The Stax Thread III
Jan 12, 2017 at 2:08 AM Post #10,906 of 25,565
No. My 717 doesn't drive the 007 as well as it does the L700. I would imagine the 353x would be no different. Budget for a serious amp with a 007, otherwise, stick with what you have, or try the L700. You'll need a serious source too, if you don't have one already. Sadly, high-end 'stats are a whole 'nother ball game. The good news is that the L700 does well enough to make one rethink the need to upgrade. Not sure about the L500, never heard it.

 
Agree, listening to the 007 mk 1 on the SRD x pro sounds muddy, but details are still there. The Sr-lambda 1979 sound better on the SRD x.
 
Jan 12, 2017 at 8:43 AM Post #10,907 of 25,565
  Hi All
 
Hoping someone might be able to give me a bit of advice/insight. Currently got a Stax SRM 353x amp and L500 headphones. I've been thinking about upgrading lately and would like to give the SR 007 Mk2 a try when I'm away next month as there's no dealers near me. Before I go down the route of looking more seriously though is my current amp going to be sufficient for the 007's? Long term I know it wouldn't be the best pairing and I do plan to upgrade down the track just trying to space out the cost a bit. 
 
Thanks for any help


Well, again it's going to vary depending on what you listen to, how loudly you listen, how sensitive you are to amp differences, etc.  For example, Kevin Gilmore stated at one point that the 323 (predecessor to the 353), was the best stock Stax amp for 007s, better than the 007T or the unmoved 727, although he thought the discontinued 717 was better.  One of my friends who is very discriminating, is driving his 007 Mk Is with a Stax T1, which has less grunt than a 353, but he doesn't listen at very high levels.  If you're sensitive to solid state nasties the 007 phones will make you more aware of them, but not everyone is.  And some people don't hear much difference between amps in general.  Without knowing you it's hard to say how much of a difference it will make for you.  But, technically, will put out 400V RMS so it will go within 1 dB of the most powerful Stax amps, within 2-3 dB of the Blue Hawaii, and within 4-5 dB of the T2, which is the most powerful (and unobtainium) stat amp around.
 
Jan 12, 2017 at 4:13 PM Post #10,908 of 25,565
No. My 717 doesn't drive the 007 as well as it does the L700. I would imagine the 353x would be no different. Budget for a serious amp with a 007, otherwise, stick with what you have, or try the L700. You'll need a serious source too, if you don't have one already. Sadly, high-end 'stats are a whole 'nother ball game. The good news is that the L700 does well enough to make one rethink the need to upgrade. Not sure about the L500, never heard it.

 
I did have a feeling that this may be the case. Currently using a Schiit Gungnir MB. Can't say I've heard the L700 so can't really compare either unfortunately.
 
 
Well, again it's going to vary depending on what you listen to, how loudly you listen, how sensitive you are to amp differences, etc.  For example, Kevin Gilmore stated at one point that the 323 (predecessor to the 353), was the best stock Stax amp for 007s, better than the 007T or the unmoved 727, although he thought the discontinued 717 was better.  One of my friends who is very discriminating, is driving his 007 Mk Is with a Stax T1, which has less grunt than a 353, but he doesn't listen at very high levels.  If you're sensitive to solid state nasties the 007 phones will make you more aware of them, but not everyone is.  And some people don't hear much difference between amps in general.  Without knowing you it's hard to say how much of a difference it will make for you.  But, technically, will put out 400V RMS so it will go within 1 dB of the most powerful Stax amps, within 2-3 dB of the Blue Hawaii, and within 4-5 dB of the T2, which is the most powerful (and unobtainium) stat amp around.

I listen to a pretty big variety at the moment, a lot of which is EDM as well which has me thinking in itself am I heading down the right path with Stax but when I switch things up music wise which I find myself wanting to do more and more to just listen to something new. I still struggle to describe what I hear/terminology just know when I'm enjoying. Volume wise I don't feel I listen overly loud, only usually need to go to about 2 on the volume and that's more than enough. Or this could be loud, not sure how that compares to others
 
Mainly just worried about what others said above that they are going to sound muddy, but as you say everyone is different so maybe best bet is to see if I can try a set with my current amp. 
 
Blue Hawaii and KGSS HV seem to be the most common recommendations I see around, is there anything else around that would do the 007s justice? How does the KGSS mini hold up?
 
Thanks again for any help
 
Jan 12, 2017 at 11:48 PM Post #10,910 of 25,565
As a rough categorization, from best to worst, the top category would include:  DIY T2, BHSE and KGSS Carbon.  Which one is top depends on who is doing the ranking.  The majority feel the DIY T2 is tops but it is unobtanium unless you build your own.  Some rank the KGSS Carbon with the BHSE, some rank it with the T2, some prefer the BHSE to the Carbon, but it should be noted that the number of people who have expressed a comparative opinion is in the single digits.  HeadAmp builds the BHSE and there are people that are building KGSS Carbons for sale.  Also occasionally a Blue Hawaii built by a private builder comes up for sale.
 
One step down would be the KGSSHV and KGST - there are builders of these and occasionally a used one comes up on sale), and perhaps the SRX Plus (DIY only).  The SRX Plus is the least powerful of these by a couple dB, but may be preferred if you like tubes over transistors.
 
Next step down would be the KGSS, the Woo GES, and below that would be the various Stax amps - 727, 717, 007, 006 and T1.  The 727 is felt to not be a good match for the SR007 without a minor modification to convert it to having global feedback.  The Stax amps are actually very good circuits - for example the KGST is topologically similar to the T1/006/007 but with a more powerful output tube and constant current loads, the KGSS is said to be topologically similar to the 717 and the KGSSHV is said to be topologically similar to the 727 with global feedback.  The Stax amps are also limited by having passive power supplies whereas all the KG designs have regulated power supplies, as does the SRX Plus.  Note that all the KG designs are also DIY, and if you are willing and able to do so you can save a good deal of money.
 
Some other amps are the Cavilli Liquid Lightning, Woo WES and Ray Samuels A10.  I'm not quite sure where these fit into my categories above, but there are reviews of these plus the BHSE on the InnerFidelity website.
 
To give you another perspective, here is a quote from darth nut in 2003.  He wrote one of the first and most thorough reviews of the Omega II (aka SR007 Mk I), and he owns an original Stax T2 amplifier. 

"To put the T2 in perspective, the move from a Lambda to Omega II is a bigger jump than a move from [SRM-]007t to T2.
 
If I had to choose between (404 + T2) and (Omega II + 007t), I would choose (Omega II + 007t).
 
This is not so much a criticism of the T2, as it is a credit to the Omega II, which gets the sound so correct in so many ways. The T2 is a refinement along the same lines, whereas the Omega II is different enough a creature from the Lambdas.
 
I just don't want you to have undue expectations of the T2. You have to be aware of shrinking returns when you get so high up the price : performance curve. The T2 is truly more transparent than the 007t, but look at the price difference.
 
There are many Omega II owners in this board, and I must say you guys are not missing something spectacularly different by not having a T2. The Omega II is still the core strength of your system. This is the plain simple truth, man."

 
Jan 13, 2017 at 6:50 AM Post #10,911 of 25,565
  Agree, listening to the 007 mk 1 on the SRD x pro sounds muddy, but details are still there. The Sr-lambda 1979 sound better on the SRD x.

 
I may be right alone with this opinion, but this is because the 007 is way too dark in stock form. You can use a BHSE or similar amp, but even then... it's matter of taste. For mine, I needed to do a lot of experimenting to make it sound more open (see the mods thread), and amp was only one aspect.
 
The SR-Lambda is indeed more open. However, the 007 still gets music "more right". The other good sounding Lambdas (Sig, LE, L700) are still Lambdas in their character. The 009 is a tad "too open" if I may say so. When I can do with a little bit of the deepest bass away, I prefer my slightly modded (pads, damping) Gamma Pro over all these. For instance, with the latter, cello has a body that is just right, even on my modded 007 it sounds less real tonality (though sound stage is better on the 007), and that applies to other acoustic instruments as well. That being said, the Lambdas mentioned before may be better for having a single headphone, and also a stock 007 Mk2 or 007A is probably preferable, depending on your music preferences.
 
Jan 13, 2017 at 8:37 AM Post #10,912 of 25,565
Whoops, forgot one, the Megatron - DIY only.  It seems to be in the same category as the BHSE, Carbon and T2, runs a tad warm as it uses eight (!) EL34 output tubes which consume 80 watts in filament power alone.  Doubles as a room heater. 
biggrin.gif

 
Jan 13, 2017 at 3:39 PM Post #10,913 of 25,565
He wrote one of the first and most thorough reviews of the Omega II (aka SR007 Mk I), and he owns an original Stax T2 amplifier. 
"To put the T2 in perspective, the move from a Lambda to Omega II is a bigger jump than a move from [SRM-]007t to T2.
 
If I had to choose between (404 + T2) and (Omega II + 007t), I would choose (Omega II + 007t).
 
This is not so much a criticism of the T2, as it is a credit to the Omega II, which gets the sound so correct in so many ways. The T2 is a refinement along the same lines, whereas the Omega II is different enough a creature from the Lambdas.
 
I just don't want you to have undue expectations of the T2. You have to be aware of shrinking returns when you get so high up the price : performance curve. The T2 is truly more transparent than the 007t, but look at the price difference.
 
There are many Omega II owners in this board, and I must say you guys are not missing something spectacularly different by not having a T2. The Omega II is still the core strength of your system. This is the plain simple truth, man."

I'd hypothesize the DIY-T2 to be a different beast from the SRM-T2 in light of the significantly different/superior power supply. I have had the opportunity to compare the DIY-T2 to the HeadAmp BHSE and KGSSHV Carbon and while the latter two are roughly comparable, the T2 evokes significantly stronger enjoyment for me personally.
 
FWIW I'm speaking mainly of the SR-Omega here. The HE90 did not respond as well, though you might be interested to know that I enjoyed what I heard of it out of the SRX-Plus. 
normal_smile .gif

 
I do agree with the general idea that the transducer is the most significant component. Most of us have a preference for a specific Lambda, Omega or Sennheiser stat model and that favoritism tends to be amp-invariant (e.g. I prefer SR-Omega + 323S over 007 + anything).
Has anyone heard from Stax USA in the past 6 weeks? If so please contact me

Would appreciate knowing if someone has managed to get ahold of them too. I tried to reach out to them in December regarding some obscure screws but never received a reply, even after several emails.
 
Jan 13, 2017 at 6:27 PM Post #10,914 of 25,565
  I'd hypothesize the DIY-T2 to be a different beast from the SRM-T2 in light of the significantly different/superior power supply. I have had the opportunity to compare the DIY-T2 to the HeadAmp BHSE and KGSSHV Carbon and while the latter two are roughly comparable, the T2 evokes significantly stronger enjoyment for me personally.
 
FWIW I'm speaking mainly of the SR-Omega here. The HE90 did not respond as well, though you might be interested to know that I enjoyed what I heard of it out of the SRX-Plus. 
normal_smile%20.gif

 
I do agree with the general idea that the transducer is the most significant component. Most of us have a preference for a specific Lambda, Omega or Sennheiser stat model and that favoritism tends to be amp-invariant (e.g. I prefer SR-Omega + 323S over 007 + anything).

Well, I don't want to get too much into the woods here, especially with amps I've never heard, but I would expect the DIY T2 to be a refinement of the T2 in terms of sound,  Of course on a practical basis it is significantly better at heat management, long term durability, etc.  
 
At the Albuquerque Head-Fi meet last year I heard a very interesting demonstration of the effect of different power supplies on a micro-ZOTL, and yes, the better power supply sounded better. Now the T2 has a lot of current sources in its design which should help isolate the circuit from power supply effects, and I vaguely remember seeing an old comment from Kevin Gilmore that the T2 DIY sounded pretty much identical to the original T2 except for lack of hum, however I haven't been able to locate that comment.
 
Thanks for your comments about the SRX Plus.  I give most of the credit to the engineers at Stax who designed to original circuit - my mods just ensure that it is working in the optimum fashion.  And of course, it formed the basis for your T2 circuit by replacing the coupling capacitors with a whole bunch of parts to allow it to be DC coupled from input to output.
 
Jan 13, 2017 at 10:13 PM Post #10,915 of 25,565
I'd hypothesize the DIY-T2 to be a different beast from the SRM-T2 in light of the significantly different/superior power supply. I have had the opportunity to compare the DIY-T2 to the HeadAmp BHSE and KGSSHV Carbon and while the latter two are roughly comparable, the T2 evokes significantly stronger enjoyment for me personally.

FWIW I'm speaking mainly of the SR-Omega here. The HE90 did not respond as well, though you might be interested to know that I enjoyed what I heard of it out of the SRX-Plus. 
normal_smile%20.gif


I do agree with the general idea that the transducer is the most significant component. Most of us have a preference for a specific Lambda, Omega or Sennheiser stat model and that favoritism tends to be amp-invariant (e.g. I prefer SR-Omega + 323S over 007 + anything).
Would appreciate knowing if someone has managed to get ahold of them too. I tried to reach out to them in December regarding some obscure screws but never received a reply, even after several emails.


I have the DIYT2 and the HE90 and Omega I as well, I think I prefer the HE90 with the DIYT2. Probably a matter of preferences.

Driving the SR009, the DIYT2 does a much better job than the SRM 007t I had. I sold the 007t the day I had it and bought a KGSSHV.
 
Jan 14, 2017 at 1:54 AM Post #10,916 of 25,565

 
I got my SRM-007t today.
I thought that I can convert it to 220V as it has voltage selector on its back panel....
But I found out two screws that hold metal plate are very different from ordinary screws.
Never had this kind of problem when using SRM-313 and SRM-1 MK2 with voltage jumper on their back panel.
Is there any way to get rid of this screws?
Well I also wonder if these things are really screws...
 
Jan 14, 2017 at 3:14 AM Post #10,917 of 25,565
Personally, I'd just manhandle them off with a pair of vice grips and replace them with normal screws of the same size. They're M4 full thread IIRC. Check your other older amps, they should be the same. If you want to take them off the right way, one of those cheap chinese all-in-one screwdrivers with the funky bits is only about $5.
 
But before all that, take off the top and make sure it's not rivited and also that it's not such a new model that they cut the transformer leads for alternate voltages.
 
Jan 14, 2017 at 8:34 AM Post #10,918 of 25,565
 
 
I got my SRM-007t today.
I thought that I can convert it to 220V as it has voltage selector on its back panel....
But I found out two screws that hold metal plate are very different from ordinary screws.
Never had this kind of problem when using SRM-313 and SRM-1 MK2 with voltage jumper on their back panel.
Is there any way to get rid of this screws?
Well I also wonder if these things are really screws...


How much did you pay for that amp?
 
Jan 14, 2017 at 2:00 PM Post #10,919 of 25,565
I have the DIYT2 and the HE90 and Omega I as well, I think I prefer the HE90 with the DIYT2. Probably a matter of preferences.

IMHO the HE90's strength is with classical music -- a genre I don't listen to very often.
 
What I meant to say though was that going from BHSE -> DIY-T2, I found a substantial improvement for the SR-Omega but not so much for the HE90.
 
Jan 17, 2017 at 12:01 PM Post #10,920 of 25,565
my srm-007t has phillips head screws.  worth noting that my version is a stock 117v version, not a 100w like yours.
 
Quote:
 
 
I got my SRM-007t today.
I thought that I can convert it to 220V as it has voltage selector on its back panel....
But I found out two screws that hold metal plate are very different from ordinary screws.
Never had this kind of problem when using SRM-313 and SRM-1 MK2 with voltage jumper on their back panel.
Is there any way to get rid of this screws?
Well I also wonder if these things are really screws...

 

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