[AuditoryCanvas]

@AuditoryCanvas one more question. How would you rate Siemens E88CC halo getter to the ones you describe above? I'm asking because I'll most probably be getting a nice pair for a moderate price.

Those are some of the better 6922 types, though quite neutral in character. I'd say they were close to some of the 12AT7 variants like the Telefunken ECC81.

Try and get early to mid 60s Siemens E88CC with grey plates rather than silver plates (rectangle plate attached to the mica just under the getter platform), and try and get the single getter post ones rather than A-frame.

Give me a shout if you need help deciphering the date stamps/codes. Some of the 60s Siemens have etched codes, some have a stamped silver plate on the getter platform.
Good reference here for deciphering them here too: https://frank.pocnet.net/other/Philips/PhilipsCodeListAB.pdf - it says Philips codes, but covers most other European tubes too. Philips branded tubes as Valvo, SQ, miniwatt, and many others, and you'll often find brands making tubes for other brands - it's not uncommon to find Siemens tubes branded as Telefunken sometimes for example (you can tell because they won't have the Telefunken diamond on the bottom). you can usually tell the actual manufacture by the date code and/or construction.

The main thing with the 12A*7 types and variants, aside form some of the more expensive ones, is that they're typically more readily available, for a better price than the 6922 types they compete with. Unfortunately ones like the Valvo 6201s have jumped significantly in price compared to a few years ago - the triple mica pinched waist ones used to go for around $350 or less a pair, and now they're going to $800 plus. Similar to how the 6922 types kept going up in price, and rarity, and began getting more exploited in price on ebay. Fortunately, a lot of the 12A*7 types/variants haven't met the same fate yet. So in short, you'll generally get a much better quality tube, for less than you'd pay for a decent 6922 type, with a few exceptions as always.

 

[UntilThen]

Prices of tubes goes up like crazy. I have amps that uses 6sn7 and 6as7/6080 and I have the better ones. Prices are crazy now.

I have Amperex Orange Globes and right now I have Voskhod 6n23p '73 in mj2 and I thought it sounded marvellous. I don't really want to spend too much on these tubes because I've in mind an additional different kind of amp in the ampandsound Mogwai Se and that uses KT88, KT77 and EL34. Rolling these big tubes is going to cost a lot more.

However I think I will have 10 pair of nice tubes for mj2, all different flavours preferably and that would be it.

 

[AuditoryCanvas]

Prices of tubes goes up like crazy. I have amps that uses 6sn7 and 6as7/6080 and I have the better ones. Prices are crazy now.

I have Amperex Orange Globes and right now I have Voskhod 6n23p '73 in mj2 and I thought it sounded marvellous. I don't really want to spend too much on these tubes because I've in mind an additional different kind of amp in the ampandsound Mogwai Se and that uses KT88, KT77 and EL34. Rolling these big tubes is going to cost a lot more.

However I think I will have 10 pair of nice tubes for mj2, all different flavours preferably and that would be it.

If you want to try them without breaking the bank, and you like the mj2 with the Voskhods, you could try any of the following, you should be able to grab a pair of one of the following for a lot less than $100 in most cases, though some might be closer to $100.

What country are you based?

Mullard 6201 - Upscale audio currently has them at $45 per tube, which for their prices is actually bloody good.

RCA 12AU7 (side getter, clear top) - very cheap (around $25 to $30 a pair), definitely worth grabbing a pair of these at that price, but I wouldn't want them to be your only impression of these tube types, they're a bit more rolled off on the top, and warmer on the bottom end. Good for some music types, and work well for some recordings, but not good for daily drivers unless you like that signature (based on you liking the Voskhods, I'd say no)

Telefunken ECC81 - late 50s/early 60s 45 degree angled getter

Tung-Sol 5814A - Good all rounder at a decent price

RCA 12AT7 - black plates, D-getter

Philips/Valvo ECC81 - Late 50s to early 60s (Heerlen factory code)

 

[UntilThen]

Thanks for short listing those few tubes. I'll look out for those. I'm from Sydney Australia.

 

[Randolf711]

So I received my B-stock Mjolnir 2 from Schiit today, literally an hour ago. I am listening with the stock tubes, SE Inputs, SE output to HD 650's. I already ordered upgraded tubes and will be ordering the 800S for my eventual set up. The B-stock had no blemishes I could find so it must have been a return.

I am coming from the Asgard 2, so please take my impressions with a grain of salt. I am by NO means a headphone/amp expert, nor have I listened to many types or styles. I did buy the Schiit Magnius (returned it because Asgard was better still for me) and have extensively listened to the THX's head amps.

So far, cold and right out of the box, the amp is doing everything right and is a lot of fun to listen to. I am going mac mini->Yggy -> MJ2

I have been reading this forum for the past week, half way done so far, and many have said the SE side is fine. I think if the balanced output is that much better, I am going to be beyond thrilled. The 650's were always muddy, and as a lover of orchestral music, they were less than ideal for me. Right away the 650's sound completely different. The attack of notes and the high frequencies are popping through (in a good way). It has a lot of strength and handles complex, layered, chordal passages very well. Details are coming through that were missing before.

If my plan was to only upgrade my amp and not the headphones, the Mjolnir is already worth it. The SE side of the amp is very well implemented and is a worthy upgrade. Now I get to play with tubes and upgrade my cans.

What I'm listening to...

Ludwig Streicher "Encores"
Lorraine Hunt Lieberson "Bach Cantata's"
Miles "Sketches of Spain"
Adrienne Lenker's "Songs"
War on Drugs "Lost in the Dream"
Sonny Rollins 'the Bridge"
Nat King Cole "After Midnight"
Joni Mitchell "Mingus"
LA Philharmonic "Ives: Complete Symphonies"

 

[UntilThen]

Glad you like the MJ2. I had Ragnarok 3 years ago with Yggdrasil but I sold off Rag because I was chasing tube amps, OTLs and transformer coupled.

I'm really enjoying mj2 now fed in balance mode from my Questyle CMA 12 AK4490 dac chips and listening with He1000se in balance mode. Balance is the way to go in MJ2. I tried SE but balance is way more forceful and energised. Similarly with CMA 12 - balance out perform SE on that all in one by a lot.

My Yggdrasil is in my work accomodation which I'll get to in a week's time. Can't wait to pair Yggdrasil with MJ2 in balanced mode. LCD-3f and LCD-X sounded great with MJ2.

This morning I listen to 2L Audiophile Reference Recordings - The Nordic Sound on Tidal HiFi. I don't usually listen to classical but I'm enjoying it now because the soft passages are still clear and when the orchestra goes in full swing, that's when mj2 shows what it can do.

Songs:-
https://tidal.com/browse/track/2400333 - violins are crystal clear. Haydn never sounded better.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/2400323 - Gregorian chants sound mythical.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/119744810 - Prokofiev Alexander Nevsky Battle on Ice - yes yes yes

Now for a faster tempo...
https://tidal.com/browse/track/8439075 - Jennifer Warnes 'First We Take Manhattan' now my toes are tapping.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/8439076 - Bird On a Wire - hmmmm nice.

Did you say War On Drugs? My fav !
https://tidal.com/browse/track/77481941 - Pain. Now I'm in pain ecstasy.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/77481942 - Holding On - indeed I am literally by the seat of my pants !

Finally otherwise it's too many....
https://tidal.com/browse/track/55391453 - 'Mother' by Pink Floyd. David Gilmore & Rogers Waters never sounded better.

 

[Smoothstereo]

Do you guys hear a difference in presentation style when comparing the SE out to the BAL 4pin xlr out on MJ2? To me the BAL out seems to have a zoomed out presentation, where the vocals are pushed a bit back , like you are hearing from a farther distance. Whereas the SE out seems a bit more upfront so vocals are more present. This is using the stock tubes with the same headphone. I level matched the volume on both outputs to eliminate that factor.

Just curious if others hear the same effect.

 

[UntilThen]

Will get to that later today. Presently switch to Woo Audio Wa22 and loving the tube goodness.

 

[Randolf711]

Glad you like the MJ2. I had Ragnarok 3 years ago with Yggdrasil but I sold off Rag because I was chasing tube amps, OTLs and transformer coupled.

I'm really enjoying mj2 now fed in balance mode from my Questyle CMA 12 AK4490 dac chips and listening with He1000se in balance mode. Balance is the way to go in MJ2. I tried SE but balance is way more forceful and energised. Similarly with CMA 12 - balance out perform SE on that all in one by a lot.

My Yggdrasil is in my work accomodation which I'll get to in a week's time. Can't wait to pair Yggdrasil with MJ2 in balanced mode. LCD-3f and LCD-X sounded great with MJ2.

This morning I listen to 2L Audiophile Reference Recordings - The Nordic Sound on Tidal HiFi. I don't usually listen to classical but I'm enjoying it now because the soft passages are still clear and when the orchestra goes in full swing, that's when mj2 shows what it can do.

Songs:-
https://tidal.com/browse/track/2400333 - violins are crystal clear. Haydn never sounded better.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/2400323 - Gregorian chants sound mythical.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/119744810 - Prokofiev Alexander Nevsky Battle on Ice - yes yes yes

Now for a faster tempo...
https://tidal.com/browse/track/8439075 - Jennifer Warnes 'First We Take Manhattan' now my toes are tapping.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/8439076 - Bird On a Wire - hmmmm nice.

Did you say War On Drugs? My fav !
https://tidal.com/browse/track/77481941 - Pain. Now I'm in pain ecstasy.
https://tidal.com/browse/track/77481942 - Holding On - indeed I am literally by the seat of my pants !

Finally otherwise it's too many....
https://tidal.com/browse/track/55391453 - 'Mother' by Pink Floyd. David Gilmore & Rogers Waters never sounded better.

I ALWAYS listen to that Warnes album, one of my very favorites.

The only thing frustrating with having the Yggy, Freya, and MJ2, is the inability to use balanced in for both the Freya and Mj2. Otherwise, this amp is wonderful!!

​

 

[Randolf711]

Do you guys hear a difference in presentation style when comparing the SE out to the BAL 4pin xlr out on MJ2? To me the BAL out seems to have a zoomed out presentation, where the vocals are pushed a bit back , like you are hearing from a farther distance. Whereas the SE out seems a bit more upfront so vocals are more present. This is using the stock tubes with the same headphone. I level matched the volume on both outputs to eliminate that factor.

Just curious if others hear the same effect.

That’s an interesting note. I will let you know next week!

 

[UntilThen]

I ALWAYS listen to that Warnes album, one of my very favorites.

The only thing frustrating with having the Yggy, Freya, and MJ2, is the inability to use balanced in for both the Freya and Mj2. Otherwise, this amp is wonderful!!

​

Why can't you go balance from Yggdrasil > Freya + > Mjolnir 2 ? Not that I need Freya + in my system otherwise would have got it. Freya with Ragnarok would have been good to add some tube tone.

 

[Licht]

Do you guys hear a difference in presentation style when comparing the SE out to the BAL 4pin xlr out on MJ2? To me the BAL out seems to have a zoomed out presentation, where the vocals are pushed a bit back , like you are hearing from a farther distance. Whereas the SE out seems a bit more upfront so vocals are more present. This is using the stock tubes with the same headphone. I level matched the volume on both outputs to eliminate that factor.

Just curious if others hear the same effect.

Yes I agree.
SE sound more stronger center to me, while BAL better separation and holographic sound, and way better defined bass.
If you prefer more in-your-face vocal presentation, SE might be better. I prefer the better separation and controlled bass so only using XLR if possible.
Only rough comparison on Mjolnir2 without volume matching though. (compared again with Ether2, HD650, HE560)

If you are using adaptors (XLR to SE or 3.5mm to 6.3mm), presentation changes by adaptor too and can adjust the sound a little bit (or you might think a lot) by them, but general impression of SE vs BAL exist to me.

 

[tjl5709]

So I received my B-stock Mjolnir 2 from Schiit today, literally an hour ago. I am listening with the stock tubes, SE Inputs, SE output to HD 650's. I already ordered upgraded tubes and will be ordering the 800S for my eventual set up. The B-stock had no blemishes I could find so it must have been a return.

I am coming from the Asgard 2, so please take my impressions with a grain of salt. I am by NO means a headphone/amp expert, nor have I listened to many types or styles. I did buy the Schiit Magnius (returned it because Asgard was better still for me) and have extensively listened to the THX's head amps.

So far, cold and right out of the box, the amp is doing everything right and is a lot of fun to listen to. I am going mac mini->Yggy -> MJ2

I have been reading this forum for the past week, half way done so far, and many have said the SE side is fine. I think if the balanced output is that much better, I am going to be beyond thrilled. The 650's were always muddy, and as a lover of orchestral music, they were less than ideal for me. Right away the 650's sound completely different. The attack of notes and the high frequencies are popping through (in a good way). It has a lot of strength and handles complex, layered, chordal passages very well. Details are coming through that were missing before.

If my plan was to only upgrade my amp and not the headphones, the Mjolnir is already worth it. The SE side of the amp is very well implemented and is a worthy upgrade. Now I get to play with tubes and upgrade my cans.

What I'm listening to...

Ludwig Streicher "Encores"
Lorraine Hunt Lieberson "Bach Cantata's"
Miles "Sketches of Spain"
Adrienne Lenker's "Songs"
War on Drugs "Lost in the Dream"
Sonny Rollins 'the Bridge"
Nat King Cole "After Midnight"
Joni Mitchell "Mingus"
LA Philharmonic "Ives: Complete Symphonies"

I am not seeing it in any of your posts, or the replies so I'll chime in. The MJ2 SE has less power out than balanced. The 650's will be completely changed if you feed everything balanced. Just saying.

My comment is based on the following gear history..........

I moved from bifrost/lyr (HD650/Maddogs) to gungnir/mj2 (HD650 > HD800s, Maddogs> Ether C) then to yggy/mj2 (HD800s , Ether C Flow).

I did a lot of tube searching (acquiring) during the early lyr days, so all those lyr tubes carried over. You want to make the effort to replace the OE's. Trust me on that.

I'm pretty much done on the gear other than wanting to do an upgrade to yggy. Waiting to see if they come out with analog 3.

 

[UntilThen]

I tried SE but balance is way more forceful and energised.

That’s what I said. It’s definitely more powerful in balance mode.

 

[Randolf711]

Why can't you go balance from Yggdrasil > Freya + > Mjolnir 2 ? Not that I need Freya + in my system otherwise would have got it. Freya with Ragnarok would have been good to add some tube tone.

I considered that but I didn’t know how it may alter the sound heading to my Vidar’s. I guess I could just try it, can’t hurt. In theory, I could also go to the MJ2 then the Freya. I was just planning to use SE input but the balanced out to headphones with hd800s.