[Mimouille]

Anyone? lol
https://penonaudio.com/Oriolus-Mellianus

I've been looking at it, but 2k....

 

[Mimouille]

Love the Leo to the core.

pun intended

 

[ezekiel77]

Man, I had a heck of a time taking photos of my Lionheart yesterday and most of it was spent on repeatedly coiling and uncoiling the cable.

The best way to not only coil a cable up tidily, but also make sure it doesn't get knit up when you're uncoiling it, is to use the alternating method. You hold one end of the cable in your left hand, and a certain length of the cable in your right. You then twist your right hand forward, until the cable naturally forms a single loop, then you pass that loop onto your left hand. You then repeat this action with another length of the cable, except you twist your right hand backwards, and you repeat going forwards and backwards until you reach the other end. These alternating winding movements will create a coil that should immediately return straight when you suspend the cable freely in the air. How long each coil is is dependent on the cable; each cable should have a natural point where it's easiest for them to coil from the manufacturing process, so I'd recommend using that as a guideline; don't fight the cable's natural memory.

Please let me know if you'd like to see a video demonstrating this. I made one but apparently the file's too large to upload to Head-Fi, so I'll find other means if you're interested.

I'm thinking Blu-tack but yeah that works too

 

[Wyville]

I don't know what you guys are talking about.. Timber is just a type of wood used for building..

Timbre is the quality with which one can identify an instrument. But just because an IEM allows to identify one instrument apart from another, it doesn't necessarily mean the timbre is accurate. I think subconsciously we all know how an instrument sounds in real life, because at some point or the other, we have heard those instruments in live action.

In IEMs and DAPs though, timbre is relative. One gear would have a more accurate timbre than the other. So we keep shooting for a gear that we think has a more accurate timbre, than the one that we currently own. In terms of DAPs and portable DACs, Hugo 2 has the most accurate timbre I have come across. In terms of Hi-Fi IEMs that I have heard so far, non-ADEL Zeus-XIV comes close to accurate timbre.

Over Articulation is NOT Accurate Timbre:

One of the misconceptions in this hobby is, some listeners associate "over-articulation" to "accurate timbre". Over-articulation is basically when overtone frequencies of an instrument’s note are emphasized than necessary. While the timbre on over-articulating IEMs do help to identify one instrument from another, they are not accurate in tone. Just like how warmth from bass can create a veil and affect transparency and timbre, a bright and over-articulated treble affects accuracy of timbre in the same way.

The amplitude of the different frequencies within the note have to be recreated in the exact quantities. An over articulating IEM will enhance the overtone frequencies, which gives the impression of accurate timbre. While the timbre is indeed of very high quality, its tone is not accurate. And so the timbre is not accurate.

Thanks for the insightful post! It explains why I have recently (since my Eros II review) been gravitating towards a somewhat more neutral signature. It was with the Eros II when I noticed that while a cello sounded great with the U6, M15 and Ares II, it was with the Eros II that is sounded more natural. I think this must have been because of the tighter mid-bass and slight lift in treble that pushed the cello back a bit to sit in a more natural place in the image (rather than being dominant). What I noticed in the overal image was that the individual instruments now started to become key to determining whether a piece of music was warm and full (cello, tympani) or cooler and more airy (violins, flute). To me that sounded more realistic, as well as more dynamic. But I still have a lot more to learn, so more demoes and reviews will come.

Oh, and thanks for pointing out the Hugo 2... [grumbles] "Gonna need more puppies." "Where am I going to get all of those?!"

I haven't had a great deal of experience with high end gear yet, I did try out a few different IEMs and headphones at CanJam NYC 2017 but I tend to cancel that show out as it was all too new, too rushed, and too noisy for me to appreciate a lot of it.

However I have grown up with and always been around live music, my brothers and I and my father and so on for generations have always played guitar, and many of my friends are in bands, my older brother a sound engineer for concert venues, and so I've been to dozens and dozens of live performances. And what I've tended to notice is that many IEMs that I've tried do not deliver that same impact that those concerts and performances do (to whatever extent they may be able to replicate it in general at the moment). What I've tended to miss, from my experience, tends to be bass, and I've discovered that it's not so much a thumping mid bass as it is bass extension and a general warmth that envelops the music and creates a fully developed ambiance around the notes. It's why I was drawn to the Vega. My gripe with the Vega is that while it creates this vibrant and warm stage for the music, the vocals are sometimes too far back, so if they had been a bit more prominent I'd have been content.

It's why when I tried the W900 it sounded more balanced and detailed, but the vocals sounded extremely artificial to me, as if they were playing separately from the rest of the track and as if they were being played from a vintage cassette player, if that makes any sense. In addition the mid bass was good but there seemed to be this empty void around the instruments and notes, whereas the Vega fills that empty space with what I don't consider to be too much bass (at least not always), but extra, subtle undertones and flows that are there to connect the notes and create a more emotional reproduction of the music, and therefore has the more accurate timbre and more natural presentation to me (as well as more engaging).

Fwiw I tried Andromeda briefly, and Zeus XR at CanJam and was unimpressed, but before I get burned on a spike, I reiterate that I have discarded those demos since I tries far too briefly (literally about a minute on each) and have not auditioned them fairly.

But alas I've sold my Vega and just today received my Focal Elear, which should be a great new experience to try out

In a few months time I will get a new pair of IEMs once my funds are replenished and new offerings are available. SE5U still has my interest, as do the upcoming 64 Audio U12t and the Tia Trio. Unless they price them like the A18/Fourte... then no thank you.

It is an interesting point you make about the bass because it seems your preferences are towards a live stage performance with big speakers, rather than my own preference for live acoustic performances. I think it nicely illustrates that "realistic" or "natural" are terms that are relative to our musical preferences. I notice it too when I am listening to classical music or something like the Rolling Stones' album Blue and Lonesome. The latter really benefits from a bit more bass (like you describe it) to create the atmosphere and vibrance of a live performance at a dark, smoke filled club. My guess is that I would love the Vega for that, but would prefer the Zeus XR for classical music. Unfortunately that means that we would ideally need to gather a selection of IEMs to specifically fit our mood and type of music we listen to... [grumbles] "More puppies again." "Where are we going to leave them all?!"

So Leonidas is indeed the perfect pairing for tia Fourté. Eric was right. It's incredibly transparent, while increasing bass impact and mid-warmth, and not diminishing those free-wheeling highs.

Love the Leo to the core. I did the same when I had the 64Audio tour units. Fourte's brightness was like a wild beast. Not something that could be tamed with a cable. So, I went all in and paired it with the Leo to push the envelope. Was quite a bit bright for me.. But the stage and articulation in treble was quite something..

Ooh, those look lovely!

[Grumbles] "I mean, I like puppies, but you know..."

 

[Deezel177]

I'm thinking Blu-tack but yeah that works too

Coiling cables is much easier than you'd think. Plus, Blu-tack means spending extra time on Photoshop, and you know I don't like hard work.

 

[ezekiel77]

Coiling cables is much easier than you'd think. Plus, Blu-tack means spending extra time on Photoshop, and you know I don't like hard work.

Gotcha. I'll search for YouTube videos.

 

[Deezel177]

I haven't had a great deal of experience with high end gear yet, I did try out a few different IEMs and headphones at CanJam NYC 2017 but I tend to cancel that show out as it was all too new, too rushed, and too noisy for me to appreciate a lot of it.

However I have grown up with and always been around live music, my brothers and I and my father and so on for generations have always played guitar, and many of my friends are in bands, my older brother a sound engineer for concert venues, and so I've been to dozens and dozens of live performances. And what I've tended to notice is that many IEMs that I've tried do not deliver that same impact that those concerts and performances do (to whatever extent they may be able to replicate it in general at the moment). What I've tended to miss, from my experience, tends to be bass, and I've discovered that it's not so much a thumping mid bass as it is bass extension and a general warmth that envelops the music and creates a fully developed ambiance around the notes. It's why I was drawn to the Vega. My gripe with the Vega is that while it creates this vibrant and warm stage for the music, the vocals are sometimes too far back, so if they had been a bit more prominent I'd have been content.

It's why when I tried the W900 it sounded more balanced and detailed, but the vocals sounded extremely artificial to me, as if they were playing separately from the rest of the track and as if they were being played from a vintage cassette player, if that makes any sense. In addition the mid bass was good but there seemed to be this empty void around the instruments and notes, whereas the Vega fills that empty space with what I don't consider to be too much bass (at least not always), but extra, subtle undertones and flows that are there to connect the notes and create a more emotional reproduction of the music, and therefore has the more accurate timbre and more natural presentation to me (as well as more engaging).

Fwiw I tried Andromeda briefly, and Zeus XR at CanJam and was unimpressed, but before I get burned on a spike, I reiterate that I have discarded those demos since I tries far too briefly (literally about a minute on each) and have not auditioned them fairly.

But alas I've sold my Vega and just today received my Focal Elear, which should be a great new experience to try out

In a few months time I will get a new pair of IEMs once my funds are replenished and new offerings are available. SE5U still has my interest, as do the upcoming 64 Audio U12t and the Tia Trio. Unless they price them like the A18/Fourte... then no thank you.

The Aether might be the IEM for you, then; atmospheric and enveloping is exactly how it presents its bass. I've yet to hear the Model X, but if the stars align, that should change in the very near future.

 

[ranfan]

I haven't had a great deal of experience with high end gear yet, I did try out a few different IEMs and headphones at CanJam NYC 2017 but I tend to cancel that show out as it was all too new, too rushed, and too noisy for me to appreciate a lot of it.

However I have grown up with and always been around live music, my brothers and I and my father and so on for generations have always played guitar, and many of my friends are in bands, my older brother a sound engineer for concert venues, and so I've been to dozens and dozens of live performances. And what I've tended to notice is that many IEMs that I've tried do not deliver that same impact that those concerts and performances do (to whatever extent they may be able to replicate it in general at the moment). What I've tended to miss, from my experience, tends to be bass, and I've discovered that it's not so much a thumping mid bass as it is bass extension and a general warmth that envelops the music and creates a fully developed ambiance around the notes. It's why I was drawn to the Vega. My gripe with the Vega is that while it creates this vibrant and warm stage for the music, the vocals are sometimes too far back, so if they had been a bit more prominent I'd have been content.

It's why when I tried the W900 it sounded more balanced and detailed, but the vocals sounded extremely artificial to me, as if they were playing separately from the rest of the track and as if they were being played from a vintage cassette player, if that makes any sense. In addition the mid bass was good but there seemed to be this empty void around the instruments and notes, whereas the Vega fills that empty space with what I don't consider to be too much bass (at least not always), but extra, subtle undertones and flows that are there to connect the notes and create a more emotional reproduction of the music, and therefore has the more accurate timbre and more natural presentation to me (as well as more engaging).

Fwiw I tried Andromeda briefly, and Zeus XR at CanJam and was unimpressed, but before I get burned on a spike, I reiterate that I have discarded those demos since I tries far too briefly (literally about a minute on each) and have not auditioned them fairly.

But alas I've sold my Vega and just today received my Focal Elear, which should be a great new experience to try out

In a few months time I will get a new pair of IEMs once my funds are replenished and new offerings are available. SE5U still has my interest, as do the upcoming 64 Audio U12t and the Tia Trio. Unless they price them like the A18/Fourte... then no thank you.

Similar to Vega's tuning, I think the Dream and Galaxy also have that midrange issue. Where the instruments, and vocals feels overshadowed, or level/less-forward in positioning relative to the stage, due to their powerful bass and treble. It makes the midrange sound less satisfying if you're listening to simple acoustic music, which mainly has instruments playing in that frequency. But for electronic music they shine and do very wonderfully. That's why I wouldn't recommend them for listening to all kinds of music. For that, I'd recommend trying the Unique Melody Maestro, or Mason 2. I think it'd suit your preference due to its tuning. It has a good neutral, and balanced signature. Not too boring, due to its slight lift in mid-bass, and upper-mid frequency. The sub-bass isn't shy, as it can also rumble, and go deeply, almost as good as a DD IEM. The bass is well-controlled, and not too loud so to overlap the midrange frequency. The midrange and vocals are just right, with enough clarity and resolution. Another similar IEM, that won't break your bank I'd recommend would be the EE Spartan. Keep in mind however, that coming from someone who listen to V-shape sound frequently, what is natural, and 'right' sounding could differ from the next person. Your brain will need some time to adjust to the neutral sound for a while, not comparing it to the V-shape sound template in your mind.

 

[proedros]

i had forgotten how enjoyable/good NT6 sounds when paired with the Whiplash Hybrid V3 cable (8-braid)

getting this combo for just 1000 euros makes it even more enjoyable

gotta love those FS bargains

 

[PinkyPowers]

Gotcha. I'll search for YouTube videos.

It doesn't take much to make an Effect Audio cable lie flat. They are very supple.

 

[flinkenick]

Just a few words on the topic of timbre; I consider assessing timbre, just like resolution, separation, or transparency, a skill that needs to be developed. It's not easy. The first problem, is that nearly every top-tier iem largely sounds accurate. No matter the iem, a violin will sound like a violin, and a piano like a piano. So assessing performance is mostly done by comparison. Same for resolution; every flagship iem has good resolution, but differences become apparent from comparison. So generally speaking it's not a question of accurate vs. not accurate, but accurate vs. (slightly) more accurate. The easiest way to develop this is by using a benchmark iem for timbre, however this is also something that naturally progresses from experience.

The second issue is that an iem's performance in timbre can vary between different types of instruments or music in general. For instance, brighter tunings tend to feel more accurate for classical music, but they might sound less accurate for brass, vocals, or electric guitars. And vice versa of course. For instance, due to the 5-Way's warmer tone, it excels at vocal naturalness and brass instruments. However, the Maestro V2 sounds more accurate for acoustic guitars or violins. So it is important to keep a broad spectrum of instruments/music in mind when assessing timbre, or there will be a bias in perspective.

Next, there is a difference between tone, timbre, and naturalness. Generally speaking, warmer iems sound more natural. Iems as the 5-Way, UE18+, and Prelude, all have a warmer, natural sound, with a relatively accurate timbre. However, this is more a strong correlation, than a prerequisite: a warm iem does not necessarily have to have an accurate timbre, and a brighter iem can sound more accurate than a warm iem. Roughly speaking, we can say that timbre depends on finding the right balance between the midrange and treble, to accurately reflect an instrument. The balance between the bass and treble in turn can add more or less warmth to a tone. But theoretically, the two can be achieved separately; i.e. while keeping the timbre constant, the tone can vary in warmth.

 

[Deezel177]

Just a few words on the topic of timbre; I consider assessing timbre, just like resolution, separation, or transparency, a skill that needs to be developed. It's not easy. The first problem, is that nearly every top-tier iem largely sounds accurate. No matter the iem, a violin will sound like a violin, and a piano like a piano. So assessing performance is mostly done by comparison. Same for resolution; every flagship iem has good resolution, but differences become apparent from comparison. So generally speaking it's not a question of accurate vs. not accurate, but accurate vs. (slightly) more accurate. The easiest way to develop this is by using a benchmark iem for timbre, however this is also something that naturally progresses from experience.

The second issue is that an iem's performance in timbre can vary between different types of instruments or music in general. For instance, brighter tunings tend to feel more accurate for classical music, but they might sound less accurate for brass, vocals, or electric guitars. And vice versa of course. For instance, due to the 5-Way's warmer tone, it excels at vocal naturalness and brass instruments. However, the Maestro V2 sounds more accurate for acoustic guitars or violins. So it is important to keep a broad spectrum of instruments/music in mind when assessing timbre, or there will be a bias in perspective.

Next, there is a difference between tone, timbre, and naturalness. Generally speaking, warmer iems sound more natural. Iems as the 5-Way, UE18+, and Prelude, all have a warmer, natural sound, with a relatively accurate timbre. However, this is more a strong correlation, than a prerequisite: a warm iem does not necessarily have to have an accurate timbre, and a brighter iem can sound more accurate than a warm iem. Roughly speaking, we can say that timbre depends on finding the right balance between the midrange and treble, to accurately reflect an instrument. The balance between the bass and treble in turn can add more or less warmth to a tone. But theoretically, the two can be achieved separately; i.e. while keeping the timbre constant, the tone can vary between warm and bright.

Interesting viewpoint, Nic. I agree with the majority of your points and I honestly haven't explored the rest for myself. It really goes to show you never stop learning in this hobby.

 

[galangerz]

so I'm very new to this hobby, but if you guys could just have one iem, which one would it be? sorry if this has been answered already, only read that past maybe 50 pages of this thread and the recent posts have said a LOT about the Zues and the A18, but I'm thinking of getting the SE5U cus it's cheaper (hopefully my ears will work with their ciem :3 )

 

[NaiveSound]

so I'm very new to this hobby, but if you guys could just have one iem, which one would it be? sorry if this has been answered already, only read that past maybe 50 pages of this thread and the recent posts have said a LOT about the Zues and the A18, but I'm thinking of getting the SE5U cus it's cheaper (hopefully my ears will work with their ciem :3 )

After about 4k of spending and trading and messing around I found my endgame Zeus XR! Everything you want!

 

[Mimouille]

so I'm very new to this hobby, but if you guys could just have one iem, which one would it be? sorry if this has been answered already, only read that past maybe 50 pages of this thread and the recent posts have said a LOT about the Zues and the A18, but I'm thinking of getting the SE5U cus it's cheaper (hopefully my ears will work with their ciem :3 )

Se5u