[elwappo99]

 
Of course flaws should be pointed out, but what those guys do is beyond pointing out flaws. They consistently bashed the HD700 for its treble spikes both here on head-fi and [REMOVED BY ME]  When they get criticized for relying on their frequency response charts way too much to make their points and base their reviews off of, they get mad and defensive, then go on a snobby rant. Oh, and many people don't even have problems with the treble spikes, which is their main complaint with the HD700 in the first place.
 
Here's a thread where purrin / marvey accuses Sennheiser of hiring people to shill for the HD700 on head-fi, just because they're new(ish) users disagreeing with his review and actually having positive things to say about the HD700:
 
 [REMOVED BY ME]
 
He had to close that thread because Currawong went in there and schooled him.
 
Here's a recent response from purrin when someone called him out for hyping Schiit Yggdrasil before it's even released:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/667711/new-schiit-ragnarok-and-yggdrasil/4410#post_11180971
 
This dude is a pompous, snobby, holier-than-thou, paranoid individual. I'm not sure how anyone can deny this fact after reading some of his posts. The problem is, a lot of people take him too seriously and start to spread his biased views around on head-fi, without even testing the products themselves. Then that viewpoint becomes the standard opinion. Which was what happened with the HD700.
 
P.S. How exactly do you objectively disprove someone's subjective review wrong?

 
Interesting points all around. 
 
1. I removed the links to a specific website. I've been asked not to link to that specific website.
2. I don't see where currawong "schooled" anyone? I'd be interested to see his comments on the HD700, as he definitely has heard enough gear to give a good impression. I could only find posts where he didn't seem super enthusiastic http://www.head-fi.org/t/667711/new-schiit-ragnarok-and-yggdrasil/4410#post_11180971
3. Purrin gets really excited about audio stuff, especially DACs. I'm not surprised to see him super excited about the Yggy. I don't know if it being "unreleased" is super relevant if he's heard it? We're all in the same local vicinity of Schiit down here, and Schiit is known to get feedback from the local users.
4. I can't really logically argue against calling him "a pompous, snobby, holier-than-thou, paranoid individual." I can only say he seemed like a pretty nice guy from the three or four times I talked to him at the SoCal meets over the years 

.
 
 
You bring up an interesting topic of objective vs. subjective. Many people who were posting their "subjective" opinions were getting bashed. The point of his review was that it tried to say "here's what I am hearing subjectively, here's a measurement to show it objectively". Measurements give a way to show what's actually going on to help understand what you're hearing. It's a way to visually communicate what's going on. Certainly, they're not very good on their own, and their are lots of nuances.
 
For example the HD700's have a treble peak in the measurements. Those are just total numbers which you can interpret how you like, but your interpretation doesn't change them. You can look at the CSD and see the treble rings a bit, which makes it sound bit worse than the standard FR would show. So if you wanted to say "the HD700s don't have a treble peak" you would have to explain how the objective measurement showed such a large peak, but you don't hear it. Here's how you could do that.
 
1. Bad measurement - Testing equipment was malfunctioning or the procedure was flawed (Tyll has a great video showing how he takes measurements). 
2. Defective unit - A few occasions defective headphones got measured. This caused some head scratching as people would say "mine don't sound like that at all, I hear it differently!" 
3. Revisions - Some long running headphones (eg HD650, LCD2) have had driver revisions over time. Consequently, measurements would be different.
4. Measurements don't correlate to sound well - Sometimes measurements may "look worse than they sound".  Example: "The treble peak is there, but to my ears, it's not as sharp as it looks"
 
 
With all that said. I think the price the HD700s are running about now makes them seem like a "decent" choice. For the asking price do I think there's better? Sure. Do I enjoy listening to mine sometimes? Yup! I just wish the cable wasn't so bulky and tangly! 

 

[elwappo99]

Since I got a PM on it, I think something that doesn't get mentioned enough about the HD700 is the comfort. The first time I put them on (at a meet) I had this strange sensation of something snuggling my ears. IT WAS FANTASTIC. 

 

[D4NGER BIRD]

   
I totally agree with you (at least on the bold part)

. Don't know if I can hang with Grado treble though 

 ouch! 
 
In the end, definitely what your ears like best is all that matters. I've got a pair of HD700s I throw on my Vali every now and then. I do like the space, and bloated bass. They're a "fun" headphone to listen to, even though I can nit-pick them to death for their flaws.
 
I think the point purrin was making is that many people come onto these forums looking for advice: At this point the HD700 were running $900 - $1000. Sometimes people purchase things without the ability to audition them, and even worse some people purchase them without audition or real serious audio knowledge. These were getting wave after wave of praise. IMHO these aren't worth that much. I wouldn't place them in the same category as the other $1k headphones. So isn't it somewhat misleading to a new person without experience to say "yes these are great for $1k" which leads them to a purchase that may not provide great price performance ratio? (I see your point as well, and I agree with both sides. Just playing devil's advocate 

).

Sure, I agree that a lot of people probably do come here looking for advice and make purchases without auditioning. But I'd say a lot of people that do this surely have some foundation to make a comparison to someone else's opinion. If someone had never heard a pair of headphones in their life, by HF consensus, they'd think that the HD700s sounded like cats scratching on a chalkboard even listening to Leonard Cohen. Clearly not the case, but I think people get stuck in a bubble here and want to over-accentuate what they view as a flaw when really it's just a slight deviation from what their preference might be.
 
Honestly, I don't see what is so polarizing about the sound of the HD700s. They sound more similar to the 650s than the 800s to me, the blandest of bland, but more like 650s that got a kick in the pants. The bass is a bit much on the 700s, but not as bloated as the 650s and the treble is a little raised, but not to the extent that it is made by some. To me, it fixes what I found lacking in the 650s but with the added soundstage and imaging.
 
Is it misleading to tell a new person that "yes these are great for $1k"? No, because if there is anything more subjective than a sound signature it's what someone else might put value in. Is the HD800 worth twice the price for the little performance over the HD700? To some, hell yes it is. Just as that little performance of the HD700s over the 650s was worth twice the price of the 650s to me, someone else probably thinks that is crazy.

 

[D4NGER BIRD]

  Since I got a PM on it, I think something that doesn't get mentioned enough about the HD700 is the comfort. The first time I put them on (at a meet) I had this strange sensation of something snuggling my ears. IT WAS FANTASTIC. 

They are stupid comfortable.

 

[Solarium]

 
Well, there goes that.

 
Call me crazy but this new 700 definitely gives me more treble fatigue than the previous. Can the same headphone within the same revision differ that much? I wish they gave every 700 a graph.

 

[elwappo99]

 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Sure, I agree that a lot of people probably do come here looking for advice and make purchases without auditioning. But I'd say a lot of people that do this surely have some foundation to make a comparison to someone else's opinion. If someone had never heard a pair of headphones in their life, by HF consensus, they'd think that the HD700s sounded like cats scratching on a chalkboard even listening to Leonard Cohen. Clearly not the case, but I think people get stuck in a bubble here and want to over-accentuate what they view as a flaw when really it's just a slight deviation from what their preference might be.
 
Honestly, I don't see what is so polarizing about the sound of the HD700s. They sound more similar to the 650s than the 800s to me, the blandest of bland, but more like 650s that got a kick in the pants. The bass is a bit much on the 700s, but not as bloated as the 650s and the treble is a little raised, but not to the extent that it is made by some. To me, it fixes what I found lacking in the 650s but with the added soundstage and imaging.
 
Is it misleading to tell a new person that "yes these are great for $1k"? No, because if there is anything more subjective than a sound signature it's what someone else might put value in. Is the HD800 worth twice the price for the little performance over the HD700? To some, hell yes it is. Just as that little performance of the HD700s over the 650s was worth twice the price of the 650s to me, someone else probably thinks that is crazy.

 

 
I think good points all around 

.  
 
I think I've said it before, but I'm not totally sure what is so polarizing about these headphones while the consensus (or my impression at least) is that the HD800 are amazing headphones.
 

 
 
Call me crazy but this new 700 definitely gives me more treble fatigue than the previous. Can the same headphone within the same revision differ that much? I wish they gave every 700 a graph.

 
Bummer. Unfortunately I haven't seen any measurements comparing HD700s from different production periods. Have you tried any simple modifications? They might help. I also try not to listen to these when I first wake up.

 

[Evshrug]

Since I got a PM on it, I think something that doesn't get mentioned enough about the HD700 is the comfort. The first time I put them on (at a meet) I had this strange sensation of something snuggling my ears. IT WAS FANTASTIC. 

*snuggle!*
Awesome visceral description! I agree, though the HD700 has a pretty gentle snuggle (the not too broad pads contribute to that).

 

[BobFiggins]

"Just a few songs before bed."
 
Get home from work, tired, have just enough time to get a quick bite, start some laundry, listen to a few songs, and then hit the sack.
 
Always is the plan. Somehow a few songs turns into an hour of listening. Every night.

 

[sha007]

Hello friends. I just joined this forum. I am getting a HD 700 very soon. Currently I have a HD 558 and a x-fi Titanium HD sound card. I know that I'm gonna need a desktop headphone amp for the HD 700 so I was thinking to get a Fiio e90k. I want to know is the titanium HD enough for the e90k or do I have to change the sound card as well to get the best sound from the HD700? I have very limited knowledge about audiophile things so please help me out.
 
Thanks. 

 

[IYAshike]

  Hello friends. I just joined this forum. I am getting a HD 700 very soon. Currently I have a HD 558 and a x-fi Titanium HD sound card. I know that I'm gonna need a desktop headphone amp for the HD 700 so I was thinking to get a Fiio e90k. I want to know is the titanium HD enough for the e90k or do I have to change the sound card as well to get the best sound from the HD700? I have very limited knowledge about audiophile things so please help me out.
 
Thanks. 

 
Hello sha007, welcome!
 
(cutting to the cheese): If l were you, l would take it easy and try first the HD-700s with your Titanium HD. Unless you have experience with other gear/HPs it may be very hard for you to discern the potential differences between different gear. Differences are hardly 'night and day', l would dare to say "never". 
 
l read on your sound card's website (here) that the Titanium can deal with HPs up to 300 Ohms (power enough for the HD-700. Besides, they're easy to drive). l don't think that Fiio is going to give you a very noticeable upgrade compared to your sound card, but, l have not listened to any of them (Fiio or Titanium) so l don't know. lf l were to upgrade to something, then l would suggest you to take a look at Audio GD (good products at competitive prices) should you want to buy a solid state amp. Some guys here prefer 'tube amps' for the HD-700s (somebody else may help you with that)... l'm happy with the pairing my solid state amp. does with the 700... 
 
My two cents, hope it helps 

 

 

[BobFiggins]

Can't find it to save my life. Though I saw a website that said the Asgard paired well with the HD700, and is supposedly warmer than the Valhalla 2. Have any of you tried the HD700 with the mid-range Schiit? Such as the Lyr/Valhalla 2/Asgard 2? What are your impressions?
 
A Singlepower MPX3 made the HD700 sound wonderful, and removed the fatiguing "SSS" sounds. However, at its price point, and supposed build quality, it just isn't worth attempting for me. Schiit is a lot cheaper, and I always hear amazing things about the quality for the money.
 
EDIT: This isn't the site that I saw stating the Asgard was warm with the HD700/800. Though this also says a similar thing, though seems to be based on reading information rather than personal experience:
http://www.head-fi.org/t/747157/schiit-asgard-2-lyr-1-or-valhalla-2-for-hd700-and-possible-upgrade-to-hd800

 

[pietcux]

The Sennheiser HD700 sounds very good out of the FIIO E12A, MEIER AUDIO STEPDANCE , out of my Creative Soundblaster Z and directly out of the headphone out of the Ipod Classic last gen 120GB. I do not see any need to buy a tube amp so far. Btw, the treble edge, they seem to have to some people, diappeared after only a few days for me. On most of the Ultrasones that I owned, it remained forever. So the HD700 treble may be prominent, but still have a good quality.

 

[BobFiggins]

  Btw, the treble edge, they seem to have to some people, diappeared after only a few days for me.

 
I find with the HD700, the peaks at 5-6k don't bother me. It's the brightness at 10k that gets me the most. I've noticed that my tinnitus has really flared up in the last few weeks. Went from hearing it during silence, to now hearing it doing anything.
 
Actually debating selling the HD700, and tossing in some cash to get the HD800 instead.

 

[pietcux]

I find with the HD700, the peaks at 5-6k don't bother me. It's the brightness at 10k that gets me the most. I've noticed that my tinnitus has really flared up in the last few weeks. Went from hearing it during silence, to now hearing it doing anything.

Actually debating selling the HD700, and tossing in some cash to get the HD800 instead.

I recommend to give yourself some more time to evaluate. As I said I also had an increase of this noise for some time. But for me it is strongly depending on my overall health background. If I have an early state of flue, I cannot use headphones at all. The noise is there when putting the can on before the music starts. When I'm 100% healthy, no noise at all, only with some U.....ne cans that left me already because of that.

 

[IYAshike]

   
I find with the HD700, the peaks at 5-6k don't bother me. It's the brightness at 10k that gets me the most. I've noticed that my tinnitus has really flared up in the last few weeks. Went from hearing it during silence, to now hearing it doing anything.
 
Actually debating selling the HD700, and tossing in some cash to get the HD800 instead.

 
Let me take advantage and state this English saying l love so much: "Two wrongs don't make a right" 

 l mean, you're going from a bright HP to another in order to sort your problem? You're looking at the "brighter" older brother? ("brighter" in the sense of "smarter", just playing with words...). 
 
This is absolutely non-scientific, but l have observed that, in periods of more stress, l can hear that 'tinnitus noise' more acute or pronounced. lt may be a similar case to you...