[davidmolliere]

  To me the difference in balanced vs non-balanced output is huge on Z5 and not that big on Z7, although there is still a difference. 
So to me the pha-3 + z5 balanced combo is perfect while the pha-3 + z7 is just good (really good with a custom cable) for home usage.

 
Thanks !
 
Good to know, XBA-Z5 not yet available here but I might check it, especially if it pairs well with the PHA-3.
Still have to try the IE800 on the PHA-3, but this amp output impedance suggest it's probably not going to be the best choice with a 16ohm IEM.
 

 
Tonight was the first time to listen to my Z7 for longer than 2 hours just looking for things to listen to. Comfort is great. I'm really liking the smoothness of the kimber kable. 

 
I would have thought Kimber cables would rather bring more transparency than add already very present smoothness, can you elaborate ?
Thanks !
 

So between Pandora Hope VI and Z7, which is a better all rounder? Sounds like the Hope VI is a faster phone...

 
The Hope VI comfort (weight +100g vs Z7 and pads to shallow, although apparently later SN are better in that regard) is really a downer but I am a sucker for Final Audio tuning it bring emotions like nothing else I have heard. The highs are smooths and sparkling and detailed but it has a BA driver dedicated with its hybrid design, hard to beat. Faster headphone no doubt but then you don't have to move those 70mm drivers  Timbre and decay have a lifelike quality... oh my. The 8ohm impedance and good efficiency make them easy to drive even with a phone. But as I said comfort is a killer, it hurts after 30mn or so. Too bad really  Make the Hope VI as comfortable as the Z7 and it would be the endgame for me. Maybe the Hope X but they look very much like the VI so I fear the issue won't be fixed.
 
I am not sure yet how to qualify the Z7, but I am not sure I would say all rounder so far, as they seem to be more dependent on what I am throwing at them. I see them as laid back headphones, not fatiguing at all. They are said to be dark and they are I need to get re-used to it... There is that sense of "speaker like power" that made me buy them and that is quite unlike any headphone I've had. There is a sense of effortlessness in the way they sound. Bass can be gorgeous or frustratingly messy (I guess maybe mastering is to fault on some tracks, not sure). Imaging feel great to me, at the same time I feel like there is a lack of transparency. I lack the "texture" of the instruments like I get from the Hope VI. But I still need to spend more time with them and burn everything including my brain in
 
 

==== edit after several hours of extra listen ====
 
I think my early perception of Z7 is largely due to a lot of IE800 listening this past few months, and possibly my long experience with SE846 (white filter) and Pandora Hope VI. The more I listen to the Z7, the better my ears (and or brain) get used to the Z7 sound signature. One thing is certain after more critical listening of songs I know by heart in different genres, the PHA-3 makes a big difference especially imaging is way more precise.
 
I enjoyed listening again to Buena Vista Social Club for instance. Songs like The Kooks "Tick of time" are eerily three dimensional for a closed headphone (or semi-closed, not sure how much the vent is influencing sound here).
 
I like Jazz and Classical with the Z7, I know it's not usually something you would say of a "dark" headphone but still, the soundstage and the effortless power of the driver (I lack a more technical word) make it very enjoyable to listen to. 
 
Oddly enough, bassy stuff like Deadmau5 (think Strobe), M83 "Midnight city", or Grum "Can't shake this feeling" or the usual Daft Punk "Get Lucky" feel "balanced" in terms of bass not overpowering the song and I discover unknown subtlety in the bass. Another nice song to play is Robin Thick "Blurred Lines", quite a display of what the Z7 is capable of. Different genre, but Jamiroquai "Hot Tequilla Brown" is nicely rendered too. So is Lorde "400 Lux" or Lilly Wood and the Prick "Middle of the night". This is strange as in some songs (I have to list them, just to get a grasp) it feels just too powerfully rendered. I have read some resonance issues around 1KHz, maybe that's it.
 
With rock, I felt it was kind of a mixed bag but again maybe mastering is to fault. Dire Straits "Money for nothing" is spot on and very enjoyable, Guns N' Roses "Coma" deep bass are almost physical and things are nicely "together". Spin Doctors "Jimmy Olsen's blues" is also very coherent with a sense of depth and imaging that really struck me (more recent "So bad" was also a thrill to listen to).

 

[zazex]

  The Sony's are keepers.
The last days there were a couple of moments I decided to return them. Their excentric behaviour with loudness and dynamics. Never did I have to adjust the volume as much! And their way of trying to sound like speakers simply doesn't work with every recording, with some albums it has a negative effect at the width of the sound and it puts some instruments too far back in the mix.
But then I played a couple of CDs that simply never sounded this good, Illuminated by the 360s and The Tennessee Fire and At Dawn by My Morning Jacket for instance. Both for complete different reasons. The 360s sounded never as full, the guitars having more body and grunt. My Morning Jacket's At Dawn at times sounds like a 70s recording, with a round blooming bass and there's something in the soundstage, the ambiance which is really special.

 
"There's something about voice and acoustic guitar together that creates the impression of fullness. Maybe it's Trevor hollAnd's rich production.  Regardless, My Morning Jacket could be the perfect soundtrack to a summer road trip, or just something you wrap around yourself on the way to work each morning."
 
 
My Morning Jacket
At Dawn
Darla; 2001
Pitchfork Review By Christopher Dare; June 5, 2001
http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/5533-at-dawn/

 

[osiris1]

   
Thanks !
 
Good to know, XBA-Z5 not yet available here but I might check it, especially if it pairs well with the PHA-3.
Still have to try the IE800 on the PHA-3, but this amp output impedance suggest it's probably not going to be the best choice with a 16ohm IEM.
 
I would have thought Kimber cables would rather bring more transparency than add already very present smoothness, can you elaborate ?
Thanks !
 
==== edit after several hours of extra listen ====
 
I think my early perception of Z7 is largely due to a lot of IE800 listening this past few months, and possibly my long experience with SE846 (white filter) and Pandora Hope VI. The more I listen to the Z7, the better my ears (and or brain) get used to the Z7 sound signature. One thing is certain after more critical listening of songs I know by heart in different genres, the PHA-3 makes a big difference especially imaging is way more precise.
 
I enjoyed listening again to Buena Vista Social Club for instance. Songs like The Kooks "Tick of time" are eerily three dimensional for a closed headphone (or semi-closed, not sure how much the vent is influencing sound here).
 
I like Jazz and Classical with the Z7, I know it's not usually something you would say of a "dark" headphone but still, the soundstage and the effortless power of the driver (I lack a more technical word) make it very enjoyable to listen to. 
 
Oddly enough, bassy stuff like Deadmau5 (think Strobe), M83 "Midnight city", or Grum "Can't shake this feeling" or the usual Daft Punk "Get Lucky" feel "balanced" in terms of bass not overpowering the song and I discover unknown subtlety in the bass. Another nice song to play is Robin Thick "Blurred Lines", quite a display of what the Z7 is capable of. Different genre, but Jamiroquai "Hot Tequilla Brown" is nicely rendered too. So is Lorde "400 Lux" or Lilly Wood and the Prick "Middle of the night". This is strange as in some songs (I have to list them, just to get a grasp) it feels just too powerfully rendered. I have read some resonance issues around 1KHz, maybe that's it.
 
With rock, I felt it was kind of a mixed bag but again maybe mastering is to fault. Dire Straits "Money for nothing" is spot on and very enjoyable, Guns N' Roses "Coma" deep bass are almost physical and things are nicely "together". Spin Doctors "Jimmy Olsen's blues" is also very coherent with a sense of depth and imaging that really struck me (more recent "So bad" was also a thrill to listen to).

thanks for the comparison with the PHVI. I briefly tried both and agree the Z7 is super comfy, although I never did feel the PHVI was uncomfortable, with my ears just inside the cups. 
still trying to decide between them. might go have another listen. 

 

[davidmolliere]

  thanks for the comparison with the PHVI. I briefly tried both and agree the Z7 is super comfy, although I never did feel the PHVI was uncomfortable, with my ears just inside the cups. 
still trying to decide between them. might go have another listen. 

 
I have big ears unfortunately but no matter the size, your ear doesn't touch the driver ? I know they apparently fixed the padding later down the line, mine was in the early SNs. Would be a nice thing ! I should try to get padding fixed, still the weight would be respectably quite above (almost 25% over the Z7).
 
Don't forget to give the Z7 a fair comparaison, it needs to be driven, playing it out of a smartphone or most players won't do it justice! Unamped, the Hope VI will just sound superb already, not the case with the Z7.

 

[dL.]

Just picked up the unbalanced Kimber Kable. I'll post my impression shortly but so far... WOW... I might have to edit my review.
 
It's nowhere close to finish burning in, but the sound is a lot more transparent and there's no more of my so-called grainy darkness anymore. It has punch, it has clarity, it has highs and low, and it has wider soundstage. Paired with the WA7... it's musically amazing and I'm sure Mike would attest to that.
 
I can't believe the cable would go from returning the headphone, to possibly selling the Sennheiser instead.
 
We will see how it sounds as it continues to burn in...
 
dL

 

[osiris1]

   
I have big ears unfortunately but no matter the size, your ear doesn't touch the driver ? I know they apparently fixed the padding later down the line, mine was in the early SNs. Would be a nice thing ! I should try to get padding fixed, still the weight would be respectably quite above (almost 25% over the Z7).
 
Don't forget to give the Z7 a fair comparaison, it needs to be driven, playing it out of a smartphone or most players won't do it justice! Unamped, the Hope VI will just sound superb already, not the case with the Z7.

the ears do touch but not tightly. I don't remember it being uncomfortable for me. 
 
I didn't amp the Z7 when testing and I remember it sounding a bit lethargic. must try again. Hope VI was ok unamped. will have to test them side by side. 

 

[qsk78]

Don't forget to give the Z7 a fair comparaison, it needs to be driven, playing it out of a smartphone or most players won't do it justice! Unamped, the Hope VI will just sound superb already, not the case with the Z7.

I tried them directly from the NWZ-A15 - that was terrible...

 

[zazex]

  I tried them directly from the NWZ-A15 - that was terrible...

 
As noted, they need an amp.

 

[davidmolliere]

  Just picked up the unbalanced Kimber Kable. I'll post my impression shortly but so far... WOW... I might have to edit my review. It's nowhere close to finish burning in, but the sound is a lot more transparent and there's no more of my so-called grainy darkness anymore. It has punch, it has clarity, it has highs and low, and it has wider soundstage. Paired with the WA7... it's musically amazing and I'm sure Mike would attest to that. I can't believe the cable would go from returning the headphone, to possibly selling the Sennheiser instead. 
dL

 
I have been wondering about it, great to hear this, will wait for your further impression then
 
I am already burning my brain into the Z7/PHA-3 combo and it's getting better and better the only thing I miss really is more transparency if Kimber Kable improve significantly I'll get them on eBay (not available where I live...).
 

  the ears do touch but not tightly. I don't remember it being uncomfortable for me. 
 
I didn't amp the Z7 when testing and I remember it sounding a bit lethargic. must try again. Hope VI was ok unamped. will have to test them side by side. 

 
Well I got one of the very first, before they apparently fixed it a bit by adding padding to the pads, mine definitely touch the driver I was able to discount this based on the amazing sound (even unamped, yes, those cans are "alive"! Amped they get even better but it's marginal. Note to self, try with PHA-3 for kicks).
 
Ditto here, from first listen in store with ZX1, lazy and a bit messy when I came back with FiiO E18 it was a totally different headphone, there is more than impedance and sensitivity apparently (because you can drive them loud enough pushing the ZX1 but the Z7 are not properly driven, I guess the sheer size of those drivers probably explain it). I also think those pair well with analytical DACs my experience with Dragonfly vs FiiO E18 was a first immediate conclusion and PHA-3 running an ESS Sabre seems to confirm this.

 

[zazex]

   
I have been wondering about it, great to hear this, will wait for your further impression then
 
I am already burning my brain into the Z7/PHA-3 combo and it's getting better and better the only thing I miss really is more transparency if Kimber Kable improve significantly I'll get them on eBay (not available where I live...).
 
 
Well I got one of the very first, before they apparently fixed it a bit by adding padding to the pads, mine definitely touch the driver I was able to discount this based on the amazing sound (even unamped, yes, those cans are "alive"! Amped they get even better but it's marginal. Note to self, try with PHA-3 for kicks).
 
Ditto here, from first listen in store with ZX1, lazy and a bit messy when I came back with FiiO E18 it was a totally different headphone, there is more than impedance and sensitivity apparently (because you can drive them loud enough pushing the ZX1 but the Z7 are not properly driven, I guess the sheer size of those drivers probably explain it). I also think those pair well with analytical DACs my experience with Dragonfly vs FiiO E18 was a first immediate conclusion and PHA-3 running an ESS Sabre seems to confirm this.

 
was there a report or other news about this? 
is it a supposition/guess?

 

[davidmolliere]

 
was there a report or other news about this? 
is it a supposition/guess?

 
You're right to clarify.
 
Not at all a report or measurement of any kind just try different things based on personal preferences, but let's say Sony's choice of DAC with the PHA-3 seems logical to me. It matches what I feel works well with the Z7, i.e a DAC that brings out the details and doesn't had warmth to an already dark sound sig. Before I got the PHA-3, the Dragonfly Sabre chip was clearly a better match than the TI BurrBrown 1798 chip of the FiiO E18.
 
Let's say complementarity has always worked for me i.e FiiO E18 warm sound sig with the almost painfully transparent IE800, the same way a warmer DAC would not work for me with the Z7, but it's definitely a matter of taste and tuning your setup to your liking

 

[Mink]

It is official now, I am totally in love with these Sony's!
My headphones ears have finally broken in. True, the 1Khz peak is still there, the bass can be a bit too generous and they're a bit less textured than my A900Xs, but their sound is so effortless and dynamic, without any strain and grain, like listening to an old (high-end) analogue tape-deck, love it!

 

[dweaver]

It's funny, I don't think I would own the Z7 or Z5 if it wasn't for reviewing the RHA T10I, while that IEM is not on the same caliber as the Sony's it opened my ears up to listening to a headphone with a different emphasis than what I was used to. Up until then I had been using primarily mid/treble centric gear.

By forcing myself to only use the T10I for a couple of weeks I started to appreciate what that change in signature allowed in regards to non fatigue. Then when I heard the Z7 with its even sharper balancing act between clarity and non-fatigue, I knew I was in love with the sound. The Z5 for me just compliments the Z7 in an IEM format with slight changes that work better for portable application.

Now I am finding my interest in trying a different signature waining as I don't want to have my brain go through the process of adjusting itself all the time.

 

[ButtUglyJeff]

  It is official now, I am totally in love with these Sony's!
My headphones ears have finally broken in. True, the 1Khz peak is still there, the bass can be a bit too generous and they're a bit less textured than my A900Xs, but their sound is so effortless and dynamic, without any strain and grain, like listening to an old (high-end) analogue tape-deck, love it!

 
 
I'm listening to Fleetwood Mac "Rumors" now.  And I welcome what that peak does for the percussion's presentation...
 
And don't forget to crank it up a bit...

 

[dweaver]

That album is one of the ones that made me fall in love with the Z7 and yes crank it up just a bit LOL.