[Whitigir]

We are talking characteristic impedance, and this quantity is independent of cable length. Each transmission line, coaxial or not has one. Even traces in a pcb. As mentioned, this is stuff taught in electrical engineering. Characteristic impedance is important to consider in high-speed data transmission to avoid signal degradation caused by reflections. This is not trivial knowledge.

Right, 4” of such important wiring. Ok, I am not a newbie, but this is beyond my knowledge, and beyond whatever I had studied and graduated from

Those link you linked to me, tell me how can you make a 4” of Wires with 75 ohm impedance by stranded sizes, and flimsy Teflon insulation, and we can go further in engineering

Simply put, you do know Coax 50 and 75 ohms differences are the connector itself ? And characteristic impedance of such “cables” not “wires” are engineered with insulation, dielectric at specified specifications....again...cables characteristic impedance s are not wires, and wires have no such thing. Show me that r2r7 use Coax 75 ohms in place of the Wires, and I replace it with simple wires and you can blame on me

I appreciate that you are trying to help me navigating the problem. One thing I am sure of is that my wires that I put in, shall only be an improvement and not a degradation of any kinds, period.

 

[FredA]

Right, 4” of such important wiring. Ok, I am not a newbie, but this is beyond my knowledge, and beyond whatever I had studied and graduated from

This is not an easy topic even from an ee graduate like me. At high-frequency, signal reflections will occur and you have to design signal paths that will minimize them or their effects, otherwise, jitter will be intoduced, or even transmission errors. Kingwa must have made measurements this bundle of wire (tied together) and tried to achieve a precise impedance target. In this case, there are 4 wire, and they transmit possible two or 3 signals, left-right clock not being required, and maybe world clock is not required either. You don't have to be perfectly right, but the better the match with the sending and receiving ends, the smaller the reflections are.

 

[Whitigir]

This is not an easy topic even from an ee graduate like me. At high-frequency, signal reflections will occur and you have to design signal paths that will minimize them or their effects, otherwise, jitter will be intoduced, or even transmission errors. Kingwa must have made measurements this bundle of wire (tied together) and tried to achieve a precise impedance target. In this case, there are 4 wire, and they transmit possible two or 3 signals, left-right clock not being required, and maybe world clock is not required either. You don't have to be perfectly right, but the better the match with the sending and receiving ends, the smaller the reflection are.

And solder joints shall not be a problem then ? Common, let’s just stop

 

[FredA]

And solder joints shall not be a problem then ? Common, let’s just stop

I don't know if they are taken into account, i am just stating the basic principles of high-speed data transmission. How well this knowledge is applied in the audio industry, i would not know. All i have stated is well documented. All does not have to be perfect but if you don't take this into account transmitting at around 20 mhz, you will probably end up with sound degradation. How big is the question.

If this is relevant for transmitting data between a transport and dac, this is also relevant between any receiving and transmitting entity. Therefore it's relevant between a digital board and a r2r dac board. And as i said, the fact of having short lengths does not prevent reflections at all.

BUT, with short lengths, the relections are more in phase with the signal and thus have a lesser effect. But still have an effect. So if you want to maximize audio quality, it's a design aspect to consider.

 

[FredA]

And about solder points, there are in some coax cable. They could be neglectable. But the connector themselves often have a matched impedance.

 

[FredA]

@Whitigir: perhaps you should try other modes, os mode is likely more resolved. And you could also tell us the file and time in file where this hissing occurs.

Just trying to help and did not want to piss you off.

 

[Whitigir]

@Whitigir: perhaps you should try other modes, os mode is likely more resolved. And you could also tell us the file and time in file where this hissing occurs.

Just trying to help and did not want to piss you off.

Os 8x is never as resolved as nos modes, even on holospring. You can try acoustic tracks with guitars and voices. It mostly around those strings high note plays

 

[FredA]

I did not read you post completely. To answer a couple of question, yes a 50 and 75 ohms are different. Just changing the insulator or diameter will change the capacitance. The wire gauge will change resistivity. The general geometry will impact inductance. I don't know the best way to measure characteristic impedance, never performed such measurements. There is a hint on that in the first link. I could try measuring all three impedance component on a piece of 75 ohms and apply the formula and see if there is a match.

I will listen to acoustic guitar with voices on them, i don't have many of these.

 

[FredA]

I have Angelo Debarre and Ludovic Beier on now, the album is Paroles de Swing. My amp is the audio-gd nfb-1amp, i listen on a pair of he560. I am a guitar playing myself and frankly, acoustic guitars really sounds as good as the real thing. Actually, it is so freaking good, i might be late to work. Frankly, the timbres are so rich and right on the money, i am delighted. Same story with an album by Mala Junta trio i got in Barcelona. Just awesome guitar play. This one is full of high notes and they are as resolved and clean as the real thing to my ears.

If i were you, i would let the dac burn for 4 weeks straight and see after that. As opposed to what you stated, i believe precison will increase. Those big r2r boards need a lot of burn in. Same for the output stages. And it is my own personnal experience that the sound improves significantly with break-in. I would even state that it took 6 months overall for this dac to fully blossom (as @DACLadder mentioned about his singularity 7).

 

[Whitigir]

There is no debate on r2r7 tonal timbres being rich and realistic. I loved it after the silver wires, and it was the best I have heard, and ofcourse better than holospring. If I could deal with this hiss

 

[FredA]

There is no debate on r2r7 tonal timbres being rich and realistic. I loved it after the silver wires, and it was the best I have heard, and ofcourse better than holospring. If I could deal with this hiss

You could buy a r2r 11 as a backup during the wait. Pretty sure it can match you lks or maybe even the Holo Spring. You can keep it for another setup afterwards. Don't forget to thank me on buying this gem if you do.

 

[barbas]

There is no debate on r2r7 tonal timbres being rich and realistic. I loved it after the silver wires, and it was the best I have heard, and ofcourse better than holospring. If I could deal with this hiss

Can you please elaborate more on the 'hissing' you are experiencing? No other owner of R2R7 seems to be experiencing something like this, including me.

Re bass 'boom': how can be tonal timbre so correct if frequency balance is out of proportion as you claim you are experiencing?

 

[gk2013]

Can you please elaborate more on the 'hissing' you are experiencing? No other owner of R2R7 seems to be experiencing something like this, including me.

Re bass 'boom': how can be tonal timbre so correct if frequency balance is out of proportion as you claim you are experiencing?

Yes indeed. I am also wondering what input you are using and if you are experiencing this on all inputs?

 

[Whitigir]

Can you please elaborate more on the 'hissing' you are experiencing? No other owner of R2R7 seems to be experiencing something like this, including me.

Re bass 'boom': how can be tonal timbre so correct if frequency balance is out of proportion as you claim you are experiencing?

Hissing is your typical hissing, it is definitely frequency based. In ballads or jazz, acoustic with string instruments and some cymbal splashes will always make it hisses like a snake is singing with it.

Bass is booming and I replaced the wires with solid silver wires, and there is something more but with due respects, I don’t need to mention about it. Just know that after the silver wires are in, the bass is less booming and details were no more congested or veiled up.

Yes indeed. I am also wondering what input you are using and if you are experiencing this on all inputs?

No, I have not tried S/PDIF, or other inputs, only USB so far as I only use USB transport. Never seen this problems anywhere.

*this hissing is like errors in the process or whatever*. It would be fine trebles plays on lks004 (the tip top edges of the extensions), here it is like a snakes hissing with the music.

I also have the Grounded Grid here next to my T2. To observe, same thing

 

[DACLadder]

I am communicating privately with @Whitigir but the hiss has me scratching my head concerning a possible buy. So will ask questions publicly here.

Does the hiss only occur when rolling a track or present also between tracks? What input? Old analog tracks or also with modern digital recordings. He has no I2S input stated to me earlier.

Edit: Answered above!