[Vitaly2017]

In my opinion its the worse idea ever to reshell a custom iem and plus of that its not done by the official brand. This definitely will end up sounding not what it was supposed to as start.

At that pace better buy the demo u18s....

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

In my opinion its the worse idea ever to reshell a custom iem and plus of that its not done by the official brand. This definitely will end up sounding not what it was supposed to as start.

At that pace better buy the demo u18s....

You are probably right, but it may be even worse than that. I was listening to a podcast with Crinacle who stated outright that the 64 Audio custom IEMs measure quite a bit differently than the Universal models and in his opinion the measurements were worse. I have no idea if that is true, but when an important person like him makes that type of statement and you learn that you can never resell a custom IEM, that makes it a really unattractive alternative. I've mentioned this before, but I was thinking about taking another crack at it since a sale came up. I guess the best path still is to go Universal and if universal tips don't work, then get custom tips.

 

[GiullianSN]

You are probably right, but it may be even worse than that. I was listening to a podcast with Crinacle who stated outright that the 64 Audio custom IEMs measure quite a bit differently than the Universal models and in his opinion the measurements were worse. I have no idea if that is true, but when an important person like him makes that type of statement and you learn that you can never resell a custom IEM, that makes it a really unattractive alternative. I've mentioned this before, but I was thinking about taking another crack at it since a sale came up. I guess the best path still is to go Universal and if universal tips don't work, then get custom tips.

But we need to be careful with those kind of statements. Customs may sound a bit different because it takes the whole insertion depth and tips out of the equasion. It brings the ressonance tubes straight to a position where the company understand that's the point inside the ear canal where I want my frequency to be like X. It will have the insulation desired by the company and so on.

As I always say, we need to understand from where those words are coming from when checking reviews/reviewers. Nothing against Crin, he is a great guys with lots of knowledge and he is really good in making his thoughts and reviews easy to understand.

 

[Vitaly2017]

You are probably right, but it may be even worse than that. I was listening to a podcast with Crinacle who stated outright that the 64 Audio custom IEMs measure quite a bit differently than the Universal models and in his opinion the measurements were worse. I have no idea if that is true, but when an important person like him makes that type of statement and you learn that you can never resell a custom IEM, that makes it a really unattractive alternative. I've mentioned this before, but I was thinking about taking another crack at it since a sale came up. I guess the best path still is to go Universal and if universal tips don't work, then get custom tips.

To be honest with you I approached this topic sometimes long time ago and people didnt really believed me, some did.

I have experienced universal and custom of the exact same iem and the results where quiet shocking too my ears as I at first got the universal model and was enjoying it so much I couldn't believe it was really good.
Then I decided to go custom cause yeaa custom is the most comfortable right! Well if its done right it is and thats true so much less hassle then to have those eartips.

But the problem was that the custom iem lost the bliss and the wonderful sound tuning they had... Yes that is true custom sounds inferior to universals.

Why? Cause first of all the shape the construction and position of the drivers are different and the longer bore that goes into your ear canal changes the sound and it cannot be as straight and as super optimised like the universal version.

The loss was not huge but me it was enough to not be as happy as I was with my universals.

So for me since that no more custom.
Why do you think fourte and trio are not custom? Cause it will ruin the tuning...

I never tested 64a custom vs universal. But from what I hear as feedback it sounds exactly what I felt.
Universals are better sounding then custom.
And any custom iems are no longer so much considered as tubeless either.... So unfortunately the best sound experience is with unis!

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

But we need to be careful with those kind of statements. Customs may sound a bit different because it takes the whole insertion depth and tips out of the equasion. It brings the ressonance tubes straight to a position where the company understand that's the point inside the ear canal where I want my frequency to be like X. It will have the insulation desired by the company and so on.

As I always say, we need to understand from where those words are coming from when checking reviews/reviewers. Nothing against Crin, he is a great guys with lots of knowledge and he is really good in making his thoughts and reviews easy to understand.

What do you think we need to be careful about? It sounds like what customers need to be careful about is that the product they demo may not end up being the product they get. That's a pretty big deal. He took the measurements, the customs measured significantly differently than the Universals. So much so, he recommended against purchasing any 64 Audio CIEMs. To be fair, it was a fairly blanket statement as he said there were only a few custom IEMs that he would recommend. It was a shocking statement. Clearly, there are a lot of owners who have CIEMs from 64 Audio. I was wondering if anyone can confirm or reject Crinacle's statements?

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

To be honest with you I approached this topic sometimes long time ago and people didnt really believed me, some did.

I have experienced universal and custom of the exact same iem and the results where quiet shocking too my ears as I at first got the universal model and was enjoying it so much I couldn't believe it was really good.
Then I decided to go custom cause yeaa custom is the most comfortable right! Well if its done right it is and thats true so much less hassle then to have those eartips.

But the problem was that the custom iem lost the bliss and the wonderful sound tuning they had... Yes that is true custom sounds inferior to universals.

Why? Cause first of all the shape the construction and position of the drivers are different and the longer bore that goes into your ear canal changes the sound and it cannot be as straight and as super optimised like the universal version.

The loss was not huge but me it was enough to not be as happy as I was with my universals.

So for me since that no more custom.
Why do you think fourte and trio are not custom? Cause it will ruin the tuning...

I never tested 64a custom vs universal. But from what I hear as feedback it sounds exactly what I felt.
Universals are better sounding then custom.
And any custom iems are no longer so much considered as tubeless either.... So unfortunately the best sound experience is with unis!

Thanks for your experience. I always wondered why Universals were so much more popular than Customs on Head fi. This must be a contributing factor.

 

[Vitaly2017]

Thanks for your experience. I always wondered why Universals were so much more popular than Customs on Head fi. This must be a contributing factor.

Your welcome. I think my experience is relatively same toward any custom vs universals. And my particular test was done with empire ears phantoms. I had the universal for 6months maybe and the. Got the custom. I can tell you that at first it wasnt so apparent but with time I was missing my music and started to realise with a/b that it is different after all.

I am not saying 64a is bad customs. Not at all I just think it is normal that there is a different sound out of a custom vs universals. Plus 64a offer the apex which is a must have.

Its your decision where to go, I would stay with universals if fit isnt troubling you

 

[GiullianSN]

Why do you think fourte and trio are not custom? Cause it will ruin the tuning...

From previous answers, it is more related to the sound chamber needed for the Tia's. Hard to reproduce on every different year. I think Fir has some complaints on that.

He took the measurements, the customs measured significantly differently than the Universals.

I would expect the measurements to be different. That's physics. But "better" or "worse" is relative. For some, the extra low end from the Custom is better, for some is not. We have thousands of musicians and hearing aids that uses customs. It's preference. That's why I say to look for what the comments comes from, mainly preference for an specific combination. A simple tip change can alter the sound enough to be an wow or meh factor. Custom eliminate that play.

About more Uni than customs, mainly because you can't sell customs easily and in this hobby be able to buy and sell is crucial to keep playing the game.

Just my 2 cents and to have an interesting discussion, nothing to fight for.

 

[HiFiHawaii808]

Your welcome. I think my experience is relatively same toward any custom vs universals. And my particular test was done with empire ears phantoms. I had the universal for 6months maybe and the. Got the custom. I can tell you that at first it wasnt so apparent but with time I was missing my music and started to realise with a/b that it is different after all.

I am not saying 64a is bad customs. Not at all I just think it is normal that there is a different sound out of a custom vs universals. Plus 64a offer the apex which is a must have.

Its your decision where to go, I would stay with universals if fit isnt troubling you

My issue is with the dealer who tried to get me to purchase the customs. She promised that if I liked the universal demos that I would love the customs because they would be that much better because they are custom. That is not necessarily true.

 

[Levanter]

Thanks for your experience. I always wondered why Universals were so much more popular than Customs on Head fi. This must be a contributing factor.

There is also the difference btw variance units. I’ve heard a U12t demo and it sounded significantly worse than mine. But then again mine was an upgraded U12t from A12 from Fir, so not exactly a direct 1-1 comparison. But variance is real with all manufacturers.

 

[Vitaly2017]

My issue is with the dealer who tried to get me to purchase the customs. She promised that if I liked the universal demos that I would love the customs because they would be that much better because they are custom. That is not necessarily true.

Well maybe she have a different point of view
Or maybe she base it on the majority that said custom is the way to go?
Is she an audiophile and she tried it her self? Then she claims an absolute better experience

Its all different variations that will affect your decision at end.

As @CrocodileDundee said custom are not easy to resale and you will one day would want to upgrade the iem to a new model and will lose much less money vs the custom.

 

[GiullianSN]

My issue is with the dealer who tried to get me to purchase the customs. She promised that if I liked the universal demos that I would love the customs because they would be that much better because they are custom. That is not necessarily true.

Yeah, that is not the right approach. She should have sold you the convenience of the custom, isolation and other things. But not say "it's much better" because that's subjective.

Ps.: I prefer my A12t than U12t.

 

[KuroKitsu]

To be honest with you I approached this topic sometimes long time ago and people didnt really believed me, some did.

I have experienced universal and custom of the exact same iem and the results where quiet shocking too my ears as I at first got the universal model and was enjoying it so much I couldn't believe it was really good.
Then I decided to go custom cause yeaa custom is the most comfortable right! Well if its done right it is and thats true so much less hassle then to have those eartips.

But the problem was that the custom iem lost the bliss and the wonderful sound tuning they had... Yes that is true custom sounds inferior to universals.

Why? Cause first of all the shape the construction and position of the drivers are different and the longer bore that goes into your ear canal changes the sound and it cannot be as straight and as super optimised like the universal version.

The loss was not huge but me it was enough to not be as happy as I was with my universals.

So for me since that no more custom.
Why do you think fourte and trio are not custom? Cause it will ruin the tuning...

I never tested 64a custom vs universal. But from what I hear as feedback it sounds exactly what I felt.
Universals are better sounding then custom.
And any custom iems are no longer so much considered as tubeless either.... So unfortunately the best sound experience is with unis!

Settle down there Tiger.

Subjectively unis are better on the wallet at the pace you (and others go through gear) on hear. That's all there is to it, nothing more nothing less. Though customs will have a much more consistent sound.

I agree with @CrocodileDundee here:
Arguably the nature of universals actually make it harder to create a consistent sound (even when not factoring in unit variance). Unis are just going to have a bigger variance overall and not representative of how a custom might sound at all. Thats just the nature of it.

The A12t does sound different from the u12t, but I actually prefer it more myself.

 

[gLer]

For me it's a simple matter of economics and flexibility.

I've never used a CIEM, so can't comment on sound variance, but I can imagine it'll be like anything else at this level - personal preference.

What's certain is this: once you get a CIEM, you're married to it, for better or worse. Economically, it's more expensive to buy; you basically have to buy it new, and also factor in the cost of ear moulds, shipping, etc., whereas the used market for high-end uni IEMs means the cost of entry is much, much lower. It's also more expensive to sell - even if you can find a willing buyer, you're going to take a massive loss on the purchase price.

Unis are also far more flexible. With some, a tip change can make them sound like different IEMs. 64 Audio CIEMs with Apex have an advantage here, but most other brands don't have CIEM tuning options.

And let's face it, unless you're happy to buy an IEM and keep it basically for life, CIEMs are a hard sell compared to unis.

But...if you do find a great IEM and are lucky enough to have it made as a good-fitting, good sounding CIEM, it does make life much simpler. As long as you know what you're gaining, and what you're giving up in doing so.

 

[Malevolint]

I feel like you guys are arguing about which personal preference is correct lol. I've looked at though graphs to see that ciems tend to be a bit darker than their uni counterpart. Whether you like that or not isn't wrong.. It's just preference.