[Ciggavelli]

I would say the kgssHV made be a good builder like Mjolnir , would be a nice addition to your arsenal without breaking the bank. $2k~ used, possibly even get lucky and find a mini one which has all the power but tiny footprint for the desktop area.
No warmup needed, zero noise floor. Will give you 85-90% of the Carbon juice and does well with the older Stax models like the 007/LNS/omega.

Wish these were still in stock.

That might be something to consider. Thanks!

Part of me thinks estats are really nice, but another part thinks they might not even be worth the trouble. I go round and round in my head about getting out of estats completely and using that money for a super high end dac. If the Shang Sr didn’t have such an unbelievably high resolution and realism, I don’t know if I’d stay in estats. It’s just the bass achilles heel problem with stats compared to traditional headphones is hard to ignore at times. Not even the T2 can fix it (I tired it at a friend’s place as well as at Can Jam NYC). It’s the reason I got out of the SR1a world too. The CRBN, X9K and 007 are better at bass than my Shang Sr, but they don’t do the other parts of the FR as well for my tastes. Maybe a new amp can help, but I might just be trying to fix a problem that is unfixable. My musical genre tastes are evolving as a get older, so maybe bass won’t be as big of an issue in the future for me (my two most listened to genres are metal and hip-hop, but I’m getting more into jazz, rock and indie lately).

 

[heatsink]

It’s interesting that there is so much variation.

Well, there isn't, quantively speaking.

 

[Chefguru]

That might be something to consider. Thanks!

Part of me thinks estats are really nice, but another part thinks they might not even be worth the trouble. I go round and round in my head about getting out of estats completely and using that money for a super high end dac. If the Shang Sr didn’t have such an unbelievably high resolution and realism, I don’t know if I’d stay in estats. It’s just the bass achilles heel problem with stats compared to traditional headphones is hard to ignore at times. Not even the T2 can fix it (I tired it at a friend’s place as well as at Can Jam NYC). It’s the reason I got out of the SR1a world too. The CRBN, X9K and 007 are better at bass than my Shang Sr, but they don’t do the other parts of the FR as well for my tastes. Maybe a new amp can help, but I might just be trying to fix a problem that is unfixable. My musical genre tastes are evolving as a get older, so maybe bass won’t be as big of an issue in the future for me (my two most listened to genres are metal and hip-hop, but I’m getting more into jazz, rock and indie lately).

This is the summit forum and all, and most feel that estats are in that arena of thing … because they are for sure … but I also think most of what’s happening now is over kill. Like sure you can do a Shang Sr/T2 (25+k) or a x9000/GC (30k) or what would be my pick with a sr-omega on a circlotron (30k)… or sure HE-1 at 60k…But it’s imo not the beauty of what’s available.

I’ve heard almost all of the top KG amps.
There’s a lot more simplicity and affordable pockets than people realize.

For example I think something like the lambda nova signature on the kgsshv (total combo at $2.5-3k) is going to destroy anything in the planar/dynamic world at the same price point.

A 007 71xxx (at 2k~) off a Carbon (3.5-5k) is right up there as a tier 1 all time system.

Similarly x9000 can run off a Novem
or a 009 off a bhse.

These are all really great respectable systems and decent price points.

 

[Ciggavelli]

This is the summit forum and all, and most feel that estats are in that arena of thing … because they are for sure … but I also think most of what’s happening now is over kill. Like sure you can do a Shang Sr/T2 (25+k) or a x9000/GC (30k) or what would be my pick with a sr-omega on a circlotron (30k)… or sure HE-1 at 60k…But it’s imo not the beauty of what’s available.

I’ve heard almost all of the top KG amps.
There’s a lot more simplicity and affordable pockets than people realize.

For example I think something like the lambda nova signature on the kgsshv (total combo at $2.5-3k) is going to destroy anything in the planar/dynamic world at the same price point.

A 007 71xxx (at 2k~) off a Carbon (3.5-5k) is right up there as a tier 1 all time system.

Similarly x9000 can run off a Novem
or a 009 off a bhse.

These are all really great respectable systems and decent price points.

I hear you, and I think you’re mostly right. But at this point in my journey, I’m looking for that overkill setup that wows me. My baseline is my TC setup, and I can’t find anything better, or haven’t yet, but I’m still searching. Maybe it’s chasing the dragon and there’s nothing better for my tastes, but I still look. I liked the HE-1, but I didn’t necessarily think it was better than my TC setup (I’d love to hear them side by side though). Ideally, I want Shang Sr resolution and highs with TC bass. The HE-1 is close, but the resolution isn’t as high as the Shang. Maybe I should just be happy with my TC setup and call it a day, but I guess I enjoy the chase. It’s just getting harder and harder to impress me with anything nowadays. I don’t really even know how to make my TC setup better, but I just bought a CFA3 to see what that’s about. I’ll use my WA33 and/or 3ES as a preamp. I don’t know what could be better, but I think it could be. That’s why I’m looking at new dacs. I don’t even know if a new dac would make a meaningful difference either (I’ve been trying to audition for a while, but it’s hard where I live). I don’t want to believe I’ve reached a plateau, but maybe I have. Maybe headphones can’t really get that much better for me. Maybe I need to get into speakers like others have said, but they are not convenient, and they cost a hell of a lot more potentially.

 

[alota]

That might be something to consider. Thanks!

Part of me thinks estats are really nice, but another part thinks they might not even be worth the trouble. I go round and round in my head about getting out of estats completely and using that money for a super high end dac. If the Shang Sr didn’t have such an unbelievably high resolution and realism, I don’t know if I’d stay in estats. It’s just the bass achilles heel problem with stats compared to traditional headphones is hard to ignore at times. Not even the T2 can fix it (I tired it at a friend’s place as well as at Can Jam NYC). It’s the reason I got out of the SR1a world too. The CRBN, X9K and 007 are better at bass than my Shang Sr, but they don’t do the other parts of the FR as well for my tastes. Maybe a new amp can help, but I might just be trying to fix a problem that is unfixable. My musical genre tastes are evolving as a get older, so maybe bass won’t be as big of an issue in the future for me (my two most listened to genres are metal and hip-hop, but I’m getting more into jazz, rock and indie lately).

I do not have and never had stuffs like yours. But same impressions about bass. But it is missed the impact because the bass exists and it is extended. With the age(52) more and more i prefere this type ofreproductiont

 

[Ciggavelli]

I do not have and never had stuffs like yours. But same impressions about bass. But it is missed the impact because the bass exists and it is extended. With the age(52) more and more i prefere this type ofreproductiont

I think for me it’s the quantity. I don’t care about impact that much. The Shang has bass and sub bass, it exists unlike with the sub bass on the SR1a. I just want more quantity

 

[alota]

I think for me it’s the quantity. I don’t care about impact that much. The Shang has bass and sub bass, it exists unlike with the sub bass on the SR1a. I just want more quantity

Differents words but yes. More quantity. I understand...

 

[oneguy]

Well, there isn't, quantively speaking.

I’ve never measured headphone but there is definitely a difference beyond any placebo effect. I went into the back-to-back Sigma listening with no preconceived notions and I immediately heard a difference. I went into the back-to-back 007 listening expecting to hear something similar since they are both mk1’s to my 71xxx but it ended up being closer to the sound of the SZ2/KGGG pairing.

I know someone with 3 Omegas and even with that short production run he hears differences between them.

 

[number1sixerfan]

Now that I've tried the 007mk1, I kinda want to try the 009 finally. There are quite a few used ones on eBay. Is there a consensus about the 009 vs 009s, in terms of which one is better?

It's a toss up consensus wise, I'd just go for whichever you can grab. But the 009 and 007 are love or hate headphones for most people, so I would just give them a try regardless of any recommendations.

And like you noted, the 007 is fun, and pretty good, but doesn't really surpass some of the more modern, updated stats imo. And if your amp stood up to the Grand Cayman and T2, I would imagine it's powering the 007 just fine. But yes, generally speaking, they do transform when powered properly.

 

[mulveling]

The 009 and 009S are pretty close to each other in the grand scheme of things, so yeah you could just grab what's a good deal first. Seems to be a buyer's market in either case, but especially 009! I still love the 009 best of all headphones, and still have my 2 pairs, for almost 10 years now They need tubes lol.
007 Mk 1 (two of them), 009S, ES1a all parted ways here after (at most) a couple years. That ES1a was really sweet on a KGSShv though - great value. Similar touch of warmth as the 009S.

 

[Sandro Sena]

I'm a fan of ear speakers (K1000, Sr1a, mySphere, Stax-Sigma), I consider them to be superior for the type of music I listen to, recognizing, of course, their flaws, there's no such thing as a perfect transducer. Periodically, the possibility of selling the BHSE + SR-009 combo enters my horizon, so I listen to it and fall in love with them all over again, I apologize to this deity for having had these heretical thoughts, and I promise that they will stay with me until I die. The 009 model is monumentally underrated, in my opinion.

 

[mulveling]

I'm a fan of ear speakers (K1000, Sr1a, mySphere, Stax-Sigma), I consider them to be superior for the type of music I listen to, recognizing, of course, their flaws, there's no such thing as a perfect transducer. Periodically, the possibility of selling the BHSE + SR-009 combo enters my horizon, so I listen to it and fall in love with them all over again, I apologize to this deity for having had these heretical thoughts, and I promise that they will stay with me until I die. The 009 model is monumentally underrated, in my opinion.

Oh man, that's my been my life for far too long. The constant struggle between thinking I'm finally ready to sell something, then giving it that "one last listen, just to check it out" and falling in love again lol. I've had to really focus on getting better about that. I came close to being buried alive in fine audio gear, and am finally starting to dig out of that sad state.

Now you've made me miss the BHSE all over again

 

[draytonklammer]

The 009 and 009S are pretty close to each other in the grand scheme of things, so yeah you could just grab what's a good deal first. Seems to be a buyer's market in either case, but especially 009! I still love the 009 best of all headphones, and still have my 2 pairs, for almost 10 years now They need tubes lol.
007 Mk 1 (two of them), 009S, ES1a all parted ways here after (at most) a couple years. That ES1a was really sweet on a KGSShv though - great value. Similar touch of warmth as the 009S.

You're really tempting me to grab the 009.

 

[timb5881]

Over on our favorite audio review site, they measured the Stax 006, 007, 323, and the Koss ES/10. What makes me curious is how high the distortion is on the tube models is compared to the solid state. But as we all know measurements really do not tell the whole story. Does the ccs mod reduce this? How many have compared the tube models to the solid state? And for Birgir, how is the distortion on your designs?

 

[Chefguru]

I hear you, and I think you’re mostly right. But at this point in my journey, I’m looking for that overkill setup that wows me. My baseline is my TC setup, and I can’t find anything better, or haven’t yet, but I’m still searching. Maybe it’s chasing the dragon and there’s nothing better for my tastes, but I still look. I liked the HE-1, but I didn’t necessarily think it was better than my TC setup (I’d love to hear them side by side though). Ideally, I want Shang Sr resolution and highs with TC bass. The HE-1 is close, but the resolution isn’t as high as the Shang. Maybe I should just be happy with my TC setup and call it a day, but I guess I enjoy the chase. It’s just getting harder and harder to impress me with anything nowadays. I don’t really even know how to make my TC setup better, but I just bought a CFA3 to see what that’s about. I’ll use my WA33 and/or 3ES as a preamp. I don’t know what could be better, but I think it could be. That’s why I’m looking at new dacs. I don’t even know if a new dac would make a meaningful difference either (I’ve been trying to audition for a while, but it’s hard where I live). I don’t want to believe I’ve reached a plateau, but maybe I have. Maybe headphones can’t really get that much better for me. Maybe I need to get into speakers like others have said, but they are not convenient, and they cost a hell of a lot more potentially.

Part of the reason the TC and a few other planars were even made is because of the technical low end advantages. Hopefully eventually there will be a tech catch up on the estat side but I doubt it

If you want to keep searching for greatness my thoughts would be:

1) 007 seems to vary a lot and you should probably buy 2-3 of them (70xxx-71xxx) since they’re relatively affordable. I’m glad I took the time to do it because my 712xx is endgame (sold off my x9k).

2) sr-omega is worth the quest if you’re at this level of money. It’s got more bass than the x9k or the Sr and the neutral “lifelike” qualities of other headphones from that era.

3) the Kevin Gilmore ciclotron should have even more bass output than the T2. I believe only Soren has been able to build one without killing himself. It’s more powerful than even the Carbon cc.