[Varmintbaby]

Hi there guys. i would really love you advice. let me talk about my setup first.

Right now i play my flac files that are stored in my pc, through an asus xonar ds. signal goes to my console ( Behringer xenyx x2222) and from there to my sansui au 717 intergrated amp. speakers are diy floorstanders and are amazing and really hi end.
Obviously you will laugh at my sound card. It is high time i got it upgraded. i would have done that ages ago, but the real upgrade to my system (the speakers) are less than a month old, so...).

I have set my mind and will buy a xonar essence stx or stx ii. used. from what i read in this forum, stx ii should be better (better clock etc). But what about upgraded stx and upgraded stx ii. which would be better? hence my post

firstly let me say that is almost no way that i will use the headphone out of the card. my headphones are stuck in the console where i control all my other equipment. drums laptop etc etc. and i dont care about listening to music through phones.
My pc will just be hooked through the rca outpout of the card, to my console.

Secondly and most importantly, what id like to achieve with the card id choose and its mods (mainly upgrading the op amps), is to achieve a neutral signal going out of the sound card. i dont want any freq band exagerated Like a u or v smile, no roll off etc. i want a neutral signature. soundcard should feed my console (which then connects to the amp) without coloring the sound. i want to hear to music and not my equipments. (as much as it possibly can happen because nothoing is 100% neutral).

i said these things because id like to ask you guys what op amps id be better of using. after reading many threads and pages here, i think i do not want to go with the bursons. high price and i read some problems especially with the 5i. also i am not convinced that they are neutral. to the contrary. that is not a bad thing for many people. id like to steer to a different direction.

apart for a suggestion of which of the 2 sound cards i should choose and which op amps i should get, id also like to ask this.
should i change all 3 of them? or just the buffer one since i wont use headphone out? in this forum i run into 2 posts one claiming i should change just the buffer op amp, and the other i should change all three, since rca use all 3 of them.
Also i read the byffer op amp could be different to the other 2.

any other easy upgrade? clock needs soldering etc which i cant to so i am steering out of this. unless it is THAT crucial so pehaps id send it to an electrician to upgrade it. any advice on what i am getting for a clock instead?
what about I/V conversion op amps. is it easy to change these? should i do it?

in conclusion what would be the most value for money upgrade? changing just the 3 op amps (or less since i only care about rca) and be done with it? and which should these be for a neutral sound signature? and should i go for stc or stx ii? would the "better" clock in stx ii be worth the around 50 euros difference in price in ebay? and finally, is there any issue with uni drivers? should i prefer stx over stxii (or vice versa) due to driver support?
thank you

I would suggest getting the STX II and upgrading the op amps. I know you said you don't think you want Bursons, but they really are the best op amps. They don't "color' the sound really. You get the sound the way the audio engineer mastering the track wanted you to. As long as you don't use the EQ that comes with the driver software, it will be reference high quality sound. I have 3 V5s but you could also try the V6 classics or V6 Vivids. I can only attest to the greatness of the V5s though. You will need to replace all 3. Headphones is just the 2 I/V and the RCA out is all 3. You won't regret getting this sound card. I have some $90 monitors sitting on my desk and paired with the V5 op amps they sound amazing. My wife even commented on how good the sound was and she's not all into gadgets and electronics like me. I use my HD6xx headphones most of the time to avoid disturbing my wife and neighbors, but when I can crank up my speakers they are awesome also. I can't recommend the STX II with Burson amps enough. It has sound quality to setups 3-4x it's price. Good luck my friend!

 

[BURNIN AMBITION]

thank you very much my friend!!!!! this is greatly useful info!!!

 

[ManuLM]

hey BURNIN AMBITION,
sorry but I can't help to think you just ran into a Burson salesman... don't be angry with me Varmintbaby, but your vocabulary is all emotional plus the typical pitch that sounds so deja vu (the wife thing, the 3-4x it's price, sorry but I have been reading this a million times, feels like paid publishing), and nothing about the essence of making a great audio card (not a word on high output voltage, driving the OA with better / cleaner source voltage ... you name it, this forum has a million experts that are around for a long time).
STX II no doubt will sound good with Bursons, but not like a million times better than stock STX II without any serious tweaking not necessarily involving Bursons.
I'm being a bit straight here, but I think someone has to spread a doubt on such posts... amd I am tired of such posts

 

[BURNIN AMBITION]

thank you ManuLM for pointing this out. it is never bad to have 2 different opinions about the same thing. in audio, there is never black or white. so all opinions are dully noted. have i made my mind yet on the path i choose? obviously not. but your post is helpful. cheers

 

[Varmintbaby]

hey BURNIN AMBITION,
sorry but I can't help to think you just ran into a Burson salesman... don't be angry with me Varmintbaby, but your vocabulary is all emotional plus the typical pitch that sounds so deja vu (the wife thing, the 3-4x it's price, sorry but I have been reading this a million times, feels like paid publishing), and nothing about the essence of making a great audio card (not a word on high output voltage, driving the OA with better / cleaner source voltage ... you name it, this forum has a million experts that are around for a long time).
STX II no doubt will sound good with Bursons, but not like a million times better than stock STX II without any serious tweaking not necessarily involving Bursons.
I'm being a bit straight here, but I think someone has to spread a doubt on such posts... amd I am tired of such posts

Actually I'm not a Burson salesman, I work for a medical company as IT support.

 

[Varmintbaby]

thank you ManuLM for pointing this out. it is never bad to have 2 different opinions about the same thing. in audio, there is never black or white. so all opinions are dully noted. have i made my mind yet on the path i choose? obviously not. but your post is helpful. cheers

That was the response of a miserable

thank you ManuLM for pointing this out. it is never bad to have 2 different opinions about the same thing. in audio, there is never black or white. so all opinions are dully noted. have i made my mind yet on the path i choose? obviously not. but your post is helpful. cheers

I wouldn't pay much attention to that guy, for someone whose so tired of reading other peoples opinions, he doesn't have the intellect to stop going to message boards or turn off his computer.

 

[bcschmerker4]

Hi there guys. i would really love you advice. let me talk about my setup first.

Right now i play my flac files that are stored in my pc, through an asus xonar ds. signal goes to my console ( Behringer xenyx x2222) and from there to my sansui au 717 intergrated amp. speakers are diy floorstanders and are amazing and really hi end.
Obviously you will laugh at my sound card. It is high time i got it upgraded. i would have done that ages ago, but the real upgrade to my system (the speakers) are less than a month old, so...).

I have set my mind and will buy a xonar essence stx or stx ii. used. from what i read in this forum, stx ii should be better (better clock etc). But what about upgraded stx and upgraded stx ii. which would be better? hence my post

firstly let me say that is almost no way that i will use the headphone out of the card. my headphones are stuck in the console where i control all my other equipment. drums laptop etc etc. and i dont care about listening to music through phones.
My pc will just be hooked through the rca outpout of the card, to my console.

Secondly and most importantly, what id like to achieve with the card id choose and its mods (mainly upgrading the op amps), is to achieve a neutral signal going out of the sound card. i dont want any freq band exagerated Like a u or v smile, no roll off etc. i want a neutral signature. soundcard should feed my console (which then connects to the amp) without coloring the sound. i want to hear to music and not my equipments. (as much as it possibly can happen because nothoing is 100% neutral).

i said these things because id like to ask you guys what op amps id be better of using. after reading many threads and pages here, i think i do not want to go with the bursons. high price and i read some problems especially with the 5i. also i am not convinced that they are neutral. to the contrary. that is not a bad thing for many people. id like to steer to a different direction.

apart for a suggestion of which of the 2 sound cards i should choose and which op amps i should get, id also like to ask this.
should i change all 3 of them? or just the buffer one since i wont use headphone out? in this forum i run into 2 posts one claiming i should change just the buffer op amp, and the other i should change all three, since rca use all 3 of them.
Also i read the byffer op amp could be different to the other 2.

any other easy upgrade? clock needs soldering etc which i cant to so i am steering out of this. unless it is THAT crucial so pehaps id send it to an electrician to upgrade it. any advice on what i am getting for a clock instead?
what about I/V conversion op amps. is it easy to change these? should i do it?

in conclusion what would be the most value for money upgrade? changing just the 3 op amps (or less since i only care about rca) and be done with it? and which should these be for a neutral sound signature? and should i go for stc or stx ii? would the "better" clock in stx ii be worth the around 50 euros difference in price in ebay? and finally, is there any issue with uni drivers? should i prefer stx over stxii (or vice versa) due to driver support?
thank you

@BURNIN AMBITION XONAR® DS™? Sounds as though ye need the original XONAR® Essence™ ST™, which uses the same legacy PCI 2.2 slot interface as your existing DS. The STX II™ is designed to bring the expandability of the original ST to current systems with available PCIe x1 slots; it will not retrofit to legacy PCI.

 

[BURNIN AMBITION]

@BURNIN AMBITION XONAR® DS™? Sounds as though ye need the original XONAR® Essence™ ST™, which uses the same legacy PCI 2.2 slot interface as your existing DS. The STX II™ is designed to bring the expandability of the original ST to current systems with available PCIe x1 slots; it will not retrofit to legacy PCI.

i do have pcie available in my pv, so no problems here. thank you

 

[ManuLM]

thank you ManuLM for pointing this out. it is never bad to have 2 different opinions about the same thing. in audio, there is never black or white. so all opinions are dully noted. have i made my mind yet on the path i choose? obviously not. but your post is helpful. cheers

No worries, I see message got accross... There are plenty of suggestions on this very thread for STX tweaking.

Actually I'm not a Burson salesman, I work for a medical company as IT support.

I think everyone will be able to appreciate your ability to take a step back and realize how you consider other opinions... and manage to announce out of 3 months on HeadFi the "best" setup for the Asus sound card that has been discussed for years
Keep your enthusiam, get more humble man (and polite). This is a gentlemen discussion forum. Keep it this way or go somewhere else ...

 

[PurpleAngel]

Hi there guys. i would really love you advice. let me talk about my setup first.
Right now i play my flac files that are stored in my pc, through an asus xonar ds. signal goes to my console ( Behringer xenyx x2222) and from there to my sansui au 717 integrated amp. speakers are diy floorstanders and are amazing and really hi end.
Obviously you will laugh at my sound card. It is high time i got it upgraded. i would have done that ages ago, but the real upgrade to my system (the speakers) are less than a month old, so...).
I have set my mind and will buy a xonar essence stx or stx ii. used. from what i read in this forum, stx ii should be better (better clock etc). But what about upgraded stx and upgraded stx ii. which would be better? hence my post
in conclusion what would be the most value for money upgrade? changing just the 3 op amps (or less since i only care about rca) and be done with it? and which should these be for a neutral sound signature? and should i go for stc or stx ii? would the "better" clock in stx ii be worth the around 50 euros difference in price in ebay? and finally, is there any issue with uni drivers? should i prefer stx over stxii (or vice versa) due to driver support? thank you

Unless you need the features of a sound card, it might be better to replace the Xonar DS with an external DAC (USB or optical).
Like the Topping D50 DAC?

 

[BURNIN AMBITION]

Unless you need the features of a sound card, it might be better to replace the Xonar DS with an external DAC (USB or optical).
Like the Topping D50 DAC?

hmmmm not a bad suggestion. well, i thought of an internal card so that everything would fit in my pc box and would be neat. but if i connect pc with external dac perhaps that is a nice option indeed. wouldnt know where to start or what characteristics the external dac should have. will check the topping for starters. thank you my friend for suggesting something different. it is a viable option....

 

[jBEVIA]

Hi, ASUS GTX II, I do not use headphones, I use rca or optical output for speakers. To improve loudspeaker sound is it necessary to change the three op amps? or can you change only one, because I understand that the two twins are for headphones? what kind of burson you advise me for a few treble a little brighter V5 or V6 Thank you.

 

[fredeb]

According to the Asus opamp swapping guide : " Modifying OP A,B and C will change the tonal quality of RCA outputs, while modifying OP A and B changes the tonal quality of 1/4” Headphone output. "

https://dlcdnets.asus.com/pub/ASUS/...ar_Essence_STX_OPamp_swapping_instruction.zip

 

[raoultrifan]

It's all about the added harmonics (a bit more THD), phase delay and frequency roll-off. Great devices that are able to change the sound could be found here: https://www.thomann.de/gb/spl_psychoacoustic_effects.html.

I strongly recommend doing RMAA or ARTA tests prior and after opamp change, for a better understanding of what is changing in the output sound. Here a "visible" and audible difference when changing NE5532 with MUSES01 (originals!): https://www.head-fi.org/threads/asu...-dac-cebit-2011.542563/page-236#post-14799061. As you can see, a 18dB higher 2nd harmonic will make the sound to be more...melodious, while few dB difference in harmonics between the two channels will increase the soundstage.

My personal thoughts: with NE5532 (or perhaps with the better OPA1612) the sound will be more similar with what the recording studio intended to be, while adding euphonic opamps (MUSES01/02/03, Sparkos, Burson SS etc.) will make the sound to be more...melodious/warm/musical. It's all about a personal choice after all.

 

[Moses4188]

It's all about the added harmonics (a bit more THD), phase delay and frequency roll-off. Great devices that are able to change the sound could be found here: https://www.thomann.de/gb/spl_psychoacoustic_effects.html.

I strongly recommend doing RMAA or ARTA tests prior and after opamp change, for a better understanding of what is changing in the output sound. Here a "visible" and audible difference when changing NE5532 with MUSES01 (originals!): https://www.head-fi.org/threads/asu...-dac-cebit-2011.542563/page-236#post-14799061. As you can see, a 18dB higher 2nd harmonic will make the sound to be more...melodious, while few dB difference in harmonics between the two channels will increase the soundstage.

My personal thoughts: with NE5532 (or perhaps with the better OPA1612) the sound will be more similar with what the recording studio intended to be, while adding euphonic opamps (MUSES01/02/03, Sparkos, Burson SS etc.) will make the sound to be more...melodious/warm/musical. It's all about a personal choice after all.

So I would like to ask You what is the best choice for the as much as possible neutral sound? I was thinking about the Burson V5i Duals but it looks like they're just more an eyecatcher than actually accurate. What is the top of the tops possible?