[tumpux]

At this stage, with all those upgrade options, I wont bother upgrading the original R2R-7. With the firmware upgrade it’s already really good. Just use it for another 3 years and upgrade to the latest model at that time.
Stop visiting head-fi and use the extra time to listen to music.

 

[Genna]

After starting with a NFB-1AMP, NFB-1.38 DAC and A1 amplifier, upgraded this summer to Master-1 and Master-3, end of this month I want to upgrade the NFB-1.38 to a R7 or R7HE. Till now I ordered all (except DAC used from the bay) from Kingwa directly (I live in Germany) but had bad experiences with the last order with UPS and thinking to order from MagnaHifi with the silver mod. Anyone have the mod or thoughts? I‘m unsure about the mod and if without mod I prefer to order the DAC again from Kingwa directly. Thanks in advance!

 

[Chopin75]

@darren700 Magna Hifi seems to only support reworking AGD products they sell. The situation may have changed but they were overwhelmed with requests 6 months ago.

And be very careful finding a solid technician locally. One user on this forum shared a horror story about a local technician in way over his head. The reworked DAC blew up and had to eventually send his unit to Kingwa for repair.

The hardware mods are highly recommended though especially if you use the very latest firmware. The mods transformed my DACs into much better sounding and performing machines.

I believe Magna does accept other DACs not from them, can email them to confirm. I have the V2 board modified by Magna, I think just some wiring changes, I suspect the improvement is huge for DSD with the TDA fw, but since I have changed also my F-1 AS well as magna model of internal wiring that initially worsened the PCM sound, I cannot judge the benefits with PCM. Now with more burning in, the PCM is recovering slowly. The main issue is that future FW will likely be more compatible with V2 for e.g. the TDA causes noise with V1 old board and there is no way around it.

 

[Chopin75]

After starting with a NFB-1AMP, NFB-1.38 DAC and A1 amplifier, upgraded this summer to Master-1 and Master-3, end of this month I want to upgrade the NFB-1.38 to a R7 or R7HE. Till now I ordered all (except DAC used from the bay) from Kingwa directly (I live in Germany) but had bad experiences with the last order with UPS and thinking to order from MagnaHifi with the silver mod. Anyone have the mod or thoughts? I‘m unsure about the mod and if without mod I prefer to order the DAC again from Kingwa directly. Thanks in advance!

I have done the complete mod from magna, transforming my r2r7 to R7 except that I still don't have external blaster input or ext clock input. Unfortunately I don't have an R2R7 to compare and that the burning in takes so long that I no longer remember clearly what it was like before. Also I have upgraded my int clock and F-1. I suspect the biggest difference is V2 board as the immediate improvement was on DSD even before burning in. The PCM R2R circuit would take months to burn in. Though the improvement could have been from synergy effect of TDA with V2 as well. I am not sure how much silver rewiring is making a difference. If you are getting a brand new R7 then u have new clock and V2. Adding the magna upgrades should not.cost a lot more. Alternatively u can do in stages, eg do the V2 board upgrade first and then do the rest later since Germany is not.too.far from Netherland

 

[darren700]

I believe Magna does accept other DACs not from them, can email them to confirm. I have the V2 board modified by Magna, I think just some wiring changes, I suspect the improvement is huge for DSD with the TDA fw, but since I have changed also my F-1 AS well as magna model of internal wiring that initially worsened the PCM sound, I cannot judge the benefits with PCM. Now with more burning in, the PCM is recovering slowly. The main issue is that future FW will likely be more compatible with V2 for e.g. the TDA causes noise with V1 old board and there is no way around it.

I guess my only option is shipping to Audio-GD, or just hold off for a couple more years then buy the latest R2R DAC from Audio-GD as tumpux suggested.
I did not realize that the new TDA firmware causes noise on the older V1 board. Does the noise only occur when the "TDA mode" is engaged? or at all times? i guess I might have to stay away from that firmware. I am running V3 smooth on both my R2R-7 and R1 currently and I love the sound, hard to imagine it can sound better! but Im sure the DI-20 should bump things up a notch.

my source setup is starting to become very complex... The DI-20 will be fed by a Uptone ISO Regen connected to a SOTM SMS-200 Ultra Neo streamer. The SMS-200 is streamed music from Jriver via Ethernet from my HTPC. Another product that I am waiting for is the Uptone Audio Ether Regen Switch. This will go between my SMS-200 Ultra Neo and the PC running Jriver. Apparently that should be another large jump in SQ due to filtering and isolation that the Ether Regen preforms on the network signal. initial impressions seem very promising for this product.

 

[Chopin75]

I guess my only option is shipping to Audio-GD, or just hold off for a couple more years then buy the latest R2R DAC from Audio-GD as tumpux suggested.
I did not realize that the new TDA firmware causes noise on the older V1 board. Does the noise only occur when the "TDA mode" is engaged? or at all times? i guess I might have to stay away from that firmware. I am running V3 smooth on both my R2R-7 and R1 currently and I love the sound, hard to imagine it can sound better! but Im sure the DI-20 should bump things up a notch.

my source setup is starting to become very complex... The DI-20 will be fed by a Uptone ISO Regen connected to a SOTM SMS-200 Ultra Neo streamer. The SMS-200 is streamed music from Jriver via Ethernet from my HTPC. Another product that I am waiting for is the Uptone Audio Ether Regen Switch. This will go between my SMS-200 Ultra Neo and the PC running Jriver. Apparently that should be another large jump in SQ due to filtering and isolation that the Ether Regen preforms on the network signal. initial impressions seem very promising for this product.

So here is the thing, your system may be (definitely from mine) very different to other people's setup. It would be hard to know how a change of R7 would affect your system. For e.g I have no galvanic isolation and no ethernet use (except for controlling the software playback) and my PC runs on Euphony OS. Since I don't have galvanic isolation I have used filter AC cables to reduce as much noise as I can getting into the PC. Actually I use 2 isolation transformers and have chosen a receptacle that seems least noisy (using PS audio Harvester to figure that out) and things have improved a lot by reducing as much AC noise as possible.
The TDA can only work with PCM using old V1 board. To me that has improved things a lot compared with V3 FW. But it won't do DSD using V1 board. V2 board will work with TDA FW nicely, it is designed for TFA FW to get rid of all DSD noise (well let't say it filters out 98% of DSD noise, any remaining noise you would need to raise the volume to extremely loud level to hear it at beginning of a track). I am not sure what you mean by TDA mode engaged. Is your clock still old TOCO ? Maybe DIY your own clock and If you are skilled enough also the V2 board the improvement should be significant. I am not sure if V2 work without the new faceplate. I guess it should.

 

[PLGA]

I guess my only option is shipping to Audio-GD, or just hold off for a couple more years then buy the latest R2R DAC from Audio-GD as tumpux suggested.
I did not realize that the new TDA firmware causes noise on the older V1 board. Does the noise only occur when the "TDA mode" is engaged? or at all times? i guess I might have to stay away from that firmware. I am running V3 smooth on both my R2R-7 and R1 currently and I love the sound, hard to imagine it can sound better! but Im sure the DI-20 should bump things up a notch.

my source setup is starting to become very complex... The DI-20 will be fed by a Uptone ISO Regen connected to a SOTM SMS-200 Ultra Neo streamer. The SMS-200 is streamed music from Jriver via Ethernet from my HTPC. Another product that I am waiting for is the Uptone Audio Ether Regen Switch. This will go between my SMS-200 Ultra Neo and the PC running Jriver. Apparently that should be another large jump in SQ due to filtering and isolation that the Ether Regen preforms on the network signal. initial impressions seem very promising for this product.

Hello Darren
I know its not the topic of this thread, but let us know about the impact of the Ether Regen in your system, once you try it.

Im intrigued!

 

[Genna]

I have done the complete mod from magna, transforming my r2r7 to R7 except that I still don't have external blaster input or ext clock input. Unfortunately I don't have an R2R7 to compare and that the burning in takes so long that I no longer remember clearly what it was like before. Also I have upgraded my int clock and F-1. I suspect the biggest difference is V2 board as the immediate improvement was on DSD even before burning in. The PCM R2R circuit would take months to burn in. Though the improvement could have been from synergy effect of TDA with V2 as well. I am not sure how much silver rewiring is making a difference. If you are getting a brand new R7 then u have new clock and V2. Adding the magna upgrades should not.cost a lot more. Alternatively u can do in stages, eg do the V2 board upgrade first and then do the rest later since Germany is not.too.far from Netherland

Sorry, I should also have mentioned that the purchase is the R7 (2020) and all the information of the Magna Silver mod for €115 consists in a unknown boards modification and the connecting cables of the boards replaced with silver cables.

 

[darren700]

So here is the thing, your system may be (definitely from mine) very different to other people's setup. It would be hard to know how a change of R7 would affect your system. For e.g I have no galvanic isolation and no ethernet use (except for controlling the software playback) and my PC runs on Euphony OS. Since I don't have galvanic isolation I have used filter AC cables to reduce as much noise as I can getting into the PC. Actually I use 2 isolation transformers and have chosen a receptacle that seems least noisy (using PS audio Harvester to figure that out) and things have improved a lot by reducing as much AC noise as possible.
The TDA can only work with PCM using old V1 board. To me that has improved things a lot compared with V3 FW. But it won't do DSD using V1 board. V2 board will work with TDA FW nicely, it is designed for TFA FW to get rid of all DSD noise (well let't say it filters out 98% of DSD noise, any remaining noise you would need to raise the volume to extremely loud level to hear it at beginning of a track). I am not sure what you mean by TDA mode engaged. Is your clock still old TOCO ? Maybe DIY your own clock and If you are skilled enough also the V2 board the improvement should be significant. I am not sure if V2 work without the new faceplate. I guess it should.

I agree there are so many variables., my system has a dizzing amount of components with a 7.1 surround setup and 2.1 channel dac/pre/amp combined. I run 3 separate 20a circuits with furutech outlets.
the 7.1 surround components are powered by a APC H15 power conditioner on one circuit, subs on the second 20a circuit, and the 2 channel system has its own dedicated circuit.
All 2 channel system source devices are powered by a Audio-GD HE-350 Regenerator or Uptone LPS-1 Linear supplies (100% galvanic isolation)
So I have isolation there as much as possible on the 2 channel side.
There is only 2 ways that leakage currents/noise can get in the 2 channel system right now that I can think of

• over the network connection to the Streamer, so this new ether regen switch from uptone should stop that
• my speaker amp is plugged directly into the wall, so I am considering buying one of the filters mentioned on the precious pages by you for my speaker amp, not sure yet

Anyways, back to R2R-7, I listen to 99% PCM, but still listen to DSD sometimes, so its a bummer that the DSD with TDA firmware isnt supported for V1 boards.
However I wonder if it is worth it to sacrifice DSD to get better PCM sound via TDA firmware?

Maybe i interpreted it wrong but on I was reading on the Audio-gd site under R7 instructions and came across this line below that implies that the TDA mode can be turned on or off via the front panel (or in my case jumpers?).
I wonder if DSD works on V1 boards with it set to "R" mode?

Pll (Simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A sound) :
t (TDA) : Active simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A, digital attenuation low to -55DB, was -130DB. Bitwide low to 16bit , was 24 bit. While active this function, I are advice setting to OS2 or OS4 mode. But infact, this function can working with any setting mode.
r (R-2R) : Disable simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A .

To answer your question, My R2R-7 has stock TCXO's and im kind of daunted by the idea of having to desolder them to replace them. my soldering experience consists of making DIY cables, never worked on any electronics yet and my R2R-7 is not exactly what I would consider simple to take apart and work on!

Hello Darren
I know its not the topic of this thread, but let us know about the impact of the Ether Regen in your system, once you try it.

Im intrigued!

Will do, im pretty hopeful, as there is potential for a lot of noise to be on the Ethernet coming from other devices on my network.

 

[Chopin75]

Sorry, I should also have mentioned that the purchase is the R7 (2020) and all the information of the Magna Silver mod for €115 consists in a unknown boards modification and the connecting cables of the boards replaced with silver cables.

I agree there are so many variables., my system has a dizzing amount of components with a 7.1 surround setup and 2.1 channel dac/pre/amp combined. I run 3 separate 20a circuits with furutech outlets.
the 7.1 surround components are powered by a APC H15 power conditioner on one circuit, subs on the second 20a circuit, and the 2 channel system has its own dedicated circuit.
All 2 channel system source devices are powered by a Audio-GD HE-350 Regenerator or Uptone LPS-1 Linear supplies (100% galvanic isolation)
So I have isolation there as much as possible on the 2 channel side.
There is only 2 ways that leakage currents/noise can get in the 2 channel system right now that I can think of

• over the network connection to the Streamer, so this new ether regen switch from uptone should stop that
• my speaker amp is plugged directly into the wall, so I am considering buying one of the filters mentioned on the precious pages by you for my speaker amp, not sure yet

Anyways, back to R2R-7, I listen to 99% PCM, but still listen to DSD sometimes, so its a bummer that the DSD with TDA firmware isnt supported for V1 boards.
However I wonder if it is worth it to sacrifice DSD to get better PCM sound via TDA firmware?

Maybe i interpreted it wrong but on I was reading on the Audio-gd site under R7 instructions and came across this line below that implies that the TDA mode can be turned on or off via the front panel (or in my case jumpers?).
I wonder if DSD works on V1 boards with it set to "R" mode?

Pll (Simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A sound) :
t (TDA) : Active simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A, digital attenuation low to -55DB, was -130DB. Bitwide low to 16bit , was 24 bit. While active this function, I are advice setting to OS2 or OS4 mode. But infact, this function can working with any setting mode.
r (R-2R) : Disable simulate SAA7220 +TDA1541A .

To answer your question, My R2R-7 has stock TCXO's and im kind of daunted by the idea of having to desolder them to replace them. my soldering experience consists of making DIY cables, never worked on any electronics yet and my R2R-7 is not exactly what I would consider simple to take apart and work on!




Will do, im pretty hopeful, as there is potential for a lot of noise to be on the Ethernet coming from other devices on my network.

I am unclear as to how that PLL works to simulate TDA1541A sound. I am not sure if that is even important or a point to motivate you to change to TDA FW.
I remember TDA has improved PCM NOS mode a lot. I primarily listen to NOS. I might do OS x0 (NOS with digital filter).
My answer regards DSD is no, one should never sacrifice DSD for PCM, well that is my biased opinion. For whatever reason DSD is gorgeous with the new V2 upgrade + TDA FW. I am not sure my new clock/wiring has helped as well, probably. I just don't see how a V1 board will survive in future even if you don't care about DSD. Kingwa's future FW will likely be for V2 board alone. I was in the same shoes as you but I decided to upgrade entire R2R 7 to magnafied R7 but it did cost me about $1000 US including shipping. I think it may be worth the trouble if you do everything, like upgrade as much as you can afford. (except you really don't need to upgrade the blaster) . I missed out on the EXT clock input as it came out shortly after I received my DAC again! But then that is not essential as I don't even have an external clock yet. Now the upgrade would require some long time to burn in the V2 board again too...
If you are in Canada, it is closer to ship to Netherland than China and really fast (they work fast!). You can chat with magna and see if they can give you a good deal (remember the price should be without Vat)

 

[Chopin75]

Sorry, I should also have mentioned that the purchase is the R7 (2020) and all the information of the Magna Silver mod for €115 consists in a unknown boards modification and the connecting cables of the boards replaced with silver cables.

Yah, I did not clarify that my Magnafied version has 3 parts being done. I think 1 on the site is for the V2 board (80 euro) and the silver wire (110 Euro) is for silver rewiring of the I2s pathways, not just for the I2S external input but for all I2S paths within the back panel. A third one is not official on public advertisement. That you need to ask Magna if they still offer. I believe that one is rewiring of the remaining main R2R board (some silver wring stuff, but I am not really sure, it is some Magna's own secret recipe).
To be honest, as I said before, hard to tell what has made what difference. I have noticed since the mod, my DAC may be more sensitive to AC noise than before which could certainly be effect of Silver wiring. And great recordings seem much better and the poorer ones are just worse, at least relatively so. DSD has gone way better than PCM. Latter is more temperamental. But this could all be due to my DAC's burning instability or my PC's poor performance (it needs some wiring upgrade++). The only way to truly know is to have R7 Unmod + a Magna mod R7 together fully burned in and then test A/B.

 

[darren700]

I am unclear as to how that PLL works to simulate TDA1541A sound. I am not sure if that is even important or a point to motivate you to change to TDA FW.
I remember TDA has improved PCM NOS mode a lot. I primarily listen to NOS. I might do OS x0 (NOS with digital filter).
My answer regards DSD is no, one should never sacrifice DSD for PCM, well that is my biased opinion. For whatever reason DSD is gorgeous with the new V2 upgrade + TDA FW. I am not sure my new clock/wiring has helped as well, probably. I just don't see how a V1 board will survive in future even if you don't care about DSD. Kingwa's future FW will likely be for V2 board alone. I was in the same shoes as you but I decided to upgrade entire R2R 7 to magnafied R7 but it did cost me about $1000 US including shipping. I think it may be worth the trouble if you do everything, like upgrade as much as you can afford. (except you really don't need to upgrade the blaster) . I missed out on the EXT clock input as it came out shortly after I received my DAC again! But then that is not essential as I don't even have an external clock yet. Now the upgrade would require some long time to burn in the V2 board again too...
If you are in Canada, it is closer to ship to Netherland than China and really fast (they work fast!). You can chat with magna and see if they can give you a good deal (remember the price should be without Vat)

I emailed Kingwa asking about TDA firmware and DSD working on my R2R-7 with V1 DA7 boards and he said this "It can compatible with all R2R 7 units."
I think I will give the latest Firmware a try and see how I like it, (R-7_Parallel_DOP_IIS3). Seems like Magna is the best option for me, I will email them next month when I get my Christmas bonus, hopefully they will be willing to do a full upgrade for me.

 

[Jackula]

The wait is killing me!

It missed the first plane out of China.

Then customs quarantined my order for more than 2 days and just released it this morning.

Now DHL is telling me they are only transporting 2 of the 4 boxes to my local delivery centre, the other two boxes are too heavy and are awaiting a heavy-duty truck.

Delivery won't be until Monday at the earliest

 

[DACLadder]

@Jackula A lot of people are “hang wringing” as well waiting on the DI-20 to ship. Those 2H amps weigh 70Kg each! Should be a great system with the R7-HE.

But I hate delays! Let us know how it goes!

 

[FredA]

@Jackula

Why 4 boxes, got the DI too? And don't tell me the monoblock are 70Kg EACH?