[Eric_C]

@jessica_fae
By default, HD 25-1 comes with pleather earpads. These are good for isolation, but can be warm and exaggerate the clamping force.
Certain models come with velour earpads (even if they don't, you can order them for ~¥1,127.25 a pair, excluding shipping) that sacrifice some isolation for a great deal more comfort. As a HD 25-1 owner, I've found the velour pads to help a great deal with comfort.

 

[John Willett]

Quote:

@jessica_fae
By default, HD 25-1 comes with pleather earpads. These are good for isolation, but can be warm and exaggerate the clamping force.
Certain models come with velour earpads (even if they don't, you can order them for ~¥1,127.25 a pair, excluding shipping) that sacrifice some isolation for a great deal more comfort. As a HD 25-1 owner, I've found the velour pads to help a great deal with comfort.

The HD 25-1 II comes with both the leatherette earpads (fitted) *and* the velour ones (in the box) - and also a bag to keep them in.
 
Isolation is only 3dB worse than the leatherette.

 

[Eric_C]

Quote:

The HD 25-1 II comes with both the leatherette earpads (fitted) *and* the velour ones (in the box) - and also a bag to keep them in.
 

 
That's not always true. For example, there's the "Basic Edition" that I purchased from Juno.co.uk:
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/163153/hd25-1-appreciation-thread/1020#post_6891366
 
And from what I recall, not all versions of the HD 25-1 II come with the bag; some came with a semi-hard casing?

 

[jessica_fae]

I was able to do another long round of auditioning tonight at Yodobashi Camera in Kawasaki. They have a nice listening wall with chairs and practically every headphone one could imagine.  Not as nice as the specialty shop in Akihabara, but with a noisy shop environment it really helped judge isolation.
 
This was much harder this time because I focused more on the ones I liked and added in the Sennheiser HD25-1 mk2 and Denon AH-D2000.  I was also able to listen to the HD280pro on their setup and A/B them. I did lots of swapping and switching so I was able to really compare and group impressions.
 
I will start with the easy ones
 
HD280pro:  After lots of listening and comparing I have developed a new respect for these.  They still strike me as treble hot and bass light, they don't seal well, they sound better when I push my hands on the backs to reduce vibration and seal better, but they are very clean and very easy to hear into the mix.  They also have deep bass. Yes confusing (how can they be bass light yet and have deep bass). Deep bass is the kind that is rarely added to mixes.  I have a few tracks with very deep bass that comes through wonderfully on some phones and almost disappears on others (maybe in the 30hz range). But normal bass (~50hz?) sounds light on the HD280pro.  I was able to A/B against the Sony 7506.  I think overall the 7506 is a better balanced monitor headphone, but the HD280 is really quite good.  Maybe the HD280 is better at vocal and treble end detail while the 7506 has more bass detail.
 
Sony 7506: just to recap. I think this would be my monitor of choice after listening and comparing now.  Really quite cheap in Japan (9000yen from SOUNDHOUSE.jp an online music supply store).  I really like the 7506.  I am almost certain I will buy a pair at some point.
 
ATH-M50:  strange but they did not impress me as much in this listening session.  I was able to do much better comparisons this time.  Definitely a good monitor headphone, but right now the sony 7506 sounds really good. The M50 has a slightly tipped down treble so the balance is more like what typical headphones sound like.
 
With the monitor headphones, the idea is to understand the headphone, how it behaves so one can use it as a tool to mix and not be biased by the headphone.  And it needs to allow one to hear into the mix.  Both the HD280pro and 7506 do this, but I think the 7506 is better balanced.
 
Now to the more difficult ones.
 
Denon DN-HP700: I read that these are "repackaged" ATH-pro500 so I compared them and to all the others. Today I had a much better impression of these, especially after comparing to the HD25-1.  They are not the same as the ATH-Pro500, not even close.  Maybe they share some parts but Denon did something to the HP700s. They seal much better, are much more comfortable, have cleaner bass-mids-and-highs and nice punchy bass.  For the price and a DJ oriented headphone I think these are really quite something.  For a mid-high-level DJ headphone (11,000円 range) these are quite tempting (more so than the Pioneer DJ1000s).  I want to compare against the Technics DH1200 more carefully next time.
 
But then there are the higher priced models
 
Sennheiser HD25-1 mk2:  OK first impression was; fantastic isolation, a lot more comfortable than I expected, amazing punchy bass, clean sound so one can hear into the mix.  Going back and forth to the HD25 gave me impressions and listening to them continuously for several tracks gave me another impression.  It is a very good headphone, but it is different.  I was very confused by it.  At one time I really thought it was amazing, and another time I thought that it was really recessed and bass heavy with a closed in-the-head feeling (kind of how the DN-HP700 sounded on my first impression). It really depended on which headphone I was coming/going to compared to the HD25.  It wasn't until I compared it to the 7506 that I really could put it into perspective.  It is unique, I think that is the best way to describe it.  It is a bit monitor like, but deep bass is not as good/clean as the 7506, HD280pro, D2000 or HDJ2000.  Mid bass is amazing and the mids and treble are clean but recessed.  If one "adjusts oneself" to the HD25-1mk2 it really sounds good, but I think it is different.  I can see why some DJs like it for the bass punch and isolation. I can also see why people can fall in love with these headphones for enjoyment listening especially since the mid-low bass is so punchy and amazing and after adjusting one's ears to the HD25 sound they do sound great. I think it depends on the type of music though. They strike me as a monitor with a bass tune. It took a long time for me to figure this one out. Not what I am looking for since the mids-highs are too recessed (mid-bass too strong) for my style of music. Also these are really quite expensive in Japan.
 
Technics RP-DH1200: didn't sound quite as good today, but wow still sounded fantastic.  But it really is quite heavy on the head.  Impressions from before basically unchanged.  Still a top candidate for me, but I want to compare to the HP700 again.
 
Denon AH-D2000: wow. like a wonderful blending of monitor and listening enjoyment headphones. I think the thing that amazed me most was comparing the D2000 with the pioneer HDJ-2000. They struck me as similar in many ways but not on a surface level. On first impression the D2000 and HDJ2000 sound really different. The HDJ2000 is a DJ headphone with a more emphasized/punchy bass, the D2000 has a wonderful "open" soundstage even more so than the HDJ2000s.  But my impression was that these could almost be the same headphone with different tunes (one in a larger enclosure (D2000) to give a more out-of-head and pleasant vocal/piano sound, and one in a smaller enclosure with a DJ bass/punch emphasis.  I was very tempted by the D2000s. But I had to remind myself that I was not looking for an enjoyment headphone. They are amazing headphones. If I didn't own Stax I would be even more tempted.  But I think they are not quite "monitors" in that the treble feels a bit rolled off and they sound just a little to "nice".  Definitely not DJ headphones. They are in my "monitor" list, but I think they are just a bit too much a "listening" headphone and not up to the level of the stax for me.  Also more the 2x the price of the 7506s.
 
Pioneer HDJ-2000: sounded a little different today, but still excellent.  But the bass really struck me as wonderful and punchy. Almost like HD25-1 punchy.  To me the HDJ-2000 has really excellent mids and highs (almost D2000 like with a bit of 7506 on the very top). To me the HDJ2000 is like combining the bass punch of the HD25, the deep bass of a 7506 or D2000 and almost as nice mids and highs as the D2000, with almost 7506 top end sparkle.  Still a top candidate.  Not a perfect headphone, not to stax levels, but as a DJ headphone it has much better bass punch than the stax, designed to work in a live environment, and can simulate a club environment mix. These really stand out. Also different enough from the headphones I already own.
 
So things have not changed that much. The Sennheiser HD25-1mk2 and Denon AH-D2000 are excellent headphones, and if I was looking for something different they would be higher on my list.  Denon DH-HP700 is looking interesting again (as a cheaper DJ alternative). 
 
I think right now I am debating between buying a 7506 AND a cheaper DJ headphone (Denon HP700 or Technics DH1200) or using my HD280pro (which I understand better now) and buying a Pioneer HDJ-2000. The HDJ2000 really impresses me.  I think right now I am 95% certain I will buy the HDJ-2000s.
 
edit: note that this was all auditioned in a relatively loud electonics store with announcements and music playing in the background.  Headphone amp was a fostec 8 port model (functional but basic), cables were cheap. As a comparision between models this was all the same and tested isolation quite well, but in absolute sense maybe something like the AH-D2000 would sound better in a quiet studio/home environment.

 

[Armaegis]

I'm surprised you couldn't get a good seal on the HD280. It took a little bit of wiggling to get it just right for me, but once I did it was probably the best isolation I've heard (maybe tied with Beyer 770) short of iems.
 
If you like the Sony 7506, look up the V6 which is the exact same headphone from before they changed their numbering, and for half or 2/3 the price.
 
The M50s get way too much love here, and while I don't deny that they're good cans for the price, their U-shaped curve and punchiness don't suit me at all and I much prefer other offerings in its price range.
 
If you ever buy the D2000 in the future, spend the extra few bucks and get the leather J$ eadpads. I was actually kind of disappointed with the D5000 when I first heard it (maybe because the price tag was so high and I was expecting more), but the new pads increased comfort dramatically and thus psychologically (psychosomatically?) made me like the music more.
 
Given your current choices, I say pick up the HDJ-2000 and find a V6.

 

[jessica_fae]

I thin
Quote:

I'm surprised you couldn't get a good seal on the HD280. It took a little bit of wiggling to get it just right for me, but once I did it was probably the best isolation I've heard (maybe tied with Beyer 770) short of iems.
 
If you like the Sony 7506, look up the V6 which is the exact same headphone from before they changed their numbering, and for half or 2/3 the price.
 
Given your current choices, I say pick up the HDJ-2000 and find a V6.

I think my problem with the HD280 is that I find the pads really stiff.  My HD280s are now almost 4 years old and just now it seems that the pads are softening up. The one in the store today was a lot more still than mine at home.  I also think it might be the shape of my head which is also a bit smaller (being a girl you know).  I have to go to push the headband all the way up to the top and there is very little pressure on my head.  But I am starting to like the HD280s a lot more.
 
In Japan the V6 and 7506 are almost the same price and the 7506 are a lot more common.  soundhouse.jp has the V6 for 8300yen and the 7506 for 9180yen.  For example BicCamera, Yodobashi, and Ishibashi (all major electronic or musician stores) only carry the 7506
 
I will do one more round of auditioning in a few weeks and it will most likely be the HDJ-2000, DN-HP700, DP-DH1200 in the final check with me sticking with the HD280s for awhile on the monitor side.

 

[SoSpecial]

If you can, see if you can audition Technics RP-DJ1200, if memory serves me correctly those are the only Technic's which are anywhere close to popular.
 
 
You might also wanna look up Allen and Heath Xone XD 53, those have quiet the reputation as well.

 

[jessica_fae]

 
Quote:

If you can, see if you can audition Technics RP-DJ1200, if memory serves me correctly those are the only Technic's which are anywhere close to popular.
 
You might also wanna look up Allen and Heath Xone XD 53, those have quiet the reputation as well.

Last weekend at club ageha in odaiba I saw one of the DJs had Xone XD53s, I don't remember his name but he did a nice house music set. I have heard good things about the XD-53 too.  I think I saw some at the Akihabara shop.  I will be going back there for my next audition round.

 

[Armaegis]

And here's a bunch more DJ cans just to add to the confusion

http://www.skratchworx.com/reviews/headphones_2010.php

 

[jessica_fae]

Quote:

And here's a bunch more DJ cans just to add to the confusion

http://www.skratchworx.com/reviews/headphones_2010.php

Wow great article.  Thank you and curse you. More confusion definitely.
But of the ones I have listened to, his impressions matched mine quite well which is good.I wish he would have had the Denon DN-HP700 in his comparison.
 
Interesting the Xone XD-53 are OEM manufactured by Audio Technica for Allen and Heath. 53mm driver might make it a pro700 variant but it could also be a completely custom design.  I will audition these. He liked the ATH-pro700 / DN-HP1000 quite a bit.  But I am almost certain that Denon has stopped making the DN-HP1000.  They are no longer on their website and no longer in any of the stores.
 
Hard to decide between a basic ~10,000 yen (disposable-ish) DJ headphone or the Pioneers.  Or forget the whole DJ headphone thing now until I am closer to having a full set of material and just focus on composing.  But I am sensing that having at least a basic DJ headphone now will help me mix as a contrast to a monitor headphone.  Well a few more weeks to think and then audition again.

 

[Armaegis]

Sometimes I deliberately overwhelm myself with options and create the indecisiveness just so I *don't* buy any new toys.

 

[jessica_fae]

The funny thing about my current confusion is that now I am leaning back toward picking up the Technics RP-DH1200 again. 
I almost bought them on the first audition day and they impressed me again yesterday. And they will be out of production soon.
Really stood out from the other 10,000-15,000yen DJ headphones and 1/2 the price of the HDJ2000s.
And the skratchworks reviewer really liked them too. He didn't like their comfort, but they were perfectly comfortable on my head.
I was just watching the Armin Van Buuren video "In and out of love" and they were wearing DH1200s in that video.
They are cheap enough that I don't feel bad about buying them.
I can always pick up some HDJ-2000s later if I really want a step up in a DJ headphone.
I may surprise myself and pick some up tomorrow....

 

[jessica_fae]

Well I did my last listening sessions this week.  I was in a loud music store earlier in the week where I could test how the headphones would work for isolation and how they would sound when one can barely hear them (which qualities come through when fighting with other outside music).  And I also listened in a perfect headphone store (high-end CD players, amps, quiet).  But I also payed a lot more attention to how the headphone sits on my head, isolate, and feel.  I really noticed that my previous top pick Technics RH1200 really does not isolate well at all and sits on my head quite strange.  So I decided to remove it from my final picks.
 
So the final 5 are: Sennheiser HD280, Sony MDR-7506, Audio Technica ATH-M50, Denon DN-HP700, and Pioneer HDJ2000.  I already own the HD280 and it is in this comparison because if I pick it then I don't need to buy a new headphone.
 
So I listened to 3 monitor headphones (HD280, MDR-7506, ATH-M50) and two DJ headphones (HP700, HDJ-2000).  I will say this again, but this whole quest has really made me respect the Sennheiser HD280 a lot more.  I finally understand them (or how they interact with my ears) since I was able to listen to them with a frequency sweep (Abelton Live tool).  At least for my ears they have a dip around the 50-70hz range. The 30-40hz range actually sounds stronger (and tighter) than the 60hz range.  And most produced/radio tracks tend to not mix in 30hz and 40hz sounds (very few speakers can drive that low, so many produced tracks start to roll off at 50hz).   At least this is how I am understanding the HD280 headphone now and why it has this strange zero-bass-no-wait-WOW-killer-bass schizophrenia.
 
MDR-7506/V6 and ATH-M50 both sound great.  Actually all three monitor headphones are really good, but slightly different balances and different strengths.  I think for really serious studio work one should have all three (or a collection of monitors).  In this session it was the ATH-M50 that stood out a bit more, but it really has a more bass emphasis and recessed highs compared to the HD280 and 7506.  Mid-bass and lower midrange sound great on the ATH-M50 but trying to dig into a mix or check for high-frequency issues would be more difficult on the M50 while it would be really easy with either the 7506 or HD280.  But the M50 would be a better contrast to the HD280 than the 7506. Another thing I noticed was that the HD280 and M50 sounded much more refined in the mid and upper-mid range than the 7506 (fine texture of sounds, micro-dynamics...).  The 7506 has a fantastic frequency response and deep deep bass is strong and detailed though.  I can really see all three having value and use in a studio monitoring situation.  But the M50 is slightly DJ biased (slight bass emphasis, slight recessed high range).  If it was marketed as a DJ headphone I would believe it, if it was marketed as a monitor headphone I would believe it.
 
I also realized in this whole comparison that in general that DJ headphones are really quite far from the studio monitor character.  Except the Pioneer HDJ2000.  Of all the DJ headphones, the HDJ-2000 really captured more of the monitor nature than all the others. Also the ATH-M50 (it also falls in between) which is the most DJ-like of the monitor headphones.  
 
The Pioneer HDJ-2000 is a really good DJ headphone.  It sounds good in a loud environment letting more of the sound details come through. Most DJ headphones only sound like bass-bass-bass when fighting in a loud environment.  The HDJ2000 actually was still able to let some detail through.  In quiet listening, the HDJ2000 was actually similar in character to the ATH-M50.  It made me wonder if the ATH-M50 might actually work as a DJ headphone in a loud environment.  It really might.
 
In the end I was really close to deciding that my HD280 might actually be good enough and that I do not need another headphone in the monitor/DJ category.  I was also close to deciding on ALL OF THEM and trying to work out a plan to buy all 4 headphones I liked over the next 6 months . 
The HP700 is a really interesting headphone.  Sometimes is less then average, and other times it really seemed to have great punchy bass (7506 like) or with really clear upper midrange and highs (HD280 like) or with the ability to hear details and subtleties.  Almost Sennheiser HD25 like.  I almost want to buy one just so I can live with one for awhile to figure it out.
 
My final decision was really based on the fact that I really like the HD280 now and I was thinking that I need/want something to be a good counter point to the HD280.  The HP700 is a little too much DJ-only and the HDJ-2000 worked better as a DJ headphone in a loud environment. If I owned the HDJ-2000 I would have little need for the HP700 (except out of curiosity to try to figure it out).  The MDR-7506 is really very close to the HD280 (7506 is slightly better in the bass region, and the HD280 is slightly better in the midrange and high end) and seemed too close to make sense.  The M50 and HDJ-2000 offered the best counter-point to the HD280.  
 
In the end I decided to buy the Pioneer HDJ-2000.  
 
But I can see myself slowly acquiring the others (M50, 7506, HP700) over the next year or two....

 

[Acix]

I'll highly recommend the GMP 8.35 D Monitor, for studio use and DJ. Here more info: http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/406658/the-german-maestro-gmp-8-35-d-monitor-in-the-studio-serious-about-audio-indeed

 

[jessica_fae]

Thanks for the comment Acix, but not interested in the headphone.
But I do like your music. very cool tracks!