[estreeter]

Quote:

There's so many darn players! (goes off to buy a home CD player) But seriously, now is a good time to be a portaphile.

Visions of George announcing his arrival in an electronics/audio shop with 'Well, I like to think of myself as a portaphile'. 
 
The people who wrote 'Something about Mary' would have loved it. 

 

[vrln]

Quote:

Quote:

If you want the Wadia roll off in a portable player, the HM-801 is the way to go.

Err, the who and the what?  Take it easy there, I'm a noobie to this place, please!

The term roll off means that the player cuts high frequency sound in a certain way making the highs in the music less sibilant (mostly s letters sounding like SssSsssSSSssSSssSSS instead of a soft "sh")/shrill/hard. A lot of people like the effect, and others don´t. Many expensive audiophile CD-players for example have a roll-off, including (apparently, I have no idea about that) the ones built by Wadia.

 

[alyanm]

 
Quote:

The term roll off means that the player cuts high frequency sound in a certain way making the highs in the music less sibilant (mostly s letters sounding like SssSsssSSSssSSssSSS instead of a soft "sh")/shrill/hard. A lot of people like the effect, and others don´t. Many expensive audiophile CD-players for example have a roll-off, including (apparently, I have no idea about that) the ones built by Wadia.

 Ahh, makes so much sense now!  So the HM-801 has a roll off??  My second hand impressions were that the HM-801 is totally transparent and flat as an ice skating rink... the penultimate hifi DAP for the budding portaphile as it were!

 

[GeorgeGoodman]

Quote:

 
Quote:

The term roll off means that the player cuts high frequency sound in a certain way making the highs in the music less sibilant (mostly s letters sounding like SssSsssSSSssSSssSSS instead of a soft "sh")/shrill/hard. A lot of people like the effect, and others don´t. Many expensive audiophile CD-players for example have a roll-off, including (apparently, I have no idea about that) the ones built by Wadia.

 Ahh, makes so much sense now!  So the HM-801 has a roll off??  My second hand impressions were that the HM-801 is totally transparent and flat as an ice skating rink... the penultimate hifi DAP for the budding portaphile as it were!

There ain't no such thing as a penultimate portable player. People can't even agree as to the sound they all like, so that makes it impossible to design a one size fits all player. I am not a treblehead, and i like a little roll off in the highs. It makes things sound natural.

 

[Anaxilus]

The 602 is $440 NOT $599.  The 601 is $260.  I question listing the iMod #2 unless the ranking is by price solely.  Most iMods are likely below the Sflo2 or equal to it.  Some exceed it and whether those would exceed the QA350 is another matter.  The Gumstick and Clip+ should be listed.  The QA350 also does not need an amp.  Only the iMod 'needs' an amp.     

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

Cube C30/Gumstick should be somewhere in there, guessing right below the sflo2. From the J3 down, all the mainstream brand generally are pretty close in sq ime but noticeable behind the poor ui "audiphile" players. 

Hmm, ok which category does the Cube C30 go into?  Sure is cheap at $53 which suggests to me the "Mainstream" category...

 

[Anaxilus]

Quote:

Quote:

Cube C30/Gumstick should be somewhere in there, guessing right below the sflo2. From the J3 down, all the mainstream brand generally are pretty close in sq ime but noticeable behind the poor ui "audiphile" players. 

Hmm, ok which category does the Cube C30 go into?  Sure is cheap at $53 which suggests to me the "Mainstream" category...

Cheap audiophile.  Mainstream players aren't hard to find or usually have built in Class A amps.

 

[ZIPUR]

The more you search the more unhappy you will be. IMO.
But let me help you with a feature often ovelooked.    If you can't change a song without looking at the device, scatch it off your list.
What use is a portable deivce that can't fit into your pocket.
what use is a portable device in your pocket if you have to take it off unlock the screen just to skip to the next song.
How much are you willing to loose. Can you live with accidently drop it in the water closet or  leave it on a park bench?
 
Bottom line External Keys and Pocket-ablitiy adn Replacement cost.

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

The more you search the more unhappy you will be. IMO.
But let me help you with a feature often ovelooked.    If you can't change a song without looking at the device, scatch it off your list.
What use is a portable deivce that can't fit into your pocket.
what use is a portable device in your pocket if you have to take it off unlock the screen just to skip to the next song.
How much are you willing to loose. Can you live with accidently drop it in the water closet or  leave it on a park bench?
 
Bottom line External Keys and Pocket-ablitiy adn Replacement cost.

Excellent points all of them!  And all of them are reasons I enjoy my Walkman X so much... 
 
My big question is: is there an audiophile quality player that is also "usable" in the ways you describe.  I'm beginning to think the iMod is the one that really fits the bill -- except the high cost part I suppose.

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

Quote:

Hmm, ok which category does the Cube C30 go into?  Sure is cheap at $53 which suggests to me the "Mainstream" category...

Cheap audiophile.  Mainstream players aren't hard to find or usually have built in Class A amps.

I'm feeling a third category coming on here...
 
What defines a "Class A amp", is that a good thing or a bad thing for audiophile?
 
What I'm really wanting to know is how the Cube ranks as far as pure SQ so I can fit it into my list accordingly...

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

The 602 is $440 NOT $599.  The 601 is $260.  I question listing the iMod #2 unless the ranking is by price solely.  Most iMods are likely below the Sflo2 or equal to it.  Some exceed it and whether those would exceed the QA350 is another matter.  The Gumstick and Clip+ should be listed.  The QA350 also does not need an amp.  Only the iMod 'needs' an amp.     

Excellent, very helpful comments, I'll make some adjustments to my list accordingly.  The iMod I'm referring to is the one sold by ALO made by Vinnie.
 
I actually haven't been able to find a place to buy a 602, thanks for the price correction.

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

Quote:

 Ahh, makes so much sense now!  So the HM-801 has a roll off??  My second hand impressions were that the HM-801 is totally transparent and flat as an ice skating rink... the penultimate hifi DAP for the budding portaphile as it were!

There ain't no such thing as a penultimate portable player. People can't even agree as to the sound they all like, so that makes it impossible to design a one size fits all player. I am not a treblehead, and i like a little roll off in the highs. It makes things sound natural.

I've been thinking about this today.  I just went to JH Audio factory facility today and tried out the JH13 vs the JH16 thinking that I would probably get the flatter JH13 -- but I just liked the 16 better so that's what I ordered.  So I'm with you, I think I'd rather have a bit of Wadia roll off.  Needless to say I like a little extra bass with that please.
 
Having said that, there do seem to be "head-fi favorites" that most of this community agree are the best -- the JH1x IEMs,  the RSA Protector and from what I've read, the Hifiman 801 is one of that elite group.  I'm trying to get a sense of that consensus regarding the audiophile DAPs to help me decide how to abuse my wallet next

 

[GeorgeGoodman]

I tried the JH5s and 16s this past weekend at a meet and much preferred the 16s. The 5s have a little more bass than "neutral" from what I have read, and they sounded OK to me. The 16s, however, were really great. I don't think they have roll off in the highs, rather they have "extra bass." I found them to be almost perfect in their frequency balance and on some soundtrack songs (the Dark Knight to be exact) the tracks with low bass made me feel like I was sitting in a theater. The other songs that sounded kinda boring with the 5s sounded good with the 16s "extra bass." I put extra bass in parentheses because I really do not think it is extra. It sounds real and natural to me. I have speakers with a sub and you can adjust the sub to a point where it is fake (too much bass), and that does not sound that great unless I really want to have fun. The 16s sounded like music to me, the more "neutral" 5s not so much. 
 
Disclaimer: I know I am comparing a $400 IEM to an $1150 one, but there is not a huge difference anyway, something readily admitted by people who have heard or owned both. The main difference would be in speed and resolution, and I am just comparing the sound balance between the two. It was noisy in the room, another factor to take into account. 

 

[alyanm]

Quote:

I tried the JH5s and 16s this past weekend at a meet and much preferred the 16s. The 5s have a little more bass than "neutral" from what I have read, and they sounded OK to me. The 16s, however, were really great. I don't think they have roll off in the highs, rather they have "extra bass." I found them to be almost perfect in their frequency balance and on some soundtrack songs (the Dark Knight to be exact) the tracks with low bass made me feel like I was sitting in a theater. The other songs that sounded kinda boring with the 5s sounded good with the 16s "extra bass." I put extra bass in parentheses because I really do not think it is extra. It sounds real and natural to me. I have speakers with a sub and you can adjust the sub to a point where it is fake (too much bass), and that does not sound that great unless I really want to have fun. The 16s sounded like music to me, the more "neutral" 5s not so much.

That really describes my experience of the 16s as well, thanks for that!  I didn't try the 5s since I was pretty sure I wanted a 13 or a 16, now I'm thinking maybe I should have given them a try as well just for the fun of it.
 
The 13s were also excellent but somehow the 16s just seemed a bit more vibrant and alive to me.  As with you, it didn't seem to me like the bass was excessive, it just seemed better to me.  Admittedtly, I've got also got a touch of basshead in me.  Jaime Harvey was the one helping me and she was saying that she likes the 16s better, when she listens to the 13s she always feels like she needs an amp to give it a little extra something, but not so with the 16s.  That seemed right to me as well.
 
Anyway, back on topic, I'm thinking about what sort of DAP to hook my 16s to
 

 

[Achmedisdead]

 
Quote:

Quote:

I tried the JH5s and 16s this past weekend at a meet and much preferred the 16s. The 5s have a little more bass than "neutral" from what I have read, and they sounded OK to me. The 16s, however, were really great. I don't think they have roll off in the highs, rather they have "extra bass." I found them to be almost perfect in their frequency balance and on some soundtrack songs (the Dark Knight to be exact) the tracks with low bass made me feel like I was sitting in a theater. The other songs that sounded kinda boring with the 5s sounded good with the 16s "extra bass." I put extra bass in parentheses because I really do not think it is extra. It sounds real and natural to me. I have speakers with a sub and you can adjust the sub to a point where it is fake (too much bass), and that does not sound that great unless I really want to have fun. The 16s sounded like music to me, the more "neutral" 5s not so much.

That really describes my experience of the 16s as well, thanks for that!  I didn't try the 5s since I was pretty sure I wanted a 13 or a 16, now I'm thinking maybe I should have given them a try as well just for the fun of it.
 
The 13s were also excellent but somehow the 16s just seemed a bit more vibrant and alive to me.  As with you, it didn't seem to me like the bass was excessive, it just seemed better to me.  Admittedtly, I've got also got a touch of basshead in me.  Jaime Harvey was the one helping me and she was saying that she likes the 16s better, when she listens to the 13s she always feels like she needs an amp to give it a little extra something, but not so with the 16s.  That seemed right to me as well.
 
Anyway, back on topic, I'm thinking about what sort of DAP to hook my 16s to
 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Just kidding!