[davidmolliere]

Speaking of Japanese tuning, I also want to mention that besides the Solaris the Victor HA-FW10000 was the other IEM that left an impression on me a couple of weeks ago when I went to Headphone Matsuri, but the voicing between the two are worlds apart. The Victor wood flagship is a soothing, polite, classy and mature sounding phone with a huge sense of space, whereas the Solaris was very energetic, upfront and full of impact. What's great about both is that they had - as one of my friend would say - an outstanding personality. The IER-Z1R is going to be competing with these two phones mainly I reckon, and from memory the Z1R's sound sort of slots right in between these two extremes. Also in terms of exterior design they are also very far apart, as you have the classy and warm looking wood with the Victor, verse the modern metal of the Sony and CA. Personally speaking with respect to the music I listen to, the Victor is more to my taste (I tried it at e-earphones again today) over the Solaris - and that was using the SE of my 1Z against the balance connection of the Solaris using CA's best cable at Headphone Matsuri so I can only imagine what it would be like if I can use the Victor on balance, and I'm quite attracted to the handcraft of the Victor to the point where I can actually see myself owning the Victor because it has a different enough sound to what I have in my collection that makes it a good compliment, so now I'd really like to compare the Z1R against the Victor when both are more available widely. However the most interesting to me is that these new TOTL IEMs are either pure dynamic as in the Victor, or hybrid, as in the Z1R and Solaris. It seems that makers are getting back into and making exciting breakthroughs with dynamic drivers either in design and/or building materials such that we are getting new levels of performances in packages that didn't exists before. As a fan of dynamic drivers it's definitely exciting times to see we are finally out of the "more BA driver" phase.

I have the Victor on my radar as well.. there is something about wood... I like IEMs with outstanding personnalities

But right now sellers have it at almost 2K€ (without import taxes) quite a bump from the 192 000 yen local price... almost would pay a trip to Japan to get them here

The wood dome driver unit is a first isn't it? Is it a limited run being a 10th anniversary thing?
Anyway, nice to have trusted impressions

 

[Deftone]

That new JVC looks incredible, I’ve always used their spiral dots tips for iems because of how they open up the treble and add space on any earphone. Everyone that owns universal IEMs should have JVC spiral dot tips to try.

 

[nanaholic]

The wood dome driver unit is a first isn't it? Is it a limited run being a 10th anniversary thing?

It's not their first wood dome driver IEM, but the driver itself is completely new.

 

[davidmolliere]

It's not their first wood dome driver IEM, but the driver itself is completely new.

I have auditioned the JVC HA-FW01 I knew the shells were wood but not the driver... this one lacked a lot of bass control although the mids were so great...

 

[nanaholic]

I have auditioned the JVC HA-FW01 I knew the shells were wood but not the driver... this one lacked a lot of bass control although the mids were so great...

It seems they retained a lot of the basic ideas but drastically changed the materials used and/or the basic design of the said part. For example they changed the housing material from stainless steel to titanium and the brace design pattern is different, they also changed the dampening material from some wood looking stuff to high quality Japanese paper (washi) mixed with cotton fibre. All the small improvements must have added up to the final change.

 

[FangJoker]

I've owned the FX 850 and FX 1100 and while they were good midfi IEMs for beater use, I can't imagine the new JVC taking such a huge leap to TOTL category with a single DD. The wood driver had good midrange and good timbre, but it's weakness was sounding muddy at times (mostly on music with lots of quick hard hitting bass) and not having great clarity. Now if you told me that they built a hybrid around their wood DD, then I could believe that it would have more clarity and not be as muddy sounding. I'd definitely need to read many more reviews before even considering it.

 

[nanaholic]

I've owned the FX 850 and FX 1100 and while they were good midfi IEMs for beater use, I can't imagine the new JVC taking such a huge leap to TOTL category with a single DD. The wood driver had good midrange and good timbre, but it's weakness was sounding muddy at times (mostly on music with lots of quick hard hitting bass) and not having great clarity. Now if you told me that they built a hybrid around their wood DD, then I could believe that it would have more clarity and not be as muddy sounding. I'd definitely need to read many more reviews before even considering it.

I have tried the other wood series and yes I found them too warm and muddy in the low end while the FW10000 sounds vastly different. Beyer has shown us years ago that a good single DD is actually cable of a lot in their T8iE and Xelento, so I'm not surprised that some change in the acoustic chamber design, a change of dampening material and a general touch up of the driver can result in a very different sounding phone. Ergo, making a DD IEM is that you are essentially making a very tiny closed back headphone, in which case we all know getting acoustic and the housing correct is probably more than half of the issues to overcome in the voicing rather than how competent the driver itself actually is, anyone whom had modded their closed back headphone by just stuff some padding into the ear cup can easily attest to the drastic voicing effect of changing the acoustic property of the housing enclosure.

 

[aerospace33]

Has anyone performed independent measurements and testing of the Z1R to see how they measure?

 

[Whitigir]

The best guitars I have ever heard are on the RHA CL2 Planar. Goosebumps everytime.
BA guitar sounds like an approximation of a guitar. Is missing a lot of the decay and natural artifacts.
It doesn't have the weight.
Planar is the perfect marriage of BA quickness and the analogue sound of a Dynamic.

Until you hear a top of the line Electro Stats system

 

[Whitigir]

I have tried the other wood series and yes I found them too warm and muddy in the low end while the FW10000 sounds vastly different. Beyer has shown us years ago that a good single DD is actually cable of a lot in their T8iE and Xelento, so I'm not surprised that some change in the acoustic chamber design, a change of dampening material and a general touch up of the driver can result in a very different sounding phone. Ergo, making a DD IEM is that you are essentially making a very tiny closed back headphone, in which case we all know getting acoustic and the housing correct is probably more than half of the issues to overcome in the voicing rather than how competent the driver itself actually is, anyone whom had modded their closed back headphone by just stuff some padding into the ear cup can easily attest to the drastic voicing effect of changing the acoustic property of the housing enclosure.

This is totally correct, and is also one main reason why any earbuds won’t be comparable to any opened back fullsizes headphones. I have seen some people mentioned that earbuds are closing up...yeah...right...I don’t bother to debate anyways, just let them find out for themselves

I have heard crazy resonances in the past where an earbud was milled out from brass housing and aluminum alloy nozzles with metal mesh acoustic resistor. But it doesn’t bother other folks ? Lord knows how or why. There are many reasons why I am not into earbuds

1/ designed like any closed back headphones would , but without properly dampening and venting (the thing boggles my mind, manufacturers know this, but they don’t care). You can see Sony advertise this

2/ multi drivers require cross over, and some high-end earbuds can stuff cheap resistors and capacitors with the worse tolerances and frequency stability vs efficiency. You can see Sony advertise this

3/ pushing ears tips to completely seal for a good fit to perform, it hurts my ears canals

Etc...

For a while, and I am sure even now, the market for the so called high-end earbuds are blown out of proportion. Manufacturers took advantages of the Cross-over, and tune the multi drivers in a sense to emphasizes either soundstage, airiness trebles by increasing detail and decreasing lower upper or Lower or both extensions, or emphasizes bass or trebles, or all together. It created a huge amount of a “cans of worms”....etc...etc...I can keep on going....

The only best thing about earbuds are the portability, privacy and practicality, and not sure why some is raking thousands in prices

However, to my opinion, for the moment, there isn’t enough innovations in the earbuds market to mask it high-end to justify cost of thousands dollars. This is why I love the idea that Sony is not only developing their own BA with silver plating voice coil (the first of it kind), but also using F-resistors and PELT capacitors. I am sure Sony knows the best how to tune their cross over in an honest way to achieve performances without too much compromises. The other innovations I see is the LCD-i4, and the Shure Electro stat one (too restrictive because of it own DAC/amp).

Anyways, the time for innovations and better perfecting the productions of earsbuds has just begun. For people who needs, wants, and love earbuds, this is a very exciting time. For me, I will still stick to my single driver open back headphones ....particularly Stax. Other dynamic headphones will be used for fun and practicality.

 

[Kitechaser]

Until you hear a top of the line Electro Stats system

Not really interested in spending 2 grand on upgrading to an electrostat anymore. Very very happy with the CL2. It's a TOTL for me no matter the price.
And if the Sony is not a clear evolution in terms of DD drivers, will be very happy with just the CL2.
After listening to the RHA Planar it is impossible for me to ever consider a BA iem again. They all sound like plastic to me, even more than before.

 

[Whitigir]

Not really interested in spending 2 grand on upgrading to an electrostat anymore. Very very happy with the CL2. It's a TOTL for me.
And I'd the Sony is not a clear evolution in terms of DD drivers, will stand pat with the CL2.
After listening to the CL2 it impossible for me to ever consider a BA iem again. They all sound like plastic to me, even more than ever. Getting rid of all my BA configurations.

2 grands on ES won’t get you very far. However, Dynamic worlds with can of worms and oceans of fishes are catching up with price that could buy you a car....look at DMP-Z1 for example for what the future may bring

 

[Kitechaser]

2 grands on ES won’t get you very far. However, Dynamic worlds with can of worms and oceans of fishes are catching up with price that could buy you a car....look at DMP-Z1 for example for what the future may bring

That is outrageous. I'll get their budget option players when they finally come out.
The ZX300 is a steal for the money I paid for it.
Sony is milking the addicts first. But if it wasn't for them, the leaps in tech would be released less frequently.

 

[Kitechaser]

This is totally correct, and is also one main reason why any earbuds won’t be comparable to any opened back fullsizes headphones. I have seen some people mentioned that earbuds are closing up...yeah...right...I don’t bother to debate anyways, just let them find out for themselves

I have heard crazy resonances in the past where an earbud was milled out from brass housing and aluminum alloy nozzles with metal mesh acoustic resistor. But it doesn’t bother other folks ? Lord knows how or why. There are many reasons why I am not into earbuds

1/ designed like any closed back headphones would , but without properly dampening and venting (the thing boggles my mind, manufacturers know this, but they don’t care). You can see Sony advertise this

2/ multi drivers require cross over, and some high-end earbuds can stuff cheap resistors and capacitors with the worse tolerances and frequency stability vs efficiency. You can see Sony advertise this

3/ pushing ears tips to completely seal for a good fit to perform, it hurts my ears canals

Etc...

For a while, and I am sure even now, the market for the so called high-end earbuds are blown out of proportion. Manufacturers took advantages of the Cross-over, and tune the multi drivers in a sense to emphasizes either soundstage, airiness trebles by increasing detail and decreasing lower upper or Lower or both extensions, or emphasizes bass or trebles, or all together. It created a huge amount of a “cans of worms”....etc...etc...I can keep on going....

The only best thing about earbuds are the portability, privacy and practicality, and not sure why some is raking thousands in prices

However, to my opinion, for the moment, there isn’t enough innovations in the earbuds market to mask it high-end to justify cost of thousands dollars. This is why I love the idea that Sony is not only developing their own BA with silver plating voice coil (the first of it kind), but also using F-resistors and PELT capacitors. I am sure Sony knows the best how to tune their cross over in an honest way to achieve performances without too much compromises. The other innovations I see is the LCD-i4, and the Shure Electro stat one (too restrictive because of it own DAC/amp).

Anyways, the time for innovations and better perfecting the productions of earsbuds has just begun. For people who needs, wants, and love earbuds, this is a very exciting time. For me, I will still stick to my single driver open back headphones ....particularly Stax. Other dynamic headphones will be used for fun and practicality.

I have to agree with pretty much everything you have said.
The IEM market is a cluster ***.
And most people buying these 24 driver in each ear, 3000 dollar iems, would not know good sound if it hit them in the face.
And I would really like to maybe purchase an electro stat headphone, not really interested in the shure in ear version anymore.

 

[davidmolliere]

I have to agree with pretty much everything you have said. The IEM market is a cluster ***. And most people buying these 24 driver in each ear, 3000 dollar iems, would not know good sound if it hit them in the face.

Let's not be to definitive and judgmental, people are entitled to their choices and some multi driver IEM are very good so not every product is to be discarded for jumping on the driver war
For example I have enjoyed the U18t when I auditioned it. Now is it worth the price? Only you can decide...

The problem is to maintain coherency within those complex designs.
Simplicity is powerful as some products have reminded us : SE5U, the five driver has won the 17 IEM shootout from @flinkenick, the Warbler Prelude with its single BA as well... the IER-Z1R will be a 3 driver and the Solaris has 4.