[C.L]

I have S9 and Sony X Series, and I think S9 has a better SQ.

 

[dippyboy_87]

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.L /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have S9 and Sony X Series, and I think S9 has a better SQ.

care to elaborate on what grounds?

 

[spuddler]

Hi,not a complete audio purist(not that there's anything completely pure as such),but BBE etc is not for me audio wise.Well on a DAP maybe,prob might use it on other things thou.Its certainly not a simple equalizer,were you can use a few frequencies filters etc,if required.
If you read the BBE white papers,you can pick on for's & against's.Only read bit's on the web,but enough tech info for me.You can even buy it in SW form,if you want it,by the looks
Certainly for's & against's.Old post but prob relevance in a lot of the post's,at least two side's,& not really any Flamming,Fanboy etc:-

BBE - Crap or Reasonable? - Hydrogenaudio Forums


Just one thread on the web thou,there's more.
Haven't looked in other HiFi forum's thou,no point,even a Bass Boost button on a Amp can be frowned upon.
Not posted any tech details,not that they would be selective if i did.Read up & opt for what suits you.If its right for you,its right for you.



Cheers BOB


ps get's ready to be jumped upon

,let's hope its nothing pedantic at least.

 

[Antony L]

ok im confused now ,according to the reveiws on afew other sites the S9 is a sideways step from a d2 with comparable soundstage and sq with a cheaper dac and less output power to keep it slim.
with this in mind and reading the big x series thread i understood the s master amp produced a massive natural soundstage i.e alot bigger than the
s9
very interesting reveiw jst wondering what dap to treat my ultrasones to
hi fi man (maybe when my mortgage is done in 1.5 years)
amp3 (tempting)
x series (also tempting)
S9 (too like my d2 sq wise ok i love the d2 but want a change)

 

[bakhtiar]

I had BBE 422 back on early 1990's. Most of the time I used it for cassette tape dubbing to DAT. It do made sound good and clearer, where using graphic equalizer was not enough. Then I got my Sony DPS-M7 (digital effector), and there is a exciter effect, which has similar effect or BBE.

How did I know about BBE? Back those days, I bought several Paul Mauriat's CD albums. and did mentioned about BBE sound processing to enhanced old recording.

But now, we already have a very good digital sound recording equipments and need lesser attention to enhance the sound quality. Anyway, BBE technology is being around for 2 decades, and nice to see it has been implemented in DAPs. As I mentioned earlier, todays recording/sources are very good enough, to make BBE as an option and not a must to have item.

Thank you.

 

[Jussa Audio Dude]

i might have to pick up the 8 gb S9 here in Canada...it's only 200 bucks...

Like most of you...I NEED to have the best sounding player. I will still be surprised if the S9 sounds better.

Even though X sounds a bit colored, it's still not fair to leave all the settings off...yet tweak the S9. Both should be tweaked until they are about the same...then compare.

I had an the Cowon X5....that sounded amazing to me...so it's not like I dislike the Cowon sound....I just want the comparison to be fair...eq vs eq so to speak

Some like the Cowon Sound...some like the Sony sound...I remember the battle between Cowon D2 and Sony A818 before...i think the ratings were like 50/50...

cheers!

 

[insomniax]

i think the point the reviewer is trying to make here is that more is less. At least for the X. Adding a whole lot of EQ settings is not always (actually seldom) going to yield better results. I feel that X sounds great out of the box, coupled with the fact that its EQ settings(besides ClearBass) is not exactly the best of DAPs, leads me to think that its already been tweaked for mass consumerism. Adding lots of ClearStereo and ClearBass might make things worse actually, but the EQ is only there for personal preference implementations.

The thing about S9 is that it was not tweaked for consumer markets as such. It gave a very flat, evenly amplified signal from the headphone out and had no frequency emphasis. I mentioned it sounded boring out of the box. It requires the active participation of the end-user to make it sound exactly the way they want it.

Its analagous to Westone's W3 versus its own UM3X line. pre-tweaked for mass playback acceptance, or true to the source with enough room to keep things interesting.
I would say X does the thinking for you, s9 makes you do the thinking for yourself.

 

[spuddler]

Hi,hard to say whether 'X' is tweaked,or its the choice of HW bits,or its the 'slightly lacking on info' S-Master digital Amp?(i haven't seem much on it in detail,haven't looked much either thou).
Any HiFi you could say is tweaked,DAC,Amp,Caps etc etc,are chosen by the Audio Designer to get the sound signature etc he or she thinks is right.
Must admit i spend less time in HiFi forums,techy stuff etc(getting rusty).Just listen more to music(especially since i have found decent portable stuff & actually use it).My room speakers haven't moved position for a fair while

Sure i would be happy enough with the 'X'(which i have),S9 or whatever,just wish i could justify the expense.



Cheers BOB

 

[dippyboy_87]

Quote:

Originally Posted by insomniax /img/forum/go_quote.gif i think the point the reviewer is trying to make here is that more is less. At least for the X. Adding a whole lot of EQ settings is not always (actually seldom) going to yield better results. I feel that X sounds great out of the box, coupled with the fact that its EQ settings(besides ClearBass) is not exactly the best of DAPs, leads me to think that its already been tweaked for mass consumerism. Adding lots of ClearStereo and ClearBass might make things worse actually, but the EQ is only there for personal preference implementations. The thing about S9 is that it was not tweaked for consumer markets as such. It gave a very flat, evenly amplified signal from the headphone out and had no frequency emphasis. I mentioned it sounded boring out of the box. It requires the active participation of the end-user to make it sound exactly the way they want it. Its analagous to Westone's W3 versus its own UM3X line. pre-tweaked for mass playback acceptance, or true to the source with enough room to keep things interesting. I would say X does the thinking for you, s9 makes you do the thinking for yourself.

very very well said there..

 

[techfreakazoid]

Quote:

Originally Posted by spuddler /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hi,not a complete audio purist(not that there's anything completely pure as such),but BBE etc is not for me audio wise.Well on a DAP maybe,prob might use it on other things thou.Its certainly not a simple equalizer,were you can use a few frequencies filters etc,if required. If you read the BBE white papers,you can pick on for's & against's.Only read bit's on the web,but enough tech info for me.You can even buy it in SW form,if you want it,by the looks Certainly for's & against's.Old post but prob relevance in a lot of the post's,at least two side's,& not really any Flamming,Fanboy etc:- BBE - Crap or Reasonable? - Hydrogenaudio Forums Just one thread on the web thou,there's more. Haven't looked in other HiFi forum's thou,no point,even a Bass Boost button on a Amp can be frowned upon. Not posted any tech details,not that they would be selective if i did.Read up & opt for what suits you.If its right for you,its right for you. Cheers BOB ps get's ready to be jumped upon ,let's hope its nothing pedantic at least.

Give the S9 a try with and w/o BBE. To my ears, it sounds pretty good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antony L /img/forum/go_quote.gif ok im confused now ,according to the reveiws on afew other sites the S9 is a sideways step from a d2 with comparable soundstage and sq with a cheaper dac and less output power to keep it slim. with this in mind and reading the big x series thread i understood the s master amp produced a massive natural soundstage i.e alot bigger than the s9 very interesting reveiw jst wondering what dap to treat my ultrasones to hi fi man (maybe when my mortgage is done in 1.5 years) amp3 (tempting) x series (also tempting) S9 (too like my d2 sq wise ok i love the d2 but want a change)

I've never heard the D2 so can't comment on the 'improvements' or lesser performance. Duncan mentioned that he preferred the S9 over D2. Other Head-Fi'ers may want to chime in. Not sure what the Ultrasone synergy is with the X or S9; however, the X is good value in the UK if your primary interest is in audio.


Quote:

Originally Posted by bakhtiar /img/forum/go_quote.gif I had BBE 422 back on early 1990's. Most of the time I used it for cassette tape dubbing to DAT. It do made sound good and clearer, where using graphic equalizer was not enough. Then I got my Sony DPS-M7 (digital effector), and there is a exciter effect, which has similar effect or BBE. How did I know about BBE? Back those days, I bought several Paul Mauriat's CD albums. and did mentioned about BBE sound processing to enhanced old recording. But now, we already have a very good digital sound recording equipments and need lesser attention to enhance the sound quality. Anyway, BBE technology is being around for 2 decades, and nice to see it has been implemented in DAPs. As I mentioned earlier, todays recording/sources are very good enough, to make BBE as an option and not a must to have item. Thank you.

Yes, recording/mix quality is much better these days, though most people have a sizeable library of old tunes of lesser quality, low bitrates, etc. Having BBE as an option is good.

For those using the S9, would be interested to hear what percentage of your listening is with BBE+, Normal, or other setting.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jussa Audio Dude /img/forum/go_quote.gif i might have to pick up the 8 gb S9 here in Canada...it's only 200 bucks... Like most of you...I NEED to have the best sounding player. I will still be surprised if the S9 sounds better. Even though X sounds a bit colored, it's still not fair to leave all the settings off...yet tweak the S9. Both should be tweaked until they are about the same...then compare. I had an the Cowon X5....that sounded amazing to me...so it's not like I dislike the Cowon sound....I just want the comparison to be fair...eq vs eq so to speak Some like the Cowon Sound...some like the Sony sound...I remember the battle between Cowon D2 and Sony A818 before...i think the ratings were like 50/50... cheers!

Give the S9 a try and report back.


Quote:

Originally Posted by insomniax /img/forum/go_quote.gif i think the point the reviewer is trying to make here is that more is less. At least for the X. Adding a whole lot of EQ settings is not always (actually seldom) going to yield better results. I feel that X sounds great out of the box, coupled with the fact that its EQ settings(besides ClearBass) is not exactly the best of DAPs, leads me to think that its already been tweaked for mass consumerism. Adding lots of ClearStereo and ClearBass might make things worse actually, but the EQ is only there for personal preference implementations. The thing about S9 is that it was not tweaked for consumer markets as such. It gave a very flat, evenly amplified signal from the headphone out and had no frequency emphasis. I mentioned it sounded boring out of the box. It requires the active participation of the end-user to make it sound exactly the way they want it. Its analagous to Westone's W3 versus its own UM3X line. pre-tweaked for mass playback acceptance, or true to the source with enough room to keep things interesting. I would say X does the thinking for you, s9 makes you do the thinking for yourself.

Well said, insomniax.


Quote:

Originally Posted by spuddler /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just listen more to music(especially since i have found decent portable stuff & actually use it).

I agree it's about listening to music; all four players will sound good with the synergistic phones and music genres.

 

[spuddler]

Hi,well have looked in this forum section,from time to time(since & before i joined up).Even thou i had just cheap stuff,& never really used it.When the E500/SE500 was the King

,nearly jumped in & bought,even thou i had nothing to go with it etc

.Still like to hear/try the SE530's,like the FX500's,but sure i would like the SE530's as well(& a lot of the others,Westones etc).
Sure S9 sound's good,& with the E500/Se530's.Excellent review,be nice if there was a few more(or at least opinion's),at least with different Headphones.Just like in HiFi,some things work better with other things,synergy etc.
Loads of stuff mentioned on here i'd like to try etc,just ain't got the money,well maybe if i also didn't spend on other things.
Buying CD's is addictive,at least now with the portable rig,it looks like a lot of the unlistened to,will be now

Cheers BOB

ps sure i will bite with something sooner or later,be it a player,or more likely headphones

 

[Acreo Aeneas]

I enjoyed reading your comparison review Techfreakazoid.

Lots of details, explanations, and examples.

One thing I found with my S9 + SF3 is that the S9 (with my custom EQ settings) is able to deliver much richer bass through my SF3 than my old D2 could (same EQ levels) and I like how I can change the frequencies of each of the 5 bands and still be able to adjust for "wide", "normal", or "narrow". I'm not sure I like the hollowness of the VIVA and VIVA2 EQs. It just feels a bit flat and lacking, probably because my EQ is higher mids, strong highs, and stronger lows.

 

[globiboulga]

Like a few people around here, I was questioning the value of upgrading to the S9 coming from a D2, and considering the X series just to be certain to have a 'different' sound.

I also got tired of the very detailed, analytic sound of the D2 and wanted something a bit closer to what the X5 was...

Eventually, the feature set of the S9, flac support, and the inclusion of gapless playback made it an easy decision. Still, I was a bit nervous about getting the same sound...

I won't do a full comparison now, because I probably should be more thorough, but lets say in a nutshell, that I am more than happy with the S9. On flat EQ, they sound very similar, but the S9 has the edge 1) by delivering a fuller, increased level of bass and by sweetening highs so slightly they don't feel as tiring as they could on the D2 after a few minutes on some songs... Overall it feels like the S9 has a more consistent delivery of the full musical spectrum...

While these differences are faint on flat EQ, they become obvious using the new BBE VIVA which does reinforce this rebalance of the sound compared to the D2...

On regular use, I don't need to tweek the S9 as much as I did with the D2 to get the sound I like, which is a great bonus as sometimes those very tweaks can turn out to make some recordings or songs sound awful... Indeed, turning BBE VIVA on is about all I do on the S9, I don't tweak the EQ settings to the extent I did on the D2.

Having listened to the X1050 in a SonyStyle, I can add that while I was impressed with the sound, it does indeed seems to be that Sony has decided to colour the sound for the users (mind you, a really nice coloration), while you still have to play with the S9 to find that sweet spot. Had Sony added flac support and gapless playback, I would probably have gotten the X1060 just to 'change' sound. But given the price, the gap bewteen the X1060 and S9 in terms of functionalities is too big to be ignored.

 

[bakhtiar]

^^^, Agreed. The functions and the PRICE are the big issues in the X.

TQ.

 

[Buckster]

my X1060 is sat its box all week .... sealed

decided its going back to Amazon - I'll wait till the new S's series comes out - my Touch 2G doesn't sound that bad at all really

I'm worried how much of an improvement over the Touch I'll get - and once opened I can't send it back