[slim.a]

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Regarding the mods, there is something that I haven't read about but that might have an impact on the sound. The dac19dsp (like all other ACSS dacs and amps) use what look like OPA2134 in their DC servo. I wonder if replacing those opamps will make any audible change?
Anyone care to speculate?

 
More than speculation - I've swapped OPA2134 (5x in Roc; 4x in RE-7) with OPA2227 which has better DC servo application characteristics.
 
There were no sonic differences or they were too subtle for me to reliably perceive them.
 
I left OPA2227 in anyway because of "it is better for DC servo" feelgood factor.

Thanks for the feedback FauDrei! That means I won't be in a hurry trying different opamps for the DC servo right away, butI will probably try those OPA2227 at some point to get the same "feelgood factor"

 

[csholtmeier]

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As most equipment has removable toplates why not just remove the DAC 19 and the connecting downstream amp t/plates, remove the digital chassis plugs and solder directly from DAC to amp, using rubber grommets to protect the cables.
 

 This is a great idea. What cable would you recommend?

 

[slim.a]

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Regarding DPS1 version. How to tell what version one have? There are no sticker on the board as far as I can see. I received my DAC-19 (with the C-2) last week and my version don't have switches but shorting pins. I actually like that better as it is makes it very easy to mount an outside switch without having to solder on the DSP board.

I like to thank slim.a for this great review. I was ready to pull the trigger on the LD IV-SE when I realized I would need a better source. Then I realized that if I where to have the LD turned on as long as I wanted to I would burn thought two $120 (shipping & 25% tax) tube setts a year. Cheap as I am I decided to invest this money in the source instead.  

What I was looking for was a system that would not fatigue me. I system that would play music for the pleasure of music. Not just stunning sounds. Reading slim.a's review I felt the DAC-19/C-2 combo might be what I'm looking for. Tanberg have made several good but imperfect amp's though the years. I know a couple of them and they have this rare magic that when your finished listening to gear these amps let you enjoy music until one do the mistake again and do gear swooping.

It is to early to say if the DAC-19/C-2 combo will get me there (250 hours and still waiting for new cans). But so far there are only two things that has stunned me with this setup. And I mean this in a good way. The fact that there isn't actually anything jumping in my face is a good thing in my book. But what did get me was the sheer blackness I felt when I turned on music the first time. I don't know how to describe it. It was like it was only me there with this bass instrument in this the empty dark room. Totally strange feeling. Later I found that this impression of blackness was reinforced by the other quality that stands out with this setup. Bass details and control. I get this feeling that there is this massive 10.000 watt amp ready to stop that cone from doing anything it is not supposed to do. Talking of details. There are lots of them. So far none of them stands out so I need to concentrate if i want to hear them. Although I think details sound natural an realistic I'm also sertan that better equipment will do it even better. But then I forget about it and enjoy the music.

Ohh... one thing. All the talk about how responsive Kingwa is if one have technical question is confirmed. Great service so far. I hope I've not started the journey for the RE-7.

Hi notThinking,
 
I am glad you are liking your dac19/c2 combo. Blackness of background and details are indeed 2 of the (many) strengths of the combo.
 
I would also like to add that the dac19dsp/c2 is very receptive to tweaks. With my current set-up and using the ALO recabled Beyer T1s, there is a sense of being transported to a different recording venue each time you change a recording. Other set-ups that I have listened to could show the differences in tonal balance, soundstage... from one recording to another, and even from one track to the other in the same recording. However, the "tweaked" DI-Oyaide-DAC19-Deep Sounds-C2-ALO BeyerT1 combo litteraly gives me the impression of being transported to a different place when listening to different recordings.
It means that everything changes: tonal balance, timber, dynamics, Pace, rythm, soundstage and imaging. I used to be able to pick up the difference in soundstaging between recordings for example, but now it is like my brain has zero effort to do, and I can picture and "feel" pretty easily the recording space. I believe that it is the sheer weight of information that allow to not only hear instruments playing alone but also instruments "playing with the recording venue".
It is also strange that how an increase in resolution can lead to less strain in the brain/ears. The good thing is that low quality recordings and even MP3s don't sound bad. MP3s clearly show a lack of resolution in comparison with lossless files but they are still very enjoyable.
 
In any case, enjoy your dac19/c2 and keep us updated of your impressions when you get to try new cans with it.

 

[haloxt]

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C-2 SA uses a different circuit than C-2, more important than whether or not you want an expensive rca cable, is if you like the sound of DD or ACSS. I would wait for slim.a to give a review, or else just go by the "sound flavor" page on www.audio-gd.com
 
I see cables as two things, a necessary evil, and something to color the sound to your taste. If you are just looking for technical ability and not sound tailoring, usually the shorter the cable is, the better it is, and thus cheaper. If you live in the USA, I would recommend monoprice premium cables, blue jean cable, or sonicwave. Audio-gd's rca cable is good price/performance imo too.

Yeah you're right, i guess i will wait for the review, however, i was also thinking of a Roc-SA since it seems the regular Roc is discontinued, but my DAC19 is SE, so i'm not quite sure, though it does pump more mW into 300 ohms(hd 650s) and should sound better even in SE mode? Cheers  

Both roc and roc sa are being discontinued November, or this is the last day hehe. They may still have some in stock though or be willing to make it if you want. For almost a year I listened to a single-ended dac19mk3 and balanced amp phoenix, and it is technically better and sounds good, but also sounds somewhat lopsided, not a perfect pairing. I think roc-SA would be more forgiving than phoenix when paired with your dac19. From what I read, main difference between roc and phoenix is just some soundstage difference, and I'd believe that given my experience with different tier audio-gd amps, IME all their acss amps have the same wire with gain sound signature, making it kinda hard to compare/contrast them with each other.

 

[slim.a]

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If I'm right, the jumpers version is V5, so you have it, and I have it too.
 
slim.a, please do let us know how the C2 SA goes in your system. I'd be interested to see if more output power would bring something to the T1, apart from the other changes brought by Diamond modules.

I thought they started the jumpers since V4 put I could be mistaken.
 
 
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Also looking forward to slim.a's review of the C2-SA.   

I will defintely let you now when I finish reviewing the C2-SA.

 
Quote:

C-2 SA uses a different circuit than C-2, more important than whether or not you want an expensive rca cable, is if you like the sound of DD or ACSS. I would wait for slim.a to give a review, or else just go by the "sound flavor" page on www.audio-gd.com
 
I see cables as two things, a necessary evil, and something to color the sound to your taste. If you are just looking for technical ability and not sound tailoring, usually the shorter the cable is, the better it is, and thus cheaper. If you live in the USA, I would recommend monoprice premium cables, blue jean cable, or sonicwave. Audio-gd's rca cable is good price/performance imo too.

Regarding C2 SA vs C2, it is probably going to come down to personal preferene of ACSS vs Diamond topologies. While the C2 SA is still burning-in, I feel that regal was by saying the "Neutral" and "Musical" sound flavors descriptions weren't 100% accurate in the audio-gd website. While the ACSS (C2 in this case) is indeed neutral, the Diamond (C2 SA) is a little bit harder to describe... But it isn't musical (or colored) the same way a Moon opamp is musical (or colored).
 
As for cables, while I think that Audio-gd interconnects are good price/performance cables, I believe they are not nearly on the same remote level as the Audio-gd electronics... and that is I am going to say regarding their cables.
 
Quote:

 
Quote:

C-2 SA uses a different circuit than C-2, more important than whether or not you want an expensive rca cable, is if you like the sound of DD or ACSS. I would wait for slim.a to give a review, or else just go by the "sound flavor" page on www.audio-gd.com
 
I see cables as two things, a necessary evil, and something to color the sound to your taste. If you are just looking for technical ability and not sound tailoring, usually the shorter the cable is, the better it is, and thus cheaper. If you live in the USA, I would recommend monoprice premium cables, blue jean cable, or sonicwave. Audio-gd's rca cable is good price/performance imo too.

Yeah you're right, i guess i will wait for the review, however, i was also thinking of a Roc-SA since it seems the regular Roc is discontinued, but my DAC19 is SE, so i'm not quite sure, though it does pump more mW into 300 ohms(hd 650s) and should sound better even in SE mode? Cheers  

 
I believe that it makes sense to get the ROC SA only if you have a balanced source (and balanced cables for the headphones).
As for the C2 SA, it seems to have the newer Diamond amplifier modules that eschew NFB, DC servos or any capacitors in the signal path. They use hand matched transistors for the C2 SA (like the NFB-8) which doesn't seem to be the case with the Roc SA.
It would be interesting to have a comparison of ROC SA vs. C2 SA in SE mode: bigger power supply and voume control for the former and newer diamond modules for the latter.
 
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The Roc SA also being discontinued according to the Audio-gd web site.

 
 
It seems that Audio-gd is discontinuing many Musical Diamond series models. I wonder if they are going to replace them with something new.

 

[vrln]

You´re right, jumpers started with V4 already. I would recommend upgrading from that version as well, it was a very substantial improvement. Originally had the V4, but I quickly swapped for the V5 so I have hands on experience on this matter...
 
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If I'm right, the jumpers version is V5, so you have it, and I have it too.
 
slim.a, please do let us know how the C2 SA goes in your system. I'd be interested to see if more output power would bring something to the T1, apart from the other changes brought by Diamond modules.

I thought they started the jumpers since V4 put I could be mistaken.

 

[bacardi]

interesting, thanks for the advice guys, and what the heck, never thought there are other revisions of the dsp, how can i tell which one i have? Though mine came with jumpers, and i ordered it some time in august, how hard is it to replace anyway?

 

[FauDrei]

If it has jumpers and is dated between May and September 28th - it has to be V4.
 
Unless you have any serious motor dysfunction - it's dead easy:

• Unscrew and remove lid of your DAC.
• Unscrew 4x screws from DSP-1 in place and pull it up slowly and carefully
• Insert new DSP-1 in its place; screw back 4x screws; close the lid

 

[bacardi]

 
Quote:

If it has jumpers and is dated between May and September 28th - it has to be V4.
 
Unless you have any serious motor dysfunction - it's dead easy:

• Unscrew and remove lid of your DAC.
• Unscrew 4x screws from DSP-1 in place and pull it up slowly and carefully
• Insert new DSP-1 in its place; screw back 4x screws; close the lid

Oh wow, i didn't realize it was that simple o.o thanks for the info, i'd better get in touch with audio-gd about this, how much does the new chip cost?

 

[Pacha]

 
Quote:

If it has jumpers and is dated between May and September 28th - it has to be V4.
 
Unless you have any serious motor dysfunction - it's dead easy:

• Unscrew and remove lid of your DAC.
• Unscrew 4x screws from DSP-1 in place and pull it up slowly and carefully
• Insert new DSP-1 in its place; screw back 4x screws; close the lid

Hah! Too bad I've just ordered some goods to Audio-gd and received them. I should have added V5 to the list.
I thought jumper series were all V5. I guess I'm now on my way for a V5 then. I'm going to ask Kingwa for info and will place an order.

 

[Pacha]

BTW, does changing PLL settings bring the same results with V5 as older versions?
 
Is it possible to exchange the V4 against the V5, or send the V4 for a firmware upgrade?

 

[slim.a]

Quote:

BTW, does changing PLL settings bring the same results with V5 as older versions?
 
Is it possible to exchange the V4 against the V5, or send the V4 for a firmware upgrade?

To be honest, the stock settings are so good with the V5 (in comparison with the V3) that I haven't even bothered trying different settings. And this is coming from a "tweaky" guy...
 
I believe it is possible to send the V4 for firmware upgrade against a small fee. I was given the option of either upgrading my existing my V3 or buying a new board. Since I needed a second DSP1 (for future mods) and wanted to compare side by side V3 vs V5, I opted for the option of having a new board. I am going to send soon for my V3 board to have it upgraded to V5, that way I could have Peete's MAX mods done on it later.

 

[Pacha]

Thanks for the info.
 
I think I'll send the V4 for upgrade if it's really cheaper, otherwise I'll directly order a V5. I may play with the PLL setting as well, as I would have finished with swapping parts of my setup for a while, and that I will figure in my final setup which setting is better. Lately, I've changed quite a lot of things in my setup so it's a bit hard to focus on the effect of PLL to be better on or off as long as I've not totally stabilized everything.

 

[Black Stuart]

I just received an email from Audio-GD which will disappoint a lot of us - they will not upgrade existing DSP modules - so what you've got is it.
 
Presumably they may still sell you a completely new module = bigger profit.
 
On Tweak-fi, there is a thread on modding the DSP module - it should gain a lot of momentum with this news.

 

[Pacha]

I've just ordered a V5 board yesterday because I got the same reply. Pity I can't upgrade my V4, it'll end in the For Sale section here, if somebody wants it.