[acs236]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rab10 What about the SR-325i, and the RS-2?

I found the 325i to be very different than the RS-2, however, the MS-2 and RS-2 are kind of similar. The 325i is edgy and it's brighter than the RS-2, which is smooth, almost laid back, and punchier in the bass than the 325i.

 

[episiarch]

Quote:

Originally Posted by crazyfrenchman27 There is a huge difference between the two: the MS-2 are better, to my ears, with more clarity and resolution. That $500 is almost the difference between MS-2 used and an RS-1 used, as well ($500 compared to $200).

Larry at Headphile says* he thinks MS-1 and MS-2 may have the same drivers**, based on the sound of a woodied MS-1. Since he has a couple of woodied MS-1s for sale for about the price of a new MS-2, I'm wondering if anyone else has any comment on this. I heard a woodied MS-1 yesterday and it did sound very good, but I haven't heard an MS-2, RS-1 or RS-2 recently enough to make a comparison.

[size=xx-small]* scroll down to description #10[/size]
[size=xx-small]** though MS-2 drivers are matched to 0.05db rather than 0.1db[/size]

 

[Gradofan2]

I've got the SR225's, the RS-1's and the HD650's. I've also tried the SR125's, SR325i's and HD600's over the last 6 months.

What I've learned from all this experimentation is:

1. It's the total synergy of the source, amp, phones, headphone cables, interconnects, and power cords... and oh yes the ear pads believe it or not, that make the sound - good, or bad. The sound will not be much better than the weakest link in this chain. So, for my money, I wouldn't invest too much in any set of headphones, if any of the rest of this chain is not "top notch."

2. The SR225's are the greatest value in the Grado line, including compared to the RS-1's and RS-2's. They're often referred to as "the poor man's RS-1" - and it's absolutely true! "All other things equal," they sound virtually identical to the RS-1's - just 5% less bass extension, and 5% smaller soundstage - everything else is the same. The SR125's are too sibilant and the bass is a bit weak, the SR325i's are too sibilant, and the bass and lower mids are a bit too strong. The SR225's are "just right," although the highs are still a bit bright. But, the bass can be improved and the highs tamed by simply reversing the bowl pads as suggested earlier in this thread - reverse the pads and they are truly outstanding! Forget about the overpiced Flat Pads, I've tried them and returned them - they muffle the sound, eliminate the highs, and muddy the bass. And... if you read most of the reviews and comments of the SR225's that you can find at Headfi, or Audioreview/Audioholics, you'll find they agree. The RS-1's are great, also, but not for their $400+ premium - and, as I said, they're only 5% better.

3. The HD650's may well eclipse all of the Grado's... with the proper source, amp, cabling, etc.... and... if they're "de-veiled" (a trick I learned elsewhere on Headfi). I removed the stock foam lining in each phone (which is all you need to do to hear the dramatic improvement), and replaced it with fiberglass window screen mesh from Lowes / Home Depot, just to protect the drivers a little more. The foggy veil was eliminated, and the sound became instantly much more dynamic, crisp, and clear - much like the Grados, but with a much bigger soundstage, and bigger bass (although still punchy, tight and well defined). Of course, this is with the Cardas Cable, and 100+ hours of "burn in." I understand from others on Headfi they also sound great with the much more expensive Zu Mobus cable (same dynamics and clear extended highs). But, they don't really clear up without the "burn in."

And if you really want to get the best out of them (truly phenomenal, world-class sound), you can mate them with the Musical Fidelity XCAN v3, X-PSU v3 (power supply), with the Revelation Passage Cryo-Silver Reference Power Cables, with the Music Hall MMF CD25 1+ CD player. This combo produces the great warm, lush, liquid sound of tubes, combined with the tight, punch and dynamics of solid state. I understand from Headfi, they also sound phenomenal with the Lehmann Black Cube Linear, as well as the Gilmore, and Ray Samuels amps. But without the rest of the links in the chain, you're best to stick with the SR225's!

Believe it... or spend your money and find out.

650smile:

 

[adhoc]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 The HD650's may well eclipse all of the Grado's

HERESY!!

 

[braillediver]

The RS-1's rock and any blather about the MS2's being better is just so much noise. There's a reason why the RS-1's are the top of the Grado Line.

The RS-1's will sound better as you improve your system. They'll ad to your investment and continue to shine. They're an investment not a disposable purchase.


Mitch

 

[LFF]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braillediver They're an investment not a disposable purchase. Mitch

I completely agree. I have and continue to see my RS-1's as an investment in my sanity and health. The lush and warm sound they exude just relaxes me beyond compare. Plus, they look soo sexy. Add some Headphile C-Pads and you'll never regret it.

 

[John2e]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradofan2 3. The HD650's may well eclipse all of the Grado's... with the proper source, amp, cabling, etc.... and... if they're "de-veiled" (a trick I learned elsewhere on Headfi). I removed the stock foam lining in each phone (which is all you need to do to hear the dramatic improvement), and replaced it with fiberglass window screen mesh from Lowes / Home Depot, just to protect the drivers a little more. The foggy veil was eliminated, and the sound became instantly much more dynamic, crisp, and clear - much like the Grados, but with a much bigger soundstage, and bigger bass (although still punchy, tight and well defined). 650smile:

Any links to this I just put my 650's up for sale. I'd love for them to surpass the sound I am getting with the PS-1's. I would return them to TTVJ within my 30 day trial period. (Better hold off on the headphile beta mod for the PS-1's)

Even with the silver dragon replacement cord, the 650's sounded murky imho. The Ps-1s are brighter but seem to be toned down a bit with the raptor tube amp. Maybe too bright on some recordings.....

 

[crazyfrenchman27]

Quote:

Originally Posted by adhoc but imo, the rs-1 is better. my source is not exactly top-end, yet the difference between the ms-2 and the rs-1 is startling - one must have cloth ears to not hear it! all imo: the rs-1 has a fuller bass, and for lack of a better word, a 'fuller' sound in general. the rs-1 has a bit less midbass and far more deep bass. the bass impact on both phones are identical, but the ms-2s have a metallic edge to things which i didnt like - things sometimes go 'think' when they should go 'thing'. the rs-1 excels at low level listening when compared to the ms-2. the rs-1's midrange is, imo, magical compared to the ms-2, which can be a little too dry sometimes. what you call clarity, i call a marked dip in 5-7khz. what you call resolution, i call a slightly tipped up treble. we'll all agree to disagree here. but no - i'm not saying that the rs-1 is perfect. it's not. it has a tendency to 'ring' and sometimes i do wish the highest treble and midbass was toned down a teensy weensy bit. but is it close to my vision of perfection? of all the headphones ive tried so far, most certainly.

The RS-1 is far more colored than the MS-2. That is exactly why people like it. Same goes for the HD650. Although they are less colored than the RS-1, they are still warm.

People like warm, even if it's inaccurate.

-Matt

 

[bookkeepers_son]

I guess to each his own. I owned RS-1s and used a Cary 300sei to drive them. I think I've used this combination for all of 10 hours (over a period of 5 years) total before I finally sold the RS-1. They are good cans but I couldn't get past that woody coloration that imposed itself over everything, and the fact that something in the design hurt my ears.

I own the MS-2 now, and I passed that 10 hours in just 4 days when I first got them, as opposed to 5 years with the RS-1s. The MS-2 in my system (below) is something to behold. Up there with HE-90 I have listened to the HE-90 extensively twice in the past. Maybe my aural memory is messing me with me, but then again...

 

[Jahn]

if you like the laid back neutral side of john grado, while still having more verve than a joe grado, the alessandros are going to appeal to you. imho the sweet spot in that line is the MS-2. if you like a crazy can, the RS-1 is for you, the epitome of john grado's appeal to the commercial market. so even tho the RS-1 is a "better" can, the MS-2 might be preferred due to its "house" sound.

 

[donunus]

to the people that highly prefer the rs1 to the ms2: Is the sr225 better than the ms2 in your honest opinions... since its supposed to be similar to the rs1? to ms2 lovers: what can you say about this?

 

[Kurt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by John2e The Ps-1s are brighter but seem to be toned down a bit with the raptor tube amp. Maybe too bright on some recordings.....

With not so good and/or bright (often the same) recordings, I prefer the HD650 to the PS-1, RS-1 and SA5000. They make those recordings bearable, while with the others I get ear pain.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by braillediver The RS-1's rock and any blather about the MS2's being better is just so much noise. There's a reason why the RS-1's are the top of the Grado Line. The RS-1's will sound better as you improve your system. They'll ad to your investment and continue to shine. They're an investment not a disposable purchase. Mitch

I completely agree. The RS-1's scale extremely well. I am listening to the 325i's right now and I put them at slighly below the MS-2's. There is simply no contest (in my opinion blah blah blah). What is achieved with the top of the line Prestige series is hyper articulation which is unnatural in my opinion. The RS-1's have as much or more resolution but it is not as "in your face" as the metals. As for everything else, the RS-1's will be easier on poorer equipement but on high grade equipment will demolish most other phones. In this way they are a very good purchase because some of that awful transistor sheen is taken care of by the RS-1's but on higher grade gear where that is not so much a problem, the RS-1's are then capable of reproducing what the system is throwing at it. If I had to do it all over again, I'd do it exactly as I originally did, get a feel for the house sound (the SR60's were my initial purchase) and then go all out with the RS-1's.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by John2e Even with the silver dragon replacement cord, the 650's sounded murky imho. The Ps-1s are brighter but seem to be toned down a bit with the raptor tube amp. Maybe too bright on some recordings.....

The Raptor is a very bright tube amp, very ss sounding. If you want to tone down the "brightness" of the PS-1's you need to switch amps or roll some tubes at least. The PS-1's are actually the least bright of any Grado ever made in my opinion, including the HP-1000's. Try an Earmax Pro, a Maple Tree Audio Ear or the Ear HP4 for some alternatives and much warmer amps. (though they too can be cool, with the right tubes, telefunkens for instance)

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donunus to the people that highly prefer the rs1 to the ms2: Is the sr225 better than the ms2 in your honest opinions... since its supposed to be similar to the rs1? to ms2 lovers: what can you say about this?

I would say that the MS2's are better overall. They provide more resolution, more body more oomph and snap to the notes. When the new 325i's hit the market I believe they surpassed the 225's.