[George Taylor]

Thanks, I'll check them out. I'm looking for something with big bass. Here is the thread:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/loo...r-evening-sessions-bass.890972/#post-14537057

Not sure if the bass would be "big" enough for what you're looking for, but have you considered the Beyerdynamic DT770? Price is nice, I've had a pair for quite a while now and they're my "toss about and go anywhere" cans.

 

[gargani]

Isn't the X2 the very one that I remember reading here on Head-Fi that did, in fact, come with a goofily high impedance cable? I swear it was an infamous thing with some Philips headphones, thought it was the X2, that had this issue with the stock cable.

It was the Philips fidelio x1, that had the problem with the stock cable. It was measured to have a higher impedance than desirable, such that it could affect the sound. No such problem with the x2.
The only reason people didn't like the x2 stock cable, was because they wanted a shorter cable and/or because the stock cable is a bit "microphonic".

 

[HiFiRebel]

Not sure if the bass would be "big" enough for what you're looking for, but have you considered the Beyerdynamic DT770? Price is nice, I've had a pair for quite a while now and they're my "toss about and go anywhere" cans.

Thank you. I'll definitely check them out

 

[HiFiRebel]

It was the Philips fidelio x1, that had the problem with the stock cable. It was measured to have a higher impedance than desirable, such that it could affect the sound. No such problem with the x2.
The only reason people didn't like the x2 stock cable, was because they wanted a shorter cable and/or because the stock cable is a bit "microphonic".

So it's all just in my head after all

 

[Slater]

So it's all just in my head after all

Eh, that’s doesn’t mean there’s not something to it. It may not be in your head after all. No one really knows but you.

There’s lots of people that swear they can hear differences in cables, regardless of what FR measurements show. And others who can’t hear any difference and swear it’s complete bollocks.

The way I see it, as long as you enjoy your gear with whatever cable sounds best (or looks best, or is least microphonic, or is your favorite color, or a good length for you), then who cares what anyone else says or thinks.

 

[Pharmaboy]

Eh, that’s doesn’t mean there’s not something to it. It may not be in your head after all. No one really knows but you.

There’s lots of people that swear they can hear differences in cables, regardless of what FR measurements show. And others who can’t hear any difference and swear it’s all bollocks.

The way I see it, as long as you enjoy your gear with whatever cable sounds best (or looks best, or is least microphonic, or is your favorite color, or a good length for you), then who cares what anyone else says or thinks.

Well said! That's a realistic way to look at all this IMO...

I'm one who sometimes (not always) hears difference between stock vs aftermarket cable; amp/DAC/headphone's sound before burn-in vs after; etc. Whenever I post comments regarding such subjective perceptions, somebody will come at me to defend the honor of empiricism (which I actually believe in), saying things like, "Did you take measurements to prove the validity of your perceptions" (or) "Blind testing is required."

Not really: each of us is a laboratory-of-1. If I perceive a difference, it's real to me. If I comment about my perception, I'm not making a global conclusion that whatever I heard would be heard by everyone else every time. I'm just reporting what I heard & perhaps speculating about reasons that it happened.

A medical analogy: the doctor prescribes a medication for something that ails me. It works or it doesn't; causes side effects or not; seems to me to be effective, ineffective, or somewhere in-between. I share your perceptions with the doctor and either stay on the med or not. But no one should conflate this with a rigorously designed, placebo-controlled, double-blinded study, statistically powered to make valid conclusions based on observed data.

Subjectivity has its place; so does objectivity. In both cases, lots of experience and practice reporting & analyzing "findings" will help focus one's conclusions & explain them better to others. But they're obviously not the same--different functions altogether.

 

[HiFiRebel]

I always thought with digital signal, the cable quality doesn't matter. With analogue signal, it does. One learns something new every day.

 

[peter123]

Eh, that’s doesn’t mean there’s not something to it. It may not be in your head after all. No one really knows but you.

There’s lots of people that swear they can hear differences in cables, regardless of what FR measurements show. And others who can’t hear any difference and swear it’s complete bollocks.

The way I see it, as long as you enjoy your gear with whatever cable sounds best (or looks best, or is least microphonic, or is your favorite color, or a good length for you), then who cares what anyone else says or thinks.

Well said! My intention was not to have a go at @ProcrastinatingRebel but rather to offer another view than other people did in this thread.

 

[Pharmaboy]

Well, I'm about to have a test of my own ears/listening acuity: just picked up a used cable I've been jonesing for, the Lush USB cable (Phasure Audio).

When it arrives, I'll swap out my el cheapo USB cable from secondary headphone system (Audio GD DAC-19 into a rotating case of SS amps, currently Lake People G109-A). Then we'll see if there's an audible difference.

I've read much praise of this particular cable for its (alleged) ability to improve sound of digital signal (pre-DAC). It would be nice if that was true...either way, I'll find out soon.

 

[HiFiRebel]

The way I always understood it is that digital cables either work or they don't, there is no signal loss. Just like HDMI cable, a £2 one is equal to £200 one. When it comes to analogue signal though, the quality does matter, because the signal can be partially lost or interfered. Is this wrong?

 

[Joong]

The way I always understood it is that digital cables either work or they don't, there is no signal loss. Just like HDMI cable, a £2 one is equal to £200 one. When it comes to analogue signal though, the quality does matter, because the signal can be partially lost or interfered. Is this wrong?

Even though digital signal seems like pulse train, it should have within certain tolerance with respect to the magnitude and to the phase (delay).
Consequently their cable quality should be quality controlled in order to preserve clear '1' and '0', and should be arrived in time without too much delayed in order to operate synchronously.
Analog cable is more complicated because they act like filters or antennas which either delays signal or pick-up external signal as noise.
Therefore they are not the same.

 

[Pharmaboy]

"wrong" isn't the word. this topic is complex--some reviewers with many years of experience w/gear claim to hear significant differences between cheapie USB cables vs more expensive, purpose-designed/built ones. I haven't verified this with my own ears (yet); on the other hand, these reviewers are very experienced & have been right about many such observations through the years.

And in the video(phile) realm, another obsession of mine, I've read occasional comments & reviews about HDMI cables, with some trusted observers seeing differences between cheap/stock HDMI cables vs aftermarket, more expensive variants.

Unless you're one of those rabidly in favor or/or opposed to such observations about digital cables in general--it boils down to your ears and what you actually hear with them. When in doubt trust the evidence of your own senses more than the opinions of others.

 

[HiFiRebel]

Thanks guys. I was curious about opinion of others on the subject.

I'm in two minds now whether to order that 3m 3.5 cable or just use the one that came with the headphones (I'm using the new one, 2m one, but it is a bit too short for my desk). Decisions decisions

 

[nraymond]

Unless you're one of those rabidly in favor or/or opposed to such observations about digital cables in general--it boils down to your ears and what you actually hear with them. When in doubt trust the evidence of your own senses more than the opinions of others.

Human senses are highly malleable and affected by a wide range of things, and the perception a person brings to any experience highly colors it. People are not objective instruments. Our brains do massive amounts of sensory processing for us, and what we see with our eyes, hear with our ears, feel with our bodies are actually constructs in our brains (it would be impossible to catch a ball thrown at high speed without a predictive model of object in motion trajectory being precalculated by neural pathways we have trained through sports practice which alters our perceptual system to react to something that our raw visual cortex information doesn't have the time to otherwise communicate to our brains and be raw processed without predictive information added and then the electrical signals sent to the muscle groups responsible for physically catching the ball, which is also why 'magicians' are able to fool people, by exploiting the same object trajectory optimizations that alter our vision to improve reaction times and instead use it to obfuscate their 'illusions' so that people don't perceive them). There's nothing wrong with this, nothing to feel bad about, just something to be aware of - just keep in mind that all human senses are a subjective version of an objective world (including hearing). Also keep in mind that there are things such as trained ears and trained eyes, and with practice, internal observation, and external verification some of the limitations can be individually documented, understood, and to a certain extent compensated for. That was the point of the Philips Golden Ears Training program a few years ago:

https://www.headfonia.com/the-golden-ears-training-program-by-philips/

and sites like SoundGym:

https://www.soundgym.co/

and Toned Ear:

https://tonedear.com/

Professionals who work in sound editing in mixing especially need to be aware of their limitations and subjectivity so that they can consistently do well at their job. The average consumer cares less about this, so most people don't pay much attention. There's also been a persistent cultural undercurrent in audiophile communities that resists objectively for a variety of reasons, which has financially benefited many companies and enabled quite a lucrative market selling products of questionable/little/no value at very large profit margins. The subjectivity is all that matters/objectivity is irrelevant works as a wonderful marketing shield as well. There are some pretty simple solutions to comparative testing out there too, like ABX testing, but not many sites perform it, as covered here:

https://hometheaterreview.com/why-do-audiophiles-fear-abx-testing/

 

[Techy1210]

Hey guys, I posted a few days ago regarding problems I was having with bass rattling in the left ear of my X2's when volume is up fairly high using low or high gain on a Fiio E17 + mobile phone.
I'm still torn between keeping them and using them to listen at lower volumes or sending them back.
I'd like to ask if anyone thinks it may be a case of the E17 pushing the drivers too hard at those higher volumes, and if a more powerful amp that doesn't need to be turned up a lot may help ease the rattling or distortion I'm getting with the E17?

Also, as a side note, I've been looking at amps like the Schiit Magni 3, could I use this without a DAC to listen to music from my phone + headphones? Or even use the E17 as a DAC attached to this setup?
And if so, are there better alternatives to the Magni around the same price range?