[Big Al]

Quote:

Originally Posted by atx L-O-L ! I said, the de-valuation of the supermacro v1 effectively makes the sound worse, because you've paid more than its currently worth.

OK, I bought a SuperMacro V1 here's the breakdown:

(1) SM V1 $249.99
4 feature 49.99
2X Buffer buf634 9.99
OP627 39.99
S&H 4.99

Total $354.95

I auditioned the V1 for 3 days, Xin annouces release V2, Xin annouces free upgrade for 30 day customers to V2, a few days later Xin annouces release V3 but there's an increase in price but he gives option to keep old board with upgrade. Hmmm, I ask myself wow I get to own 2 SM a v1 and a V3 but it'll cost me an additional $205 plus $4.99 for 2 complete units. I forgo the upgrade and end up returned the V1 for refund and go back to Xin's website and order up a V3 online:

Product : Quantity : Price
SuperMacro-3-4F amp : 1 : 349.99
2x BUF634 soldered on : 1 : 0.00 Free til 4/31/05
Clear case : 1 : 0.00

Subtotal : 349.99
Shipping : 4.99
TOTAL : $354.98

You're right ATX, the V1 does sound worse now. I lost the OP627 out this but I got a V3 for .03 cents more than for my V1. OBTW the $210 that I didn't spend on the V3 upgrade went to Todd The Vinyl Junkie for a brand spankin' new SR-71 which should get here before my V3.
It didn't make sense for me to upgrade and have 2 different versions of the SM, now what's the economic term for this "diminishing return" and/or the V3 upgrade exceeded my "economic marginal utility".

 

[TooNice]

Well... Would it be better if the SM1 retains its release price, increase the SM2 price by $20, the SM3 another $30, and the SM4 another $50 etc. etc.?

That way, the SM1 would always "sound the same" on the basis that its costs remain constant.

It certainly doesn't make sense from a business point. Fact is, flagship products carry a premium, its always done. When the flagship is updated or any product for that matter is replaced, the price must remain close to the old one or eventually, it'll get so expensive no one will buy one. But the old one can't be as good as the same as the new one otherwise whats the point of the update? (It doesn't make the old one poor either though, just a bit less than the new one - improvement tends to be incremental so its probably not going to change much)

So the choice would be to depreciate the older technology... or never releasing a new product! And since thats not going to happen (even the SR-71 will probably get updated at some point, and the choice between raising the price of the new product or not will have to be made), then people might as well never buy anything...

Or would it be better for Xin to have released the V2, designed the V3, then relax for half a/a year before releasing it just so that people do not feel "ripped off".

 

[Big Al]

I personally didn't feel ripped off. I just didn't see any reason to own a V1 and a V3 for the money. The V1 sounds fantastic and still does, now will the V3 sound any better, I don't know, but I paid .03 cents more. And Xin cut more than a fair deal to his V1 customer base. I just didn't see a point in keeping last year's model when I can get the latest model for the same price.

 

[Atracdsp]

I plan on using my v1 while running. I didn't want to risk breaking it previously but now that I'll have v3 at home,I won't worry about it. Plus I'll have great sound when I'm out. Supermacro has been a lot of fun,opamps, buffers ,caps,all that stuff

 

[digitalcat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Al I personally didn't feel ripped off. I just didn't see any reason to own a V1 and a V3 for the money. The V1 sounds fantastic and still does, now will the V3 sound any better, I don't know, but I paid .03 cents more. And Xin cut more than a fair deal to his V1 customer base. I just didn't see a point in keeping last year's model when I can get the latest model for the same price.

You can sell it. The point is if you sell it for around $150 then you actually get some money back by upgrading to the latest model. Now the question is whether you can sell it at that price or not. As far as I can see there isn't any other portable amp around $150 price range that sounds as good as a supermacro 1, so people would be more than happy to pay $150 or more for your supermacro, even though it's a used unit. Now if you would feel guilty about making a profit by upgrading , you can always sell it at a lower price, like $100, which still pretty much covers your upgrade cost. From a buyer's perspective, $100 for a killer amp that once sold for over 250? I call that a steal

 

[Big Al]

Quote:

Originally Posted by digitalcat You can sell it. The point is if you sell it for around $150 then you actually get some money back by upgrading to the latest model. Now the question is whether you can sell it at that price or not. As far as I can see there isn't any other portable amp around $150 price range that sounds as good as a supermacro 1, so people would be more than happy to pay $150 or more for your supermacro, even though it's a used unit. Now if you would feel guilty about making a profit by upgrading , you can always sell it at a lower price, like $100, which still pretty much covers your upgrade cost. From a buyer's perspective, $100 for a killer amp that once sold for over 250? I call that a steal

In my case I would have had to sell mine for $210 just to break even, I had the extra OP627 in them.

I paid $354.95 for my V1 + $194.92 ( V3 upgrade and parts and labor for 2nd unit) +$9.99 (AC/DC Adapter) Total $559.86 - $354.98 (cost of a V3 today online w/4 switch) = $204.88 ~ price to sell my V1 to break even. Even if I put together the parts to build my V3 to save the $40 assembly fee:

$559.86 - $40 - $354.98 = Total $164.88 to break even. Maybe if you're talking about a vanilla V1 without the 4 switches and OP627 then you might make like $40-$50.

I'd be losing money selling the V1 for $150, whether I put the unit together myself or had Xin do it.

 

[atx]

Quote:

I just didn't see a point in keeping last year's model when I can get the latest model for the same price

Bingo!

Finally I'm not alone. If you have an SM1 and SM3, chances are you won't be listening to the SM1 because it's inferior in sound quality. I think you'll end up selling the SM1 anyway eventually.

Btw, nice move in purchasing the sr71. Now you'll have 2 amps that's worth keeping. You could also have gone with the Portaphile for $200, as a replacement for the v1 (if you want to think of it that way).

Quote:

Well... Would it be better if the SM1 retains its release price, increase the SM2 price by $20, the SM3 another $30, and the SM4 another $50 etc. etc.?

I think it would've been better if SM3 kept the old price of $250, but instead of discontinuing SM2, continue to offer SM2 at a discounted price of $200.

This way, SM1 owners get to upgrade to SM2 for free, and at the same time, their amp won't be a dinosaur, and their warranty will still be intact.


Quote:

I plan on using my v1 while running. I didn't want to risk breaking it previously but now that I'll have v3 at home,I won't worry about it.

You have a point here. I bought a portaphile precisely because I didn't want to risk breaking the sr71. But at an extra cost of $200 to get a second supermacro, you could have chosen a different amp instead of 2 revisions of the same amp. e.g. $200 for portaphile, $300 for Gilmore lite.

 

[digitalcat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Al In my case I would have had to sell mine for $210 just to break even, I had the extra OP627 in them. I paid $354.95 for my V1 + $194.92 ( V3 upgrade and parts and labor for 2nd unit) +$9.99 (AC/DC Adapter) Total $559.86 - $354.98 (cost of a V3 today online w/4 switch) = $204.88 ~ price to sell my V1 to break even. Even if I put together the parts to build my V3 to save the $40 assembly fee: $559.86 - $40 - $354.98 = Total $164.88 to break even. Maybe if you're talking about a vanilla V1 without the 4 switches and OP627 then you might make like $40-$50. I'd be losing money selling the V1 for $150, whether I put the unit together myself or had Xin do it.

So it's a beefed up V1 that cost you 354.95, that makes it reasonable to sell it for $204, which would probably still sound better than any $200 portable out there. Even if you sell it for $150 or so, you had effectively paid 50 bucks for the upgrade, not that unreasonable i think.

Off the topic , I for one wouldn't spend that much for extra features, maybe a bass boost or a 4p-4s switch is okay but the rest don't make a noticable difference in sound quality as far as I can tell. Heck I even left out the blue LED when I purchased my first supermini. Ah the good old days, it cost me only $80 and sound better than my $199 total airhead(old version).

 

[MASantos]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Al $559.86 - $40 - $354.98 = Total $164.88 to break even. Maybe if you're talking about a vanilla V1 without the 4 switches and OP627 then you might make like $40-$50. I'd be losing money selling the V1 for $150, whether I put the unit together myself or had Xin do it.

Yes but no one will buy a v1 for 150 if the new supermini3 is being released and will be better. And the v1 can not be upgraded in your case.

Manuel

 

[digitalcat]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MASantos Yes but no one will buy a v1 for 150 if the new supermini3 is being released and will be better. And the v1 can not be upgraded in your case. Manuel

I don't think the reasonable resell price for a V1 would go below $150. It's all performance relative. If it sounds good, it's good. Ask yourself if you can find anything that sound better within that price range, used or new. If it really happens that the new supermini is indeed better than V1 and sells for $150, then we can start a petition and ask Xin not to be so passionate about making his product better, 'coz it really hurts us finacially.

 

[TooNice]

Well, can't please everyone.

For all we know, some customers may actually like Xin's short product cycles.

It is one way to differentiate from the competition.

 

[Big Al]

Quote:

Originally Posted by MASantos Yes but no one will buy a v1 for 150 if the new supermini3 is being released and will be better. And the v1 can not be upgraded in your case. Manuel

You may be correct. Just got back from Xin's site:

XIN SuperMini-3 Headphone Amp 3-channel design at the lowest cost, and upgradeable to SuperMacro-3! From $149.99

Interesting state "From $149.99...more options and features??? And can be upgraded to a V3 hmmmmmmmm.

Bet Xin is going to add another line item for V1's that have been already upgraded to V3 already to be allowed to be upgraded but for a price.

 

[Cortes]

Hi guys,
Does anyone know how compare the SuperMini-3 (~150$) to the
SuperMacro V1??. I mean the new SuperMini3 at $150 is as good as the old SuperMacro V1 that cost $250?

Regards

 

[alanz]

I can't see how anyone can compare a Super-Mini3 to a Super-Macro3... the Super-Mini3 isn't even complete yet.

As for an upgrade path from mini to macro, I suspect that since they'll likely use the same case, it's just a matter of removing and replacing the appropriate circuit board(s)... hence an upgrade path.

 

[atx]

Quote:

XIN SuperMini-3 Headphone Amp 3-channel design at the lowest cost, and upgradeable to SuperMacro-3! From $149.99

This is such a shrewd business decision! Anyone who is thinking of buying an amp on a budget would have to consider the supermini-3. Think of it as a down payment on a supermacro-3 six months from now (or maybe supermacro-4 by then!)

You just can't go wrong.