[Koukol]

 

 
No offense, Jamie, but can you explain how to do it right?
I'm not saying you're wrong but I have my friendly doubts.
"as quiet as digital" is hard to believe since with great equipment you can actually hear the record turning.
Are you EQing out frequencies or using compressor/limiters?
Are you using $1000.00 record cleaners? (which in my experience with Nitty Gritty couldn't remove all dirt pops.)
Do the $5000.00 turntables fix this problem?
 
I can tell a lot of times when a professional CD is mastered from vinyl as you can here the odd pop.
 
I hope you don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to show you up... I'm just not a vinyl enthusiast.

Quiet vinyl records are as quiet as CD when you play them at normal listening levels. If you purposely crank up the volume to identify the pops and hisses, you'd hear them from TOTL digital setups too.

I have should have added that I'm talking about critical Headphone listening but I thought that was a given being the forum we're on..
And how can you hear pops and crackles from a CD mastered from tape?
I wasn't talking about hiss but wow and flutter and the sound of the stylus dragging on the plastic.
Again...I'm talking about Headphone listening.

 

[Eee Pee]

 
Yeah...I think people complained so much about CDS sounding so cold that some companies recorded off vinyl.

 
Never heard of this before in my life.

 

[Koukol]

I didn't mean to start a vinyl war here but I had to state my opinion
There are many reasons I gave up on vinyl.
Some being...
 
Pops, skips and scratches.
The amount of space on vinyl before sound is compromised (the last songs on each side suffering the most)
OK...great vinyl will come as a 45rpm with two songs on each side (and spin faster for a better sound) but I already have a problem with getting up a turning a regular record over halfway through.
This interruption can ruin recordings like THE RAMONES IT'S ALIVE where I truly didn't appreciate it until I heard the entire show uninterupted on CD.
The thumps that are picked up by walking by unless you invest in a very expensive isolation stand. (my tip toes just didn't cut it with my wooden floor)
The quality of the vinyl used (probably not a problem today with the prices vinyl is going for)
The The wow and flutter...I once had a record by Echo & The Bunnymen where they didn't center the pressing properly so it sounded like an old 45 without those old centering thingies (people over 50 know what I'm talking about ) (OK...I know CDS have been crappy too...Hello first pressing of EXILE ON MAIN-STREET)
The thumping from a warped record
 
And finally my personal experience of buying a $1000.00 Rega turntable that plays slightly too fast because of the power current being different from the UK (I live in North America.)
I also spent another $500.00 on a highly acclaimed stylus that I found too dark and muffled.
So my turntable has sat in the closet for the last 6 years
 
My only love for vinyl is the memories of hunting them down in the past.
 
Different strokes...

 

[Koukol]

 

 
Yeah...I think people complained so much about CDS sounding so cold that some companies recorded off vinyl.

 
Never heard of this before in my life.

I carefully added the word "think"
I believe it was Sanctuary Records that did it with Black Sabbath
The first CD of EXILE ON MAIN-STREET was recorded horribly off vinyl leaving in a actual skip that helped give digital a bad name in the early days.

 

[Shaffer]

I didn't mean to start a vinyl war here but I had to state my opinion
There are many reasons I gave up on vinyl.
Some being...

Pops, skips and scratches. Sounds like you purchased poor pressings. FWIW, I can't even remember when a record skipped.
The amount of space on vinyl before sound is compromised (the last songs on each side suffering the most) That's true. This factor can be minimized with setup. Yes, back to that again.
OK...great vinyl will come as a 45rpm with two songs on each side (and spin faster for a better sound) but I already have a problem with getting up a turning a regular record over halfway through. Either the sound on the last track is compromised, as you mentioned, or there's the alternative of a 12" 45 RPM pressing. Can't have it both ways.
This interruption can ruin recordings like THE RAMONES IT'S ALIVE where I truly didn't appreciate it until I heard the entire show uninterupted on CD. At the same time, sequenced sides add another dimension to listening.
The thumps that are picked up by walking by unless you invest in a very expensive isolation stand. (my tip toes just didn't cut it with my wooden floor) A very expensive isolation stand truly isn't necessary to handle this problem. It's a matter of experience. Your dealer may have been able to help with a home visit.
The quality of the vinyl used (probably not a problem today with the prices vinyl is going for) I hate the cost of new LPs, as well. This being said, looking at the price index, they cost about the same or less than they did in the '80s
The The wow and flutter...I once had a record by Echo & The Bunnymen where they didn't center the pressing properly so it sounded like an old 45 without those old centering thingies (people over 50 know what I'm talking about ) (OK...I know CDS have been crappy too...Hello first pressing of EXILE ON MAIN-STREET)
The thumping from a warped record A well-setup, high-quality 'table/arm can greatly minimize and even eliminate some of this, like thumps from a warp and the negative effects of an off-center pressing. A 'table with a reflex clamping system can remove the warp, altogether, during play.

And finally my personal experience of buying a $1000.00 Rega turntable that plays slightly too fast because of the power current being different from the UK (I live in North America.) Did you buy a UK Rega? American motors are not the same as the ones in its home country. Ask me how I know.
I also spent another $500.00 on a highly acclaimed stylus that I found too dark and muffled. Well, that's not a fault of the medium, if you know what I mean.
So my turntable has sat in the closet for the last 6 years

My only love for vinyl is the memories of hunting them down in the past.

Different strokes...

In bold, again. Sorry for the OT post.

 

[JamieMcC]

 
No offense, Jamie, but can you explain how to do it right?
I'm not saying you're wrong but I have my friendly doubts.
"as quiet as digital" is hard to believe since with great equipment you can actually hear the record turning.
Are you EQing out frequencies or using compressor/limiters?
Are you using $1000.00 record cleaners? (which in my experience with Nitty Gritty couldn't remove all dirt pops.)
Do the $5000.00 turntables fix this problem?
 
I can tell a lot of times when a professional CD is mastered from vinyl as you can here the odd pop.
 
I hope you don't take this the wrong way as I'm not trying to show you up... I'm just not a vinyl enthusiast.

No offense taken but it is achievable I only have a modest second hand set up which is well under $1000 also a Rega a 30 year old Planar 3, I did splash out and fit a Jico SAS stylus 1 to the original A&R P77 cartridge (cart and stylus only £150ish but do find the SAS stylus is truly outstanding) it must surely be down to setting up of the tone arm? As I only use a basic spin clean and sometimes the pva glue method. Certainly it Is not achieved on the majority of my records and I do only have a handful that will play this way. Many however will play with only the odd tell tell pop once or twice a side with the majority of tracks quiet. I do listen mostly with headphones the HD650 and more recently the T1 and have a dedicated custom built OTL amp for my vinyl listening. 
 
 
 

Sorry to barge in; couldn't resist. Reply in bold.

Edit: text

 
Neat room, I can only dream, one day perhaps. Those tall speakers look intriguing what are they! 

 

[lawrecedent]

Wow,sorry for derailing the thread people. I post my initial impressions about my new HD700'S in comparison to the HD650'S and return to find a full on vinyl war going on. Would love to get a vinyl set up going myself one day but for the time being other things take priority.

 

[JamieMcC]

 
So my turntable has sat in the closet for the last 6 years
 
My only love for vinyl is the memories of hunting them down in the past.
 
Different strokes...

 
Man get it out of the closet and dust if off ,vinyl can sometimes (but not always) be awesome with headphones I only recently purchased The War On Drugs "Lost in the Dream" LP after first purchasing the CD about six months earlier and was quiet surprised at the differences between the two finding the LP the more enjoyable. Saying all that  I did have to return the first copy I received due to a pressing defect.

 

[Koukol]

I guess we shouldn't derail this thread any further but I want to post this
 
 
The last piece of vinyl i bought was about 10 years ago.
It was of my favorite Album The Damned Grave Disorder.
I already had the CD and wanted any other format available in case there was the slightest difference in sound quality and the busy mixes could be better exposed.
I bought it at a specialty shop because vinyl hadn't made a come back yet and besides you don't find many Damned vinyl records here in Canada pretty much.
Anyways, the end of the first song has kind of a one minute wind-down...on the vinyl when this starts the damned things skips to the end of the song.
I've cleaned it with professional products but it's still there
I REALLY wished I had exchanged it but I didn't as it didn't sound better on my system and as I confessed earlier...I'm kinda lazy
 
When I bought my Rega turntable I had no idea it was British.
it wasn't until I complained to the Hi End Audio store years later that it plays slightly too fast that they told me why and awa amazed i noticed such a small difference.
I only had to spend another $300.00 for an adapter to fix it.
 
Bottom line...My $1000.00 Oppo 95 will kick the crap out of my $1,500.00 Rega set-up any-day and I'd rather invest in a $50.00 Japanese SHM SACD over a $40.00 virgin vinyl record any-day.
 
I also hate that you can't use the vinyl in the car.

 

[penmarker]

I want to ask whether you have calibrated/aligned the tonearm and cartridge properly with test records but I wouldn't want to derail this thread anymore too.

 

[Koukol]

  I want to ask whether you have calibrated/aligned the tonearm and cartridge properly with test records but I wouldn't want to derail this thread anymore too.

Yes, my high end audio shop set the entire thing up

 

[Shaffer]

Yes, my high end audio shop set the entire thing up

If I may, having done this for a living... The indecent you describe with the The Damned Grave Disorder can only occur due to poor setup. Skips are not generated by the LP, unless there's a boulder stuck in a groove (it rarely happens and a wood toothpick dislodges it); they're generated by the combined resonance of the arm and the cartridge, and then excited by the track. It doesn't sound like the shop spent more than 5 minutes with the 'table. Honestly, I wish I could bring my tools over and set it up for you. You'd be blown away by the difference and I'm not being hyperbolic. If you become interested in playing LPs again, please feel free to shoot me a PM and perhaps we could setup your rig together. Good luck.

 

[pietcux]

Does anyone of you vinyl lovers remember the NAKAMICHI turntables that could amend excentricies? I myself newer made it past a Technics SL 1710 MK2 with a decent SHURE V15/III, but it was a glorious time. You could watch the disk play and for me it was a pleasure to hear the rumble down low and to turn the disk. Btw I used Lencoclean to reduce static and dust noise. That was also an olfactoric adventure.
Btw the last headphone from that time was a YAMAHA ORTHO.

 

[Koukol]

 

Yes, my high end audio shop set the entire thing up

If I may, having done this for a living... The indecent you describe with the The Damned Grave Disorder can only occur due to poor setup. Skips are not generated by the LP, unless there's a boulder stuck in a groove (it rarely happens and a wood toothpick dislodges it); they're generated by the combined resonance of the arm and the cartridge, and then excited by the track. It doesn't sound like the shop spent more than 5 minutes with the 'table. Honestly, I wish I could bring my tools over and set it up for you. You'd be blown away by the difference and I'm not being hyperbolic. If you become interested in playing LPs again, please feel free to shoot me a PM and perhaps we could setup your rig together. Good luck.

That's very generous of you but I'd be surprised if Audio Ark didn't spend more than five minutes on it since setting it up in a private room to hear the results would have taken at least that.
They are what many call here a High End snob store.
 
But who knows what goes on behind doors so I may take you up on that in the future...cheers.

 

[Shaffer]

That's very generous of you but I'd be surprised if Audio Ark didn't spend more than five minutes on it since setting it up in a private room to hear the results would have taken at least that.
They are what many call here a High End snob store.

But who knows what goes on behind doors so I may take you up on that in the future...cheers.

I understand completely. As I said, I did this for a living working for one of the biggest analog specialists in the country. Sold and setup 'tables every day. I must have done at least a few hundred Regas and I can tell you from personal experience that one can setup a Rega in less than 5 minutes. With a Rega cartridge and a 3-point mount, even less time. Plugging it in takes seconds. Literally. In all honesty, I rarely spent more than 10 minutes on a $1000 'table. Not worth the time, unless there was additional compensation. Typically, it involved going to a client's home and setting up the 'table where it lives. The performance you're describing is not congruent with any kind of setup. Skips, arm flying across the LP. If they are a High-End store, they should be willing to come to your home and address the problems. This is different than custom setup; it's servicing a malfunctioning component on which they made a profit, and tending to their client. I've done it many times, usually to help with the speaker setup, when the client was not happy with the sound. Best of luck to you.