[echineko]

Has any one tried either player with a pair of ZMF'S or Mr Speakers ?

I am planning to do so once I get my adapter to 4.4mm. Didn't bother trying my Eikon with the SE out, since I'm sure it doesn't have the power needed to run it adequately.

Not a fan of Mrspeakers cans, not planning to try.

 

[13candles]

Hi fellas,

Due to work , i havent been using my 1Z as much; maybe once or twice in a week but i always leave it on standby mode and never once allowed it to totally run out off juice.

Just concerned if its detrimental to have my unit constantly on standby mode without using it for some time.

Also, what are some of the charging habits you fellow owners practise?

Cheers guys

 

[Rei87]

I think that there has been some confusion about my question. We know that clearly, there are different grades of the 4.4 mm jack; the OFC version being the most expensive one.

However, I am making direct reference to the socket, not the plug. Do we know if Sony uses the same 4.4 socket as sold by Pentaconn, which boasts optimal conductivity, in its player? Or are they using a cheaper oem variant. If sony is using a cheaper socket, I am tempted to swap it out for parts with better connectivity.

 

[echineko]

Spoiler

I think that there has been some confusion about my question. We know that clearly, there are different grades of the 4.4 mm jack; the OFC version being the most expensive one.

However, I am making direct reference to the socket, not the plug. Do we know if Sony uses the same 4.4 socket as sold by Pentaconn, which boasts optimal conductivity, in its player? Or are they using a cheaper oem variant. If sony is using a cheaper socket, I am tempted to swap it out for parts with better connectivity.

Perhaps someone else would have the conclusive info, I don't but I would very much doubt Sony would opt for the cheap option for this, after having gone to the trouble to put in the development work together with the manufacturer of these connectors and sockets. At that point I don't think the savings would even be significant, compared to all the R&D hours already sunk.

 

[Toolman]

Pentaconn manufactured several variant of plugs but have ONLY one socket option. Having collaborated with Pentaconn for these 4.4mm standard, I would believe it will be the same Pentaconn socket, unless there is a special Sony-specific socket that we do not know about.

 

[echineko]

Spoiler

Pentaconn manufactured several variant of plugs but have ONLY one socket option. Having collaborated with Pentaconn for these 4.4mm standard, I would believe it will be the same Pentaconn socket, unless there is a special Sony-specific socket that we do not know about

Yes, I actually have accessories made with the OFC and standard Pentaconn plugs. As for believing it's the same socket, I certainly think so, as I said. What made you doubt it and think they'd be using a "cheaper OEM variant"? I've not seen this suggested anywhere before, I was wondering if perhaps it's due to any tear down you did, etc.

 

[gerelmx1986]

At this price point Sony won't go cheap with materials

 

[Rei87]

Heys
The pentaconn socket as directly marketed by pentaconn itself, has all its pins extended for soldering purposes http://www.ndics.com/products/pentaconn/

On the other hand, the socket in the WM1Z, is soldered to a PCB board with the kimber cable attached as a single set (the extended solder joints seen in the original 4.4mm socket are also removed). It does not come as separate individual component. This implies that, Sony probably does not get their engineers to solder the parts together piece by piece, but probably gets them delivered in said form for quick maintenance.

As such, because these two parts are in different forms, I am unable to be completely certain that they are indeed the exact same product just specced different to suit Sony's assembly needs. For all we know, it could be a different OEM version, that does not feature the highly conductive copper core of the stand alone jack.

 

[AnakChan]

Are there any non-Pentaconn sockets?

Heys
The pentaconn socket as directly marketed by pentaconn itself, has all its pins extended for soldering purposes http://www.ndics.com/products/pentaconn/

On the other hand, the socket in the WM1Z, is soldered to a PCB board with the kimber cable attached as a single set (the extended solder joints seen in the original 4.4mm socket are also removed). It does not come as separate individual component. This implies that, Sony probably does not get their engineers to solder the parts together piece by piece, but probably gets them delivered in said form for quick maintenance.

As such, because these two parts are in different forms, I am unable to be completely certain that they are indeed the exact same product just specced different to suit Sony's assembly needs. For all we know, it could be a different OEM version, that does not feature the highly conductive copper core of the stand alone jack.

I've bought and used the standalone sockets above. They don't have the individual Pentaconn packaging the way their plugs do. Instead the way the sockets are sold, they're originally in the reel form that's snipped to individual and sold as such.

I wouldn't call the ones used in Sony to be different from the individually sold ones as it's highly likely Sony has done what you have said - have the individual sockets soldered onto the daughterboard with kimber cables as a replaceable package for easy breakfix.

Trying to find another manufacturer to make the sockets is probably not so easy especially if Sony was involved in the 4.4mm development with NDICS and have been a major proponent in marketing it as such. To put a non-spec-ed socket into their Walkmans whilst advertising of their involvement in that standard would be rather deceitful and open to suits. On the other hand if it's an OEM that is compliant, then finding 2 manufacturers to make compliant - one for OEM for the Walkmans and another for retail wouldn't make sense either. Who would want to make the retail version when there's no secured guaranteed batch orders?

Back to the ones I bought from e-earphone that's reeled up, just logically I'd believe it's the same ones that's in the Walkmans as they're just batched that's been snipped and sold individually.

However if you're looking at tinkering, why not change the sockets anyway? Best case it's an improvement and may be one step closer to proving your theory right. Worst case, there is no difference and it's merely $$/time/effort which you seem almost ready willing to commit anyway.

My 2 yen worth.

 

[nanaholic]

There seems to be a lot of confusion and mixing up of terms regarding the 4.4mm jack and plug. Let me clear it up as best as I can:
* The generic 4.4mm plug dimensions was designed by NDICS and was pushed by both Sony and NDICS to be adopted as a JEITA standard, and the usage of the generic design by anyone is royalty/license free
* NDICS - having poured money into R&Ding and pushing the these jacks/plugs to be adopted needed another way to recoup on the cost since they weren't going to get any money by opening up the standard. So in collaboration with Sony's WM1 development and feedback they made improvements and developed their own special variation of the 4.4mm plug and jack and trademark and patented the IP of this specific variate of the 4.4mm plug/jack as the "Pentaconn" line. For example the C-shaped dual contact point design of the Pentaconn jack is patented by NDICS and they and ONLY they can make that specific design. And if I understand correctly too, Pentaconn plugs are also designed slightly differently on the wire soldering end which lets NDICS patent that design specifically. NDICS does this so they can market a "superior" product which is ALSO protected by IP laws so they sue anyone who makes cheap knock-offs if they copy the Pentaconn design one-to-one.
* All Sony 4.4mm related accessories are using NDICS made Pentaconn products.

One thing people need to keep in mind is while Pentaconn = 4.4mm but the reverse is NOT true 4.4mm =/= Pentaconn (just like all cars are vehicles, but not all vehicles are cars!). This point is often mixed up by a lot of non-Japanese audio-related sites. Also Pentaconn is the name of the product line made by NDICS - Pentaconn itself is NOT a company.

Now the issue thus far seems to be while OEM had been very quick to make non-Pentaconn generic 4.4mm plugs, no one else had been able to make a non-Pentaconn generic 4.4mm jacks. I dug around it seems that while a complete blueprint of the 4.4mm plug is available at JEITA, there's no blueprint for a generic jack design! So perhaps OEMs had to design their own which is why it took them a lot longer to release a product. But that's about to change:

https://twitter.com/flubber777/status/862576412863062016
Japanese accessory OEM musashino label is releasing two 4.4mm jack conversion cables next week! So someone else besides NDICS must now have the ability to pump out generic 4.4mm jacks in large enough quantities, so expect standalone parts soon.

 

[AnakChan]

Hmmm...in my conversations with Sony, I had the understanding Sony had a play in the design too...not must marketing (or "pushing" as you've put it). I'll see if I can have dinner with my Sony friend some time to get a little more clarification. Can't speak if NDICS solely invested into the R&D and manufacturing without any financial help from Sony or anyone else. I'd probably ask that too but don't know if that'll be considered as confidential information or not.

Yes aware that other companies are also making 4.4mms but I believe those made in Japan are in accordance to the JEITA standard. For the ones off lunashops, etc. I don't know. I'm also skeptical if IP would stop them from copying/making without paying royalties. Would be interesting to see if the IP is local or international - I'm sure that info is out somewhere in public but I've not bothered to search for it yet.

Thx for the info about Musashino. I asked e-earphone and they didn't know about it but was happy to see the tweet.

 

[blazinblazin]

I need those converters!

 

[AnakChan]

I need those converters!

I recently found a great heatshrink tube that shrinks from 22mm to 4.8mm sold in the Oyaide store :-

I have a great sounding OFC Pentaconn terminated cable by Brise Audio (8-wire UPG001Ref) and can use that with any DAP now with the above adapters.

 

[nanaholic]

Hmmm...in my conversations with Sony, I had the understanding Sony had a play in the design too...not must marketing (or "pushing" as you've put it). I'll see if I can have dinner with my Sony friend some time to get a little more clarification. Can't speak if NDICS solely invested into the R&D and manufacturing without any financial help from Sony or anyone else. I'd probably ask that too but don't know if that'll be considered as confidential information or not.

You are not wrong that Sony has a play in the design - from the WM1 development interview Sony's engineers clearly stated that they provided feedback to their partner and then the partners took those feedback and improved the design further during the development of the WM1, which is why I said "So in collaboration with Sony's WM1 development and feedback they made improvements" though perhaps I could word it more clearly.

Seeing how NDICS seems to own the Pentaconn product and all associated trademark/patented and is freely selling them to other audio device makers (we now know that the Sennheiser HDV820 uses Pentaconn), I'm inclined to believe Sony didn't contribute financially for its development - at least definitely not enough to share ownership of its design/patents, though perhaps just enough to secure a time-limited monopoly on the supply of the Pentaconn parts to fulfill the initial launch of their new audio products. But if we can confirmation that would be even better.

The patented design of the Pentaconn jacks should mean that at least in Japan no one else would rip-off their design - though of cause in places like China where such respect for patent laws are a lot lower that would be a different story. Though seeing that the design seems rather complex and over-engineered for a simple jack, the cost of manufacturing probably also meant there wasn't much incentive to ripoff that design either in the first place, especially since the standard has yet to prove it self to have enough traction, so many just took a wait and see approach to whether it was worth making a generic jack too.

 

[buzzlulu]

FINALLY!

Just received this in the mail and installed on my WM1Z

http://www.protectionfilms24.com/ar...ector-clear-sony-walkman-nw-wm1a-2730994.html

4.22 Euro - free shipping - arrival in less than 1 week from Germany to US

Absolutely perfect fit and quality - an excellent solution