[midoo1990]

i wont get any amp "soon" since i will be building a b22 in a few months.right now i want to upgrade from my built gamma2 to a high end one.

 

[LugBug1]

Quote:

Yes, it is amp dependent to a large extent. I'm not a believer in amps making a huge difference, but in the case of phones like the LCD-2 a slight shift of tonal balance can make all the difference (as no doubt they can in the opposite direction with phones like the HD800). You need something as light and bright as possible. Get that right and I think you'll find the LCD-2 can be just about as realistic as it's possible to get with headphones (as opposed to speakers), even if not as exciting and detailed as some others.
 
I'll be getting a Hiifiman HE500 soon (snapped off Ebay) and I'm interested in finding out how another top grade phone with a brighter signature sounds on classical. I don't expect that it will dethrone the LCD-2, which still manages to surprise me, but we'll see.

Congrats on getting the HE500's, I think you will be pleased with them. They will not as you say, defrone your LCD's but they will offer another variation of the great orthos sound for you. I find they are better for larger orchestral music or recordings that benefit from little more sparkle. Make sure you use the velour pads though, they help open up the soundstage and provide better seperation imo.  
 
Looking forward to some impressions and comparisons

 

[johnwmclean]

Quote:

Yes, it is amp dependent to a large extent. I'm not a believer in amps making a huge difference, but in the case of phones like the LCD-2 a slight shift of tonal balance can make all the difference (as no doubt they can in the opposite direction with phones like the HD800). You need something as light and bright as possible. Get that right and I think you'll find the LCD-2 can be just about as realistic as it's possible to get with headphones (as opposed to speakers), even if not as exciting and detailed as some others.
 
I'll be getting a Hiifiman HE500 soon (snapped off Ebay) and I'm interested in finding out how another top grade phone with a brighter signature sounds on classical. I don't expect that it will dethrone the LCD-2, which still manages to surprise me, but we'll see.

 
From reading countless post by yourself pp312, I’ve come to know what you like in a phone, I personally don’t think your LCD-2’s will be threatened by the HE500, it’s more of a side ways step imho. You need to push a little harder to get a significant step on from the LCD-2, in your case I would recommend a listen to a Stax SR-007, I think it has all those attributes you love with the LCD-2 with a much better presentation and naturalness.

 

[preproman]

The HE-500s have grown on me I must say.  However, I just can't get away from the seductiveness of the LCD-2.2s  Although there are things IMO the HE-500s are better at espeaicaly if you have an amp that can smooth out the treble of the HE-500s.  But then again if you have amp that's good at producing treble the LCD-2.2s are as good as it gets.
 
Depending on the music and the amp - it's a toss up for these two.

 

[pp312]

Quote:

 
From reading countless post by yourself pp312, I’ve come to know what you like in a phone, I personally don’t think your LCD-2’s will be threatened by the HE500, it’s more of a side ways step imho. You need to push a little harder to get a significant step on from the LCD-2, in your case I would recommend a listen to a Stax SR-007, I think it has all those attributes you love with the LCD-2 with a much better presentation and naturalness.

 
I'm flattered that you've been reading my countless (actually 2645) posts so keenly, John, as well as that you're so concerned for my listening pleasure.

 
However, the sad fact is that I'm a 66 year old fart with tinnitus who can see no point progressing beyond the LCD-2/HE500 level. If I ordered anything else now, I'd probably be deaf in one ear and unable to hear out the other before it got here. Indeed, the only reason I bought the HE500 was the very reasonable price. It certainly wasn't dissatisfaction with the LCD-2, which I'm more and more coming to believe is actually underrated here--even the Rev1.
 
But maybe the HE500 will change my mind about that. Stay tuned... 

 

[donlin]

Quote:

 
From reading countless post by yourself pp312, I’ve come to know what you like in a phone, I personally don’t think your LCD-2’s will be threatened by the HE500, it’s more of a side ways step imho. You need to push a little harder to get a significant step on from the LCD-2, in your case I would recommend a listen to a Stax SR-007, I think it has all those attributes you love with the LCD-2 with a much better presentation and naturalness.

I have to disagree about the Stax SR-007 being a step up from the LCD-2.  The Stax had been my regular phone for quite a while when I tried my LCD-2.  It didn't take long for me to decide that I definitely preferred the Audeze and sold the Stax a while after that.  I can see different tastes preferring one over the other, but they are at the same level of absolute quality in my opinion.

 

[korzena]

Hi, just bought LCD2 (rev.2) and Schiit Lyr (JJ tubes). Great sound and everything!...apart from one thing - I would like the soundstage to be more spacious, to have more air.
The thing is especially apparent to me when listening to soundtracks like Dark Knight, Tron, Inception or some 'spacious' electronic music.
 
Is there a way to "increase" the soundstage of the LCD2s?
 
Different tubes for Lyr?
Appropriate DAC? Which one? (At the moment my temporary source is just an iPod 5G classic, but it was used as a source also for my other headphones (e.g. Audio-Technica W5000) and I didn't notice any contraction of the soundstage)

 

[Darkbeat]

Quote:

Hi, just bought LCD2 (rev.2) and Schiit Lyr (JJ tubes). Great sound and everything!...apart from one thing - I would like the soundstage to be more spacious, to have more air.
The thing is especially apparent to me when listening to soundtracks like Dark Knight, Tron, Inception or some 'spacious' electronic music.
 
Is there a way to "increase" the soundstage of the LCD2s?
 
Different tubes for Lyr?
Appropriate DAC? Which one? (At the moment my temporary source is just an iPod 5G classic, but it was used as a source also for my other headphones (e.g. Audio-Technica W5000) and I didn't notice any contraction of the soundstage)

 
Looks like you really need a good DAC anyway, your iPod may not "contract" the soundstage but it won't be as wide or deep as an appropriate DAC. It depends on your budget though, how much are you looking to spend?
 
The problem is that the LCD-2 is a very intimate headphone in comparison to many others. I'd actually say it's soundstage is more close to the source material than a vast majority of other headphones, Hifimans included, but where the Hifimans move forward is on instrument separation. The LCD-2s do scale in this regard, depending on what gear you're using. I switched opamps in my solid state amp to some with a more transparent signature and the soundstage opened up vastly in both width and depth (and the depth isn't really lacking on the LCD-2s to begin with). Perhaps some research on tubes for your Lyr in the Tube Rolling thread would provide results.
 
That said, get that source sorted first and foremost, as you'll find it make the biggest difference right off the bat.

 

[johnwmclean]

I have to disagree about the Stax SR-007 being a step up from the LCD-2.  The Stax had been my regular phone for quite a while when I tried my LCD-2.  It didn't take long for me to decide that I definitely preferred the Audeze and sold the Stax a while after that.  I can see different tastes preferring one over the other, but they are at the same level of absolute quality in my opinion.

Fair enough each to their own. In my case I've gone from a Beta22/LCD-2 rev2 to a KGSSHV/Stax SR-007 and I consider it a considerable upgrade over the dynamic set-up.
I had heard the SR-007 countless times and was always underwhelmed, until I heard it with a KG amp, needless to say the investment into top tier Stax gear must include a great amp.

 

[korzena]

I share your impression that depth is quite OK, but the width of soundstage is lacking.
I am considering buying Bifrost however I've read contradictory opinions about its influence on soundstage, so I am not really sure.
My budget for the DAC would be up to $500. I don't want to spend more on it as my experience tells me that I don't really hear big differences between various DACs as long as they are decent ones (both cheaper or more expensive).
In a DAC I would only need SPDIF connection (RCA or BNC) as I am going to use my JKSPDIF mk3 USB to S/PDIF converter (so no USB needed).
 
Quote:

 
Looks like you really need a good DAC anyway, your iPod may not "contract" the soundstage but it won't be as wide or deep as an appropriate DAC. It depends on your budget though, how much are you looking to spend?
 
The problem is that the LCD-2 is a very intimate headphone in comparison to many others. I'd actually say it's soundstage is more close to the source material than a vast majority of other headphones, Hifimans included, but where the Hifimans move forward is on instrument separation. The LCD-2s do scale in this regard, depending on what gear you're using. I switched opamps in my solid state amp to some with a more transparent signature and the soundstage opened up vastly in both width and depth (and the depth isn't really lacking on the LCD-2s to begin with). Perhaps some research on tubes for your Lyr in the Tube Rolling thread would provide results.
 
That said, get that source sorted first and foremost, as you'll find it make the biggest difference right off the bat.

 

[hekeli]

Quote:

Is there a way to "increase" the soundstage of the LCD2s?

 
Smyth Realiser A8.
 

 

[jsplice]

Quote:

Hi, just bought LCD2 (rev.2) and Schiit Lyr (JJ tubes). Great sound and everything!...apart from one thing - I would like the soundstage to be more spacious, to have more air.
The thing is especially apparent to me when listening to soundtracks like Dark Knight, Tron, Inception or some 'spacious' electronic music.
 
Is there a way to "increase" the soundstage of the LCD2s?
 
Different tubes for Lyr?
Appropriate DAC? Which one? (At the moment my temporary source is just an iPod 5G classic, but it was used as a source also for my other headphones (e.g. Audio-Technica W5000) and I didn't notice any contraction of the soundstage)

If your'e running JJ tubes in the Lyr, then yes, definitely upgrade the tubes to improve the soundstage.  You can refer to the Lyr tube rolling thread for more information.  Even the GE's that are another option from Schiit have better soundstage than the JJs.  And yes, upgrading your source I would say is an absolute must if you're running $1000 headphones.

 

[korzena]

Thanks!
GE tubes ordered.
What about the DAC (up to $500, no USB needed)? Would you recommend me some specific DAC with a big (but not artificially expanded) soundstage? Would Schiit Bifrost work well in this regard?
 
Quote:

If your'e running JJ tubes in the Lyr, then yes, definitely upgrade the tubes to improve the soundstage.  You can refer to the Lyr tube rolling thread for more information.  Even the GE's that are another option from Schiit have better soundstage than the JJs.  And yes, upgrading your source I would say is an absolute must if you're running $1000 headphones.

 

[pp312]

Quote:

 
It certainly wasn't dissatisfaction with the LCD-2, which I'm more and more coming to believe is actually underrated here--even the Rev1.
 
But maybe the HE500 will change my mind about that....

 
 
No, it won't. It arrived today and I've just been listening. I expected a mental adjustment and was prepared to give it every chance, but sadly it didn't meet minimum requirements to be a competitor to the LCD-2. Indeed I'd say the current prices here in OZ (LCD=$1180, HE500=$712) well reflects the respective sound quality of these phones.
 
Where to start? I read somewhere recently, a user review, that the HE500 sounds like a recording whereas the LCD sounds like the real thing. To my ears this is spot-on. The HE-500 has none of that sense of real instruments with timbre and sheen that the LCD has. It sounds like a good mid-price phone, like an HD650 with a little more treble in the right places, a little more bite and less bloat. A nice phone, something you could perhaps happily live with...so long as you weren't a regular concert goer and hadn't heard the LCD-2 (either version). Maybe it depends what you're used to and what your idea of good sound is, but if your criterion is live music the LCD is miles ahead.   
 
To add insult to injury the HE-500 is considerably less comfortable despite being less bulky. It just grips too hard and doesn't seem to quite encircle my ears. It's also less efficient. I had to turn the volume way up by comparison, which surprised me. I'd got the impression they were more or less equal.
 
I wish I could give the HE-500 better marks. It's had such good reviews; even Tyll Hertsens seemed to prefer it to the LCD-2 (Rev1). It just lacks magic to me. If anything it's made me appreciate just how good my phone is, which I guess I knew but which only a comparison to an equally respected phone can legitimize. I won't even pine for the Rev 2 now; I have a feeling the Rev2 would lose some of the Rev1s special magic. I'm sitting pat.

 

[OPR8R]

I'm currently listening to my LCD-2's through a Kenwood KR-6030 vintage speaker amp.  Compared with my Headroom Micro (huge bang for buck) the soundstage through the Kenwood is much more open.  This leads me to believe your level of enjoyment with these phones is very much amp dependent.  I don't know to which modern amp I'll upgrade (V200, Mjolnir, BHA-1, or something else) but it'll be fun finding out what these LCD's are really capable of.  Anyone have one of these amps that's heard their LCD's through a vintage speaker amp?