an issue, although there are still bad recordings out there for example many michael jackson albums are pretty much trash. The remastered Bad album is much better than original and I wish the others could be cleaned up a bit as they are overcooked imo. Alan parsons Albums do not have that issue! That dude knows how to mix an Album

Great on Tidal

 

[Vosya]

In general, it’s somewhat strange for me to read categorical comments in isolation from the driver version of the DAC, the settings and the version of the operating system, audio-rendering data path, selected FIR-filter at DAC. Each of these components makes a significant contribution to the final sound. Often no less than changing the DAC.

 

[DjBobby]

In general, it’s somewhat strange for me to read categorical comments in isolation from the driver version of the DAC, the settings and the version of the operating system, audio-rendering data path, selected FIR-filter at DAC. Each of these components makes a significant contribution to the final sound. Often no less than changing the DAC.

I am using latest macOS Mojave 10.14.2, so no drivers issues for me. There are no drivers for Mac, all dacs are plug-and-play.
On the software side using Audirvana 3+ in exclusive mode, bit perfect, bypassing macOS core.
At the moment I am set on slow linear filter No. 4, as it is the only bearable one.
Regarding your statement about the "categorical comments", I don't remember anybody claimed here anything "categorical", only subjective and personal experiences and opinions. As for my opinion, I am not categorical but still open to change my mind for the better if anything could be done. In the meantime my personal and subjective opinion about the D50 is that it sounds hard, fatiguing and metallic as compared to all my other dacs, daps and several CD players. I would be certainly much happier if I could claim that this is best-buy and that this dac is best bang for buck out there, right at the moment, for my own money spent, I can't.
Still, I can imagine that for some other setups and musical tastes D50 could score better.

 

[BrotherKathos]

I am using latest macOS Mojave 10.14.2, so no drivers issues for me. There are no drivers for Mac, all dacs are plug-and-play.
On the software side using Audirvana 3+ in exclusive mode, bit perfect, bypassing macOS core.
At the moment I am set on slow linear filter No. 4, as it is the only bearable one.
Regarding your statement about the "categorical comments", I don't remember anybody claimed here anything "categorical", only subjective and personal experiences and opinions. As for my opinion, I am not categorical but still open to change my mind for the better if anything could be done. In the meantime my personal and subjective opinion about the D50 is that it sounds hard, fatiguing and metallic as compared to all my other dacs, daps and several CD players. I would be certainly much happier if I could claim that this is best-buy and that this dac is best bang for buck out there, right at the moment, for my own money spent, I can't.
Still, I can imagine that for some other setups and musical tastes D50 could score better.

I think you would really like the modi 3 and eitr combo. The modi 3 has a softer signature than the D50 and basically equals it in most measurements and beats it in imd. The addition of the eitr beats the D50's stock configutation hands down in sq imo for only a $30 increase in overall price as well.