[Cburd]

Sorry guys...really! My sincere apologies, I was delirious from lack of sleep and some difficult wife issues and got carried away with some childish behavior. It was very much out of character for me. Moving forward, I'll be certain to remain on topic. Anyhow, thanks for the reply. I simply can't imagine (I even question the feasibility) of making a DAP perform better than the Chord Dave even though I have never actually heard the Dave. Even though the new Sony is, as they say transportable, I think Dave (in a bigger chassis) is a lofty goal. Maybe it will be up to par with AK SP1000 but with a really capable amp built in. It would explain the size I guess. Anyhow, 8 grand is not were I'm going. I am seriously considering the Hugo 2 to pair with my AK DAPs and HD800(S) cans. I am wondering if it's a good match for me. Do I need to go to another thread to do that? I suspect that I do but I'm not certain how. I'm guessing a few people would be happy to see me go but the truth is, I'm not such a bad guy, was a writer for a noted playwright a few years back (90's) and I worked almost solely on Satire (perhaps that showed a bit in my crazy pitch last night) Anyhow, I am rather new at the posting part of this which is why I ask.

 

[Sp12er3]

Has anyone had the opportunity to "audition" this price and size beast I was going to say "try" but for $8 grand and for the actual first time ever, audition seemed like the right choice of words). Just wondering how great this thing might be but just as (perhaps) most of us do, I can't convince my logical (OK cynical) side to imagine that what we have here is more smoke and mirrors than anything else. I've been around and ya gotta wonder what they can actually do to make this "portable" DAP sound like 8 grand. I sure as hell do but my guess is that it does not sound better than my Astell & Kern Kann coupled with iFi iDSD Micro Black and my HD800(S) cans OR to be more fair (you know, apples to apples), my money is with this Sony "Black Mamba" (my words) perhaps sounding marginally better than just my Kann and my HD800(s)'s in balanced leaving out the additional HP amp. I may never know the actual answers but based on past experience, I bet I'm closer to right than wrong. If I am in fact completely wrong, "cburd" you say, "you're an idiot, you missed it by a mile", you're such a cynical a-hole, this thing is the friggin bees knees!.....then can someone please tell me, who carries it, what's the lead time and current price? I'm in! Anyhow, now to some rather insignificant things you are (were) likely unaware of: Firstly, NOW we all know what LeBron James (now Laker's superstar) is packing when you see him wearing his, (what we all thought were just media avoidance headphones) NOPE, they're customized, staggeringly shiny, one of a kind, gold, supercharged Focal Utopias (NOT plated, yea yea, they're heavy), with rare polished Euro Space Black (just the outer shells, because, as we already covered, most everything else is .99993 gold even though silver would have been better! FTR: Sennheiser refused to customize the Orpheus..... but if you just so happen to come across Lebron, please don't tell him all of this and burst his bubble, it may screw with his head and his shrink is $40,000 an hour. Oh.... BTW, going back a sentence or two, Apple missed the mark. Space is NOT gray, unless you are within 6 billion light years from a star, dammit, it's pitch BLACK.... OK, I digress......where was I?..... Oh yes.....cost for arguably the world's coolest headphones, $159,000 U.S., world class sound for sure but most importantly, to compliment and even boost the shiny $8,000 Sony Black Mamba DAP he's sporting which, by the way, now sounds like is a hell of a deal compared to those sweet sounding, supercharged, custom cans! BUT......We all know that a nice set of cans always cost a little more than the transport source anyhow so Lebron's doing just fine, right there with us, the "status quo", right? To Lebron's credit, he has no idea. His "guy" told him this is the very best audio presentation money can buy and let's face it, he IS coming straight from Cleveland and is "open game".....and also just so you (the reader of this rubbish) can understand this nonsense and..... well..... just for a basic reference point, Lebron thinks we all pay $750 U.S. for a gallon of milk and that gas (91 octane but Lebron thinks its 201RF) is $32 a gallon (based on the current $812 per barrel crude price). His $75 million Ferrari pings on low octane gas and he learned that 201 Rocket Fuel solves this...not only that, it makes his car, not only go faster (1,200 MPH, Mach 2, tested on Bonneville Salt Flats, UT, USA) but it makes it sound and smell better too!...Lebron must be soooooo grateful to be here in L.A. and have such access to all of this life enhancing expert help and advice because in Cleveland, his "guy" told him........drum roll please....................... "Get some Beats and an iPhone, sound doesn't get better"!..... The end (almost)....... Anyhow, I'm kind of a neophyte at these "message board sites". Been around for a long while but never really knew (or know) what to say.... Hmm.....While pondering my closing sentence......It occurred to me, how abundantly clear it must be that I still don't.....Anyhow folks, in closing..... I hope this gets a laugh and that I don't get too flamed and kicked off this thread. Oh, and I actually am legitimately curious about the Black Mamba's performance (now I can't even remember the actual name of the device) if anyone knows (not the name, its performance) and is so inclined to share (with me). I think that's why I stopped by in the first place.....Thanks and Cheers!

When "reader only" wants to keep his comment counts low....


Or just a smurf Troll account..

 

[Uncle Monty]

I was very interested in the DMP Z1 but recently tried out a Chord TT2 and was so smitten I bought it. Almost immediately I upgraded with the M-Scaler to experience a level of hifi I never thought possible on my budget. Had the DMP Z1 been available sooner I might have gone with it without ever auditioning the Chord gear - such are the vagaries of life. I would love to hear the DMP Z1 at some point but, having spent all my money on the TT2 + MS, I can't imagine I'll buy it. Assuming the Sony is considered more of a desktop rig, I can see the advantages in having fewer cables etc - in fact no cables really if you simply charge it occasionally. With my DAP plugged in to my MS connected to my TT2 with all the power cables etc its getting like spaghetti round here. That said, to beat the Chord combo IMO the Sony will have to excel - I wonder what Sony are using as a benchmark? I am sure it will sound amazing and I await the first comparison tests. Perhaps one day I'll go full Sony.

 

[tumpux]

No need to apologize, most of us just skip anything longer than a couple of lines.
Also, it's funny that you think Mr James has to pay for his setup..

 

[Zhanming057]

I was very interested in the DMP Z1 but recently tried out a Chord TT2 and was so smitten I bought it. Almost immediately I upgraded with the M-Scaler to experience a level of hifi I never thought possible on my budget. Had the DMP Z1 been available sooner I might have gone with it without ever auditioning the Chord gear - such are the vagaries of life. I would love to hear the DMP Z1 at some point but, having spent all my money on the TT2 + MS, I can't imagine I'll buy it. Assuming the Sony is considered more of a desktop rig, I can see the advantages in having fewer cables etc - in fact no cables really if you simply charge it occasionally. With my DAP plugged in to my MS connected to my TT2 with all the power cables etc its getting like spaghetti round here. That said, to beat the Chord combo IMO the Sony will have to excel - I wonder what Sony are using as a benchmark? I am sure it will sound amazing and I await the first comparison tests. Perhaps one day I'll go full Sony.

IMO the Chord Hugo 2 with a good portable headphone amp (e.g. Mass Kobo 404, Woo WA8) is substantially superior to the DMP-Z1. The DMP-Z1 is only a tiny bit better than the SP1000 running line out to a Xi Audio Broadway S.

At $3,500 it would be a very competitive offering but at $8,000 the Z1 simply cannot compare to portable stacks in its price range.

 

[Whitigir]

IMO the Chord Hugo 2 with a good portable headphone amp (e.g. Mass Kobo 404, Woo WA8) is substantially superior to the DMP-Z1. The DMP-Z1 is only a tiny bit better than the SP1000 running line out to a Xi Audio Broadway S.

At $3,500 it would be a very competitive offering but at $8,000 the Z1 simply cannot compare to portable stacks in its price range.

And you did extensively compare between sp1000 and DMP-Z1 ?

 

[Kakki]

I tried DMP-Z1 twice at Sony Ginza in Tokyo. 1st time with MDR-Z1R and 2nd time with my own ER-4S.
I would say that Z1 has very soft and warm sound signature like a good tube amp. I actually like the sound very much. No fatigue and very relaxing.
But from the sound quality stand point, it lacks micro details and all the music would be played with the same sound signature, like adding cream to all the dishes you eat.
I also found that it could hardly drive my ER-4S with high-gain mode. You will need to use balanced output to drive difficult headphones.
Other drawbacks are lack of 6.5mm phone jack and tiny LCD for operation.
No wonder that less than 10 Z1 is sold at Sony Ginza...

 

[Whitigir]

I tried DMP-Z1 twice at Sony Ginza in Tokyo. 1st time with MDR-Z1R and 2nd time with my own ER-4S.
I would say that Z1 has very soft and warm sound signature like a good tube amp. I actually like the sound very much. No fatigue and very relaxing.
But from the sound quality stand point, it lacks micro details and all the music would be played with the same sound signature, like adding cream to all the dishes you eat.
I also found that it could hardly drive my ER-4S with high-gain mode. You will need to use balanced output to drive difficult headphones.
Other drawbacks are lack of 6.5mm phone jack and tiny LCD for operation.
No wonder that less than 10 Z1 is sold at Sony Ginza...

It also is too expensive for what it can do. But if the sound is colored up too much, then it isn’t good. Thanks for the impressions

 

[Kakki]

Agreed. In the end, Z1 is a huge size Walkman which got a bit better sound but completely lost its portability.
Because of the size and weight, it has to compete with other high-end desktop DAC/headphone amps but is not capable to do what competitors can do. Less power, less connectivity, less usability...
Very niche product for rich but inexperienced users. Outcome of miss-marketing and that is why it sells only few...

 

[nanaholic]

Agreed. In the end, Z1 is a huge size Walkman which got a bit better sound but completely lost its portability.
Because of the size and weight, it has to compete with other high-end desktop DAC/headphone amps but is not capable to do what competitors can do. Less power, less connectivity, less usability...
Very niche product for rich but inexperienced users. Outcome of miss-marketing and that is why it sells only few...

Actually I would say it is you who had misread how the market works.
2 reason why DMP-Z1 sells "so few" at Sony Store:
a) 10 units @ 923,000yen including tax is really not "few", no matter how you cut it. Truth is not many people in Japan can fork over nearly 1M straight.
b) there is almost no discount at Sony Store (unless you own a Sony Credit Card, which will give you a measly 3% discount), compared with other electronic stores which will either give you a straight discounted price (eg e-earphones selling at 850k) or 10% store points of the retail price (which is as good as 10% cash back) such as Yodobashi Camera means you save nearly 100k, so there is no incentive to buy at the Sony Store.

Sony's Official Store will never price compete with other outlets - as Sony has to give other outlets a chance to make money else no one else will stock Sony products again. So going by how many were sold at Sony's Ginza Store is not a good gauge of the market. And even then 10 units at the official store for a 1M product is a good number, that's 10M there already for a product that only launched for a week.

 

[Kakki]

Oh dear, Sony Ginza is selling Z1 at 855k when you say e-earphone is selling it at 850k.
If I were to buy it, I would definitely buy it at Sony Ginza as I could try it as much as I wanted and they also offer longer warranty service.
Also I remember that Chord Dave sold like hot cakes when it was priced at 1500k... people, including myself had to wait many months to get Dave. On the other hand, Z1? You have stock every where.
The man in Sony store was pretty sad to tell me that it sold much less than 10 units even though so many people tried it.
I have no wonder why as Z1 offers very small attractiveness when it is priced so high.

 

[Whitigir]

Oh dear, Sony Ginza is selling Z1 at 85.5k when you say e-earphone is selling it at 85k.
If I were to buy it, I would definitely buy it at Sony Ginza as I could try it as much as I wanted and they also offer longer warranty service.
Also I remember that Chord Dave sold like hot cakes when it was priced at 150k... people, including myself had to wait many months to get Dave. On the other hand, Z1? You have stock every where.
The man in Sony store was pretty sad to tell me that it sold much less than 10 units even though so many people tried it.
I have no wonder why as Z1 offers very small attractiveness when it is priced so high.

I think if Z1 were to sport dual S-Master HX (the first of it kind), then it would be selling just as hot cake ?

 

[Kakki]

I think if Z1 were to sport dual S-Master HX (the first of it kind), then it would be selling just as hot cake ?

I don’t think so. I think very few people would want a non-portable Walkman with just a bit better sound. If it was as portable as other HiFi Walkman, it might sold much more. Just my opinion though.

 

[mrtim6]

Has anyone on headfi actually purchased one? Would love to hear their thoughts.

 

[nanaholic]

Oh dear, Sony Ginza is selling Z1 at 855k when you say e-earphone is selling it at 850k.
If I were to buy it, I would definitely buy it at Sony Ginza as I could try it as much as I wanted and they also offer longer warranty service.
Also I remember that Chord Dave sold like hot cakes when it was priced at 1500k... people, including myself had to wait many months to get Dave. On the other hand, Z1? You have stock every where.
The man in Sony store was pretty sad to tell me that it sold much less than 10 units even though so many people tried it.
I have no wonder why as Z1 offers very small attractiveness when it is priced so high.

The price at Sony Ginza is EX TAX, with tax it goes to 930k. Price at e-earphone is 830k INC TAX. Please do your research, the fact is the price difference is almost 100k if you don't buy from Sony Store. It's actually surprising that 10 people is willing to pay the MOST expensive price to buy this unit, those are the surely the diehard fans that has more money and don't bother with price gauging.

Also there is a review on Kakaku which says his unit is serial number in the 40s, and I personally know a person with a unit with serial in 480s. Even discounting a few stub numbers (usually the first 10 or so units are not really for sale), it's safe to say Sony shipped around 400 units @ 800-900k. So I'd say they have a good successful product on their hands again.

Waiting time for a product means nothing if you don't know the production capacity of the product. For all we know they may be making 1 unit per week which makes it so you have to wait months, doesn't mean they sold a lot. That's just common sense.