New Beyerdynamic T1 (2nd Generation)
Dec 18, 2016 at 6:08 PM Post #1,966 of 3,925
How detailed are the T1 v2 when compared to HD800?


Tough question.. The HD-800 responds so differently depending on how it's amped, and from the source quality that you may well get a wide variety of answers depending on what the listener evaluated them on...

For me, they were neck and neck in terms of preferences, but handled delivery differently. To me, the T1 ver.2 delivered more "punch" in the mids and a better-defined mid-bass. The HD-800s put up a bit more "sparkle" in the highs, offered more recessed mids, and "tighter" bass. Now modify that by saying the T1 ver.2 were more impactful, but the the HD-800s were more "immersive". If all I were listening to were hugely-dynamic musical arrangements that lent themselves to hugely-wide sound-stages, then nothing I've heard touches the HD-800s. So much "air", but not muddled or loose. Just huge and highly-dynamic from softest intro to the most impressive crescendo. The T1 ver.2 were detailed and "appropriately wide" in terms of soundstage, but never felt like they were wide just for the heck of it. If the piece was meant to be experienced wide, they did a nice job. The HD-800s sounded wide whether appropriate or not. So for critical listening of multiple genres, I'd favor the T1 ver.2 as better "all-rounders". If you want critical listening specifically of large orchestral or choral arrangements, then I've never heard headphones that beat the HD-800.

The HiFi-Man HE-400i is no slouch either. It makes much of what the T1 ver.2 shines with sound just as good, and has a massive sub-bass hit and punchier lows all-round. Personally, I'd pick either the T1 ver.2 or HE-400i, and compliment whichever one I picked with the HD-800 if I was heavy into classical or baroque music through a high-end/synergistically matched headphone amplifier. It's just so much pickier than the other two about how it's amped... The T1 can sound very good straight from my iPad Air or just about any MP3 player. HE-400i is not quite as easy to make sound great, but nowhere near as difficult as the HD-800!
 
Dec 31, 2016 at 9:29 AM Post #1,971 of 3,925
Just got my T1.2 yesterday.  I've been comparing them against the Focal Elear.  They are definitely very different sounding headphones.  The Elears are more broken in at this point; the T1.2 only have about 15 hours on them, so they still have a way to go.
 
I'm powering the T1.2 from a Dragonfly Red, which surprisingly has more than enough power.  I'm sure the T1.2 would scale really well with better electronics, but I am amazed at how great the value is with the Dragonfly Red.  I plan on using this for a while until I can save up for a decent desktop amp/dac combo.
 
Compared to the Elear, the T1.2 have much more detail, but the Elears are a bit less fatiguing.  The type of music listened to greatly affects that.  Bright recordings can sound brutal through the T1.2.  The the midrange of the T1.2 IMO is better than the Elear.  There's something about it that sucks me in more than the Elear.  
 
I'm still waiting for burn in to complete before I make any kind of full evaluation, especially when it comes to bass.
 
Dec 31, 2016 at 12:54 PM Post #1,973 of 3,925
Afternoon,
 
I just picked up a pair of T90's this week and have been burning them in but the treble on these are really harsh without EQ.  I mainly use them for gaming and rock/metal/grunge/techno music and I find some songs almost impossible to listen to without EQ.  When I watch movies, I sometimes have to lower the volume because of the high's.  Which generation T1 has "calmer" high's?  I really, really like the sound of the T90's and having a huge soundstage is important to me.  I've read conflicting information as to which generation T1's are harsher.  
 
I am pairing with an X7 amp and a G5 for virtual surround (I know not optimal).  For movies and games I sometimes pair up to my Onkyo receiverf.
 
Appreciate the help!
 
Dec 31, 2016 at 3:06 PM Post #1,974 of 3,925
@jsplice
  Just got my T1.2 yesterday.  I've been comparing them against the Focal Elear.  They are definitely very different sounding headphones.  The Elears are more broken in at this point; the T1.2 only have about 15 hours on them, so they still have a way to go.
 
I'm powering the T1.2 from a Dragonfly Red, which surprisingly has more than enough power.  I'm sure the T1.2 would scale really well with better electronics, but I am amazed at how great the value is with the Dragonfly Red.  I plan on using this for a while until I can save up for a decent desktop amp/dac combo.
 
Compared to the Elear, the T1.2 have much more detail, but the Elears are a bit less fatiguing.  The type of music listened to greatly affects that.  Bright recordings can sound brutal through the T1.2.  The the midrange of the T1.2 IMO is better than the Elear.  There's something about it that sucks me in more than the Elear.  
 
I'm still waiting for burn in to complete before I make any kind of full evaluation, especially when it comes to bass.

 
looking forward to the fully run in T1v2 vs Elear impressions.
 
Dec 31, 2016 at 3:45 PM Post #1,975 of 3,925
I got a set of the T1's 2nd gen for Christmas and have been a T90 owner for over a year.
 
I have several amps and dacs and always wondered what the differences between these two really were.
 
The only way to tell is to have them side by side and quickly be able to swap them out in a few seconds with the same material
being played.
 
They are very different.
 
Here is a take on what they are like to me....I wrote this in another blog a week back:
 
First Impressions are lasting ones.....

The Beyer T1's exude a very well made device...they come packaged in a small retail package inside of the newer, smaller black carrying case. Its much more portable than the large T1 1 gen case.

The Cable is detachable of course, and its a really nice long flexible cable made out of some rather expensive copper etc....I am not a metallurgist!!

They plug into the headphones with a gentle push, I worry over time if these connections would become worn or loose, but I dont intend to be swapping out cables in the future....so they probably will be ok fine. I thing I read that Beyer did this in case you trip on the cable and it easily would disconnect to prevent any real damage to the headphones.

I only have an hour or so of listening on them. So the usual let them play for 10-100 hours etc does not apply here (yet).

I am using a really wonderful headphone amp that I built, its an ODA desktop version of the O2, with a lot more current/voltage capability. My good friend at agdr audio designed this amp and its been one of the best that I have had, its transparent, does'nt add to or take away from the signal. It allows me to have (2) sets of headphones in use at the same time to do quick comparisons. It also allows dual selectable dacs as well!

I also have a Bottlehead Crack with Speedball, O2 amps stock and two with "upgrade" mods, like the O2 Booster board and with  OPA1688 op amps.

So I have been going back and forth between the T90s vs the T1's and across a few amps.
The T90s have over a hundred hours on them and they are well worn in "friends".

Having done this so many times, its fairly easy to tell the differences between devices rather quickly...
  
Both are stellar headphones IMO, but they are indeed sounding different, soundstage and presentation are really different.
The weight of the bass or its "fullness or body is different". 
The clarity is different....

The T90s at 250 ohms vs the 600 ohm T1's require less power to drive them to a realistic " without blowing your eardrums out".

Most of what I have read is true to me when people compare the T90 vs the T1.

That said, let me talk just to the T1 first, and at the end I will tell you my opinions about the two and was it worth it to me......

The T1 soundstage is stellar. Wide, easy articulation of instruments and placement, but it depends on the quality if the recording for sure. A well done pieces is presented well. These cans do not like mediocre stuff for sure. Easiliy besting many other cans I have had in the past.

The tonality of a piano is difficult to reproduce, listening to George Winstons, December and the "Holly and Ivy" will make a grown man cry, its that good. The notes on the piano are crisp, clear, and sound so much like a real piano...just 'gorgeous". The Ivory keys sound "Ivory-Like".

In comparing to the T90s (and I said I would wait to the end!) the sound here has more weight or heft or fullness or sounds "right" I dont know how else to describe it. The T90s do sound believe it or not "clearer" and "clinical" this is with most recordings so far...going back and forth they are so much alike  and so much different IMO.

The soundstage and presentation is wider with the T1's IMO "a lot"...so when paired with a well recorded piece its really wonderful..

The bass....Brian Brombergs "Wood" and Freedom Jazz Dance is spectacular....the T90s do this cut very well, clear, tonality etc..but the T1's seem to be more warm and musical and just right...this isnt subjective to me , there is a difference in the way the bass is articulated and presented. Which on to you is the better is definetly a personal taste thing.
The bass is fuller and has more body or heft than the T90's.

A BIG thing is I dont seem to have to crank up the volume to "make" the cans sound "good"...I can listen at lower levels and not think I am loosing something or content.....They hold that nice presentation at low levels very well. With the T90's I find myself cranking up the volume to achieve a better presentation.

I find that listening to the T1's on the Bottlecrack makes them even more warm and less clear...wanting to listen musically and technically at the same time (my akin to having your cake and .....) The T'1's to me dont need any more warmness added, they are warmer that the T90s which IMO are brutally crisp and clear (you may not like that).....the T1's are abit less clear like they have been toned down to give them a more musical presentation. You may or may not like that.

It may not be fair to say they are less clear, the overall sound is one of the best to me, its they did something to make these I think more listenable to more people? The clarity is there, but the toning down of stuff is evident...in a good way to me.

With the T90s' I am always listening to whats there in a song, instead of just enjoying the music. With the T1's I am finding myself more lost in the music and just enjoying the sound....and thats a good thing!

So was it worth it with only an hour or so of listening...YES.
Would I sell my T90's absolutely NO.

I think I have found my end all headphone.....or at least until the next time!!

Hope some of this makes sense!

Merry Christmas!
 
Dec 31, 2016 at 5:39 PM Post #1,976 of 3,925
  I got a set of the T1's 2nd gen for Christmas and have been a T90 owner for over a year.
 
I have several amps and dacs and always wondered what the differences between these two really were.
 
The only way to tell is to have them side by side and quickly be able to swap them out in a few seconds with the same material
being played.
 
They are very different.
 
Here is a take on what they are like to me....I wrote this in another blog a week back:
 
First Impressions are lasting ones.....

The Beyer T1's exude a very well made device...they come packaged in a small retail package inside of the newer, smaller black carrying case. Its much more portable than the large T1 1 gen case.

The Cable is detachable of course, and its a really nice long flexible cable made out of some rather expensive copper etc....I am not a metallurgist!!

They plug into the headphones with a gentle push, I worry over time if these connections would become worn or loose, but I dont intend to be swapping out cables in the future....so they probably will be ok fine. I thing I read that Beyer did this in case you trip on the cable and it easily would disconnect to prevent any real damage to the headphones.

I only have an hour or so of listening on them. So the usual let them play for 10-100 hours etc does not apply here (yet).

I am using a really wonderful headphone amp that I built, its an ODA desktop version of the O2, with a lot more current/voltage capability. My good friend at agdr audio designed this amp and its been one of the best that I have had, its transparent, does'nt add to or take away from the signal. It allows me to have (2) sets of headphones in use at the same time to do quick comparisons. It also allows dual selectable dacs as well!

I also have a Bottlehead Crack with Speedball, O2 amps stock and two with "upgrade" mods, like the O2 Booster board and with  OPA1688 op amps.

So I have been going back and forth between the T90s vs the T1's and across a few amps.
The T90s have over a hundred hours on them and they are well worn in "friends".

Having done this so many times, its fairly easy to tell the differences between devices rather quickly...
  
Both are stellar headphones IMO, but they are indeed sounding different, soundstage and presentation are really different.
The weight of the bass or its "fullness or body is different". 
The clarity is different....

The T90s at 250 ohms vs the 600 ohm T1's require less power to drive them to a realistic " without blowing your eardrums out".

Most of what I have read is true to me when people compare the T90 vs the T1.

That said, let me talk just to the T1 first, and at the end I will tell you my opinions about the two and was it worth it to me......

The T1 soundstage is stellar. Wide, easy articulation of instruments and placement, but it depends on the quality if the recording for sure. A well done pieces is presented well. These cans do not like mediocre stuff for sure. Easiliy besting many other cans I have had in the past.

The tonality of a piano is difficult to reproduce, listening to George Winstons, December and the "Holly and Ivy" will make a grown man cry, its that good. The notes on the piano are crisp, clear, and sound so much like a real piano...just 'gorgeous". The Ivory keys sound "Ivory-Like".

In comparing to the T90s (and I said I would wait to the end!) the sound here has more weight or heft or fullness or sounds "right" I dont know how else to describe it. The T90s do sound believe it or not "clearer" and "clinical" this is with most recordings so far...going back and forth they are so much alike  and so much different IMO.

The soundstage and presentation is wider with the T1's IMO "a lot"...so when paired with a well recorded piece its really wonderful..

The bass....Brian Brombergs "Wood" and Freedom Jazz Dance is spectacular....the T90s do this cut very well, clear, tonality etc..but the T1's seem to be more warm and musical and just right...this isnt subjective to me , there is a difference in the way the bass is articulated and presented. Which on to you is the better is definetly a personal taste thing.
The bass is fuller and has more body or heft than the T90's.

A BIG thing is I dont seem to have to crank up the volume to "make" the cans sound "good"...I can listen at lower levels and not think I am loosing something or content.....They hold that nice presentation at low levels very well. With the T90's I find myself cranking up the volume to achieve a better presentation.

I find that listening to the T1's on the Bottlecrack makes them even more warm and less clear...wanting to listen musically and technically at the same time (my akin to having your cake and .....) The T'1's to me dont need any more warmness added, they are warmer that the T90s which IMO are brutally crisp and clear (you may not like that).....the T1's are abit less clear like they have been toned down to give them a more musical presentation. You may or may not like that.

It may not be fair to say they are less clear, the overall sound is one of the best to me, its they did something to make these I think more listenable to more people? The clarity is there, but the toning down of stuff is evident...in a good way to me.

With the T90s' I am always listening to whats there in a song, instead of just enjoying the music. With the T1's I am finding myself more lost in the music and just enjoying the sound....and thats a good thing!

So was it worth it with only an hour or so of listening...YES.
Would I sell my T90's absolutely NO.

I think I have found my end all headphone.....or at least until the next time!!

Hope some of this makes sense!

Merry Christmas!

Awesome post, you inspired me to pull the trigger from Amazon.  I will have the cans on the 4th and post my impressions as well after I get some time with them.  I have no need for 2 open-backed headphones so one will stay and one will go. :)  
 
Jan 1, 2017 at 2:11 PM Post #1,977 of 3,925
  I have only heard the elear a couple of times but am more than happy with my T1 .2. It sounds so much more intimate and less tiring

So you think the Elears are more fatiguing than the T1.2? That's interesting.  What is it about the Elear that tires your ears?
 
For me and the T1.2, it's the hot treble that wears me out, especially on poorly mastered albums that have pumped up treble.  It renders them practically unlistenable.  
 
Jan 1, 2017 at 2:40 PM Post #1,979 of 3,925
I have only heard the elear a couple of times but am more than happy with my T1 .2. It sounds so much more intimate and less tiring
I can agree with this too. The Elear is more engaging and fun but by the 2-3 hour mark I am fatigued. The T1.2 does not do this to me. I think it's the incredible dynamics of the Elear pounding me into submission.
 
Jan 1, 2017 at 3:10 PM Post #1,980 of 3,925
Has anyone here heard the t1 2nd gen and the hd800s? I've owned the t1 2nd gen for a few months and am very happy with the sound but hearing about the superior sound-stage and clarity in the hd800s makes it tempting to try out. I have until jan 29th to return my t1's to amazon so I could try out the hd800s and maybe return those too if I don't like them. My amp is a beyerdynamic a20 that pairs really well with the t1.2 but I don't know how they would do with the hd800s.
 
Anyone who has heard both cans and can describe any advantages/disadvantages of the HD800S over the t1.2 would be appreciated!
 

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