[Malevolent]

Ive already got aeon flow (no RT) open.
I will looking for an used pair of any of that recommendations.

The fostex closed planar family are not recommended?

Honestly, if you are looking at something like the Fostex T50RPmk3, I'd suggest increasing your budget by a bit, and aim for the Audeze LCD-2 Closed Back or the Dan Clark Audio AEON 2 Closed instead. Both of these options are easily the best closed planar headphones below the $1,000 mark.

 

[Malevolent]

Thank you very much for your detailed answer.

I always remember the comments from DEMs (he was a user of head-fi, but not anymore). He always praise for Z1R and, after tried the Sony Z1R, he sold all of his other headphones, except Meze Empyrean and Abyss 1266 Phi TC. A while after that, he replied me that he stayed prefering the Sonys to the Meze and the Abyss.

Those comments here are good for us and our wallets

I think the elements of subjectivity and preference are not always appreciated, or recognized. One man's trash is another man's treasure, after all.

So many people have lauded the HD 800 / S for their stellar sound and/or technical capabilities, but, personally, I could never use them for enjoying music. If I was gifted this headphone, I'd sell it in a heartbeat, only to reinvest the money into a different pair of cans.

Ultimately, what can be widely regarded as a great pair of headphones may not be enjoyed by everyone. Thus, the myriad choices available to all of us. The ultimate winner? The consumer, of course.

 

[Malevolent]

Not really, no, although I guess I haven't really looked into Dan Clark stuff at all.

I'm mainly looking for a higher end (slash end game, which I've decided is around the 1000 euro mark for me) closed back that has good isolation and comfort, plenty of bass impact, warm and inviting and musical mids and smooth and inoffensive highs and from what I've gathered, either the Beyer T5.3s or the ZMF Atticus would be the best pick for me, but I've admittedly become a bit tunnel-visioned and haven't considered any other options.

Starting to feel extremely uncertain and indecisive about them both, anyway. I checked the ATH-M50x pad size out of curiosity for comparison since I had them some years ago and they were simply too small and uncomfortable and hot for me, and it looks like they're just a tiiiny bit bigger than the T5.3's pads, so I guess that's out of the running. As for the Atticus, I already have the Aeolus and as much as I love them, paying another ~1300 euros to get something that's pretty much more of the same but closed doesn't seem like a very good financial decision.

I guess I should get back to googling. Recommendations are welcome, too, of course, and it doesn't have to be a grand. I currently have the 99 Classics but eh, not really a big fan of them, they just sound kind of boring to me for some reason. Very bassy, but dry and unengaging.

In the pricier tiers of the closed-back headphone market, you won't find many options that are leaning toward the bassier, warmer, darker, and smoother side of the spectrum. Off hand, the only few that I can think of are the AudioQuest NightOwl Carbon, the Beyerdynamic T5 (3rd Generation), and the ZMF Atticus.

All of these 3 are cut from the same piece of cloth, IMO. They are definitely treble-shy; conversely, these cans have a distinct emphasis toward the lower registers. If you're a basshead, you'll certainly enjoy smooth, pounding waves of bass.

In terms of pad size, the Beyerdynamic definitely has the smallest; it is also the least massive of the 3. The Atticus has a relatively large size, from memory. The NightOwl Carbon has roomy, plush pads, too; sadly, this headphone is discontinued. Finding one on the open market will prove to be a challenge.

 

[Malevolent]

Question for those who have heard a variety of closed back headphones: how's the LCD2-CB compare in isolation to the competition, specifically the Audio Technica AWAS/AWKT if anyone's heard the both of them?

I currently have the LCD and am looking to try something else and I'm trying to decide if I'm going to stay closed or if I'm willing to go back open and bear the full force of my loud AC(only one more month of summer..) Mostly looking at the ATs as I don't want anymore bass than my Audeze while I want more interesting upper-mids(and larger stage which may not be avail in a closed back, the Audeze seem above average for this.)

I cannot distinctly recall the isolation capabilities of the ATH-AWKT and/or the ATH-AWAS. @Nostoi has owned the both of them, though, so he'd probably be well suited to help you with that.

However, from whatever fleeting memory I have of this pertinent aspect, the isolation isn't particularly good on both products. The LCD-2 Closed Back fares better in this regard. This has a lot to do with the shallow pads on the Audio-Technica headphones; they don't envelop my ears with a good seal. On the other hand, the Audeze's plush, large pads help to isolate pretty well.

 

[Nostoi]

I cannot distinctly recall the isolation capabilities of the ATH-AWKT and/or the ATH-AWAS. @Nostoi has owned the both of them, though, so he'd probably be well suited to help you with that.

However, from whatever fleeting memory I have of this pertinent aspect, the isolation isn't particularly good on both products. The LCD-2 Closed Back fares better in this regard. This has a lot to do with the shallow pads on the Audio-Technica headphones; they don't envelop my ears with a good seal. On the other hand, the Audeze's plush, large pads help to isolate pretty well.

Hi there @MohawkUS - isolation on AWKT and AWAS is average. Both of them have slightly flat pads, the bottom edge of which slightly hangs below the ear level. My wife never complained about leakage and I found I was able to block much of the surrounding hum of everyday life, but they're very dependent on a decent seal. If you wear glasses - as I do - you'll need a wire frame. Thick frames will disturb the FR and undermine the isolation. Otherwise, lovely cans!

Edit - totally agree with @Malevolent's assessment, too - shallow pads play a big part here.

 

[Malevolent]

Hi there @MohawkUS - isolation on AWKT and AWAS is average. Both of them have slightly flat pads, the bottom edge of which slightly hangs below the ear level. My wife never complained about leakage and I found I was able to block much of the surrounding hum of everyday life, but they're very dependent on a decent seal. If you wear glasses - as I do - you'll need a wire frame. Thick frames will disturb the FR and undermine the isolation. Otherwise, lovely cans!

Thanks, mate! That's what I suspected, too - the shallow seal on the ATH-AWKT and the ATH-AWAS may be the cause of slight isolation issues. Mileage may vary across individuals, of course, but I tend to prefer headphones with deeper pads as opposed to shallower ones.

 

[Nostoi]

Thanks, mate! That's what I suspected, too - the shallow seal on the ATH-AWKT and the ATH-AWAS may be the cause of slight isolation issues. Mileage may vary across individuals, of course, but I tend to prefer headphones with deeper pads as opposed to shallower ones.

With pleasure. I also prefer a deeper seal, though saying that the seal on the Rognir is also quite flat/shallow but tends to "cup" the ear in a fuller way. Also no issue with wearing thicker rim glasses, which is a bonus if/when my son has destroyed my wire-frame ones...

 

[P007]

Between the 2 I liked the T5.3 way more then the Atticus. Atticus felt slow, overly dark and muddy. T5.3 was way more enjoyable, except for the comfort. I returned T5.3 due to a hotspot and the small cups. Finally settled on the Focal Celestee (for now ). I think that the æon 2 noire is excellent as well but it misses that bass kick that a dynamic pair can give. Celestee delivers that sound and is very comfortable. People complain about the soundstage but I found an amp that fixes that issue (or so I believe cause I don't mind the soundstage at all).

I'm currently trying to decide between the Aeon 2 Noire and the T5's. The A2C are supremely comfortable and sound great, but mostly lack the bass dynamics/impact. The T5 have that, but I am still finding them uncomfortable even after stretching them on books overnight... So unless I can fix that clamp force comfort there's no way I could keep them.

I need soundstage, and don't want to have to buy a lot of extra gear, so trying to fix the Celeste's isn't an option. I currently have the dampening pads removed from the T5, so they are much brighter than stock, similar to the t5p.

 

[Malevolent]

With pleasure. I also prefer a deeper seal, though saying that the seal on the Rognir is also quite flat/shallow but tends to "cup" the ear in a fuller way. Also no issue with wearing thicker rim glasses, which is a bonus if/when my son has destroyed my wire-frame ones...

By the way, I see that you've ordered a MicroZOTL MZ3. I've read some (very) good things about this amp, and it has been on the periphery of my radar of late. If it sounds as good as the reviews state, I'm sure it'll be a blast listening to your Rögnir and the Vérité Closed with it!

 

[Malevolent]

I'm currently trying to decide between the Aeon 2 Noire and the T5's. The A2C are supremely comfortable and sound great, but mostly lack the bass dynamics/impact. The T5 have that, but I am still finding them uncomfortable even after stretching them on books overnight... So unless I can fix that clamp force comfort there's no way I could keep them.

I need soundstage, and don't want to have to buy a lot of extra gear, so trying to fix the Celeste's isn't an option. I currently have the dampening pads removed from the T5, so they are much brighter than stock, similar to the t5p.

Is the T5 too strong in its clamp? For what it's worth, I had no issues listening to them for over an hour during each of my auditions with this headphone. Of course, comfort is surprisingly subjective; some people find a headphone comfortable to use, whilst others encounter a host of issues (clamp, headband, pads, et al).

 

[Nostoi]

By the way, I see that you've ordered a MicroZOTL MZ3. I've read some (very) good things about this amp, and it has been on the periphery of my radar of late. If it sounds as good as the reviews state, I'm sure it'll be a blast listening to your Rögnir and the Vérité Closed with it!

I did and I think it should be swinging its way to me soon. The MZ2 already impressed me greatly, and I understand the MZ3 refines on every aspect, providing better dynamics, better detail, and better "slam" (hate that word). The MZ3 was not cheap - at least buying it directly within the EU - and frankly I could have bought a TT2 for that money if I'd also sold my Qutest and/or Hugo 2, which I was also dabbling with - and which I think you got recently? But there's something about the MZ3 in particular which draws me in. The Rögnir and Vérité Closed are already a fantastic pairing with the MZ2, so I hope with the MZ3 it'll truly be "endgame" (of course, until the next endgame arrives.... )

Let me also know your impressions on the TT2 and Vérité Closed pairing - you're using it directly in its "pure" form without an amp?

 

[noplsestar]

Hi @Malevolent I kind of "lost" your thread during summer and just found out, that head-fi didn´t give me the new posts. Anyways, I bid you a few months ago to test the Focal Elegia with the Celestee pads, because there were so many guys in German forums telling me that it is the perfect neutral headphone (for the money). Did you get the chance to test that and how were your findings? Sorry if you have posted it already but I couldn´t find it anywhere.

 

[MohawkUS]

Hi there @MohawkUS - isolation on AWKT and AWAS is average. Both of them have slightly flat pads, the bottom edge of which slightly hangs below the ear level. My wife never complained about leakage and I found I was able to block much of the surrounding hum of everyday life, but they're very dependent on a decent seal. If you wear glasses - as I do - you'll need a wire frame. Thick frames will disturb the FR and undermine the isolation. Otherwise, lovely cans!

Edit - totally agree with @Malevolent's assessment, too - shallow pads play a big part here.

Thanks for the help @Malevolent & @Nostoi . If they're less isolating then the LCD2CB I guess they're more focused on keeping sound in then out, ha. The reason I wonder is because the LCD2CB doesn't isolate the lower frequencies of my AC practically at all & the closed back AT Bluetooth cans I have actually amplify the noise.

I have a pair of Yamaha YH-E700A I just got in that showed me what strong isolation sounds like. They're noise cancelling but even with that feature disabled they remove most of the AC noise. They're a basshead's dream with high tactility & texture, it's too much for me personally. They're actually surpassingly proficient & clear sounding for a pair of self-powered portables if you can get past the pumped up lows. I think I'd take them over Audio Technica R70x & would have to think about them vs the Beyerdynamic T70 I used to love just to compare them to a duo of audiophile 'home' cans.

 

[P007]

Is the T5 too strong in its clamp? For what it's worth, I had no issues listening to them for over an hour during each of my auditions with this headphone. Of course, comfort is surprisingly subjective; some people find a headphone comfortable to use, whilst others encounter a host of issues (clamp, headband, pads, et al).

Yes, for me they are too tight for longer listening sessions (which is everyday at work). I will try to stretch them a bit more with books overnight. Both A2C and the last pair of headphones I had for 5 years (HP150) have much less clamp force. I have only tried the Elegia, but the clamp force is one reason I have shied away from Focal (and soundstage). Both the HP150 and T5 have a pad/design which makes for warmer ears than the A2C.

Will probably write up a comparison at some point when I decide, since I will only keep 1 pair.

 

[Malevolent]

I did and I think it should be swinging its way to me soon. The MZ2 already impressed me greatly, and I understand the MZ3 refines on every aspect, providing better dynamics, better detail, and better "slam" (hate that word). The MZ3 was not cheap - at least buying it directly within the EU - and frankly I could have bought a TT2 for that money if I'd also sold my Qutest and/or Hugo 2, which I was also dabbling with - and which I think you got recently? But there's something about the MZ3 in particular which draws me in. The Rögnir and Vérité Closed are already a fantastic pairing with the MZ2, so I hope with the MZ3 it'll truly be "endgame" (of course, until the next endgame arrives.... )

Let me also know your impressions on the TT2 and Vérité Closed pairing - you're using it directly in its "pure" form without an amp?

On looks alone, the MZ2 is one of the prettiest-looking amplifiers on the market; I just loveeee that glass top. On the other hand, the MZ3 looks all mean and ready for business. I'm looking forward to your impressions when they arrive!

Yeah, about that Hugo TT 2. Long story short - in February, I ordered the Yggdrasil and Ragnarok 2 combo. However, 6 months later, after an interminable series of delays, I cancelled my order and got a refund. As we are fans of the Chord sound, I knew that there could only be 1 logical upgrade from the Hugo 2, and a fitting replacement for the Schiit big-daddy-stack; thus, I went all-in for the Hugo TT 2.

I'm currently driving it without an amplifier; it's quite beefy in itself. Nevertheless, I'm still looking around for an amplifier; tube options are probably somewhere on the horizon - the Euforia, the MZ2, the HA-6A are some of the products under consideration. Still, I've spent quite a fair bit recently, so any mega buys would have to wait till next year. My wife has already been very tolerant - I don't want her to go into Super Saiyan mode!