[MarcelE]

Good tracks to test subass in my opinion. Curious to see which one he(400S,400i,500) performs better on those tracks...



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rYQeYlt744A



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3zTYIKJOM9Y



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4hkR2bV6Vk4

 


Nice (not only to listen to but to watch as well )
For me the really low notes is in the 2nd video at 1:54/1:55 - there's that 20/30Hz thing (just going by hearing, not any scientific proof).
Anyway music is much more of course and I would love to hear more Hifimans.

 

[Mark Up]

Listening on HE-400 and yes I can definitely hear it. The sample doesn't have a loud sub bass, it's just there

So HE-400 extends lower than HE-400S. Interesting. The lowest 808 in "Weekend" is equal in level to the high 808. That is why it's a great test. If you hear both booms equal, the system / headphones are true full range. If the first is louder, they are not.
 
HM22MUSIC - Delilah "Inside My Love" lowest bass note is a whole step higher (E0 flat - 20.6 hz) vs. Kelis "Weekend", which is down to D0 flat 17.3 hz, but with enough higher harmonics that a true 20 hz playback system will reproduce it and I can hear it.

 I can not hear a pure sub bass frequency below 40hz very well but feel them.

Maybe low sub bass is a better term. ATH-M50 is flatter in high bass / low mid. It can seem like a lack of warmth. Low sub bass I refer to doesn't make headphones warm, it makes them vibrate. I have unusually good hearing. I can hear a true tone down to 20 hz. ATH-M50 has it. You hear that low 808 in "Weekend" completely. I'm not sure about how those other folks think it lacks subs.

 

[john57]

 
So the HE-400 extends lower than the HE-400S. Never heard the HE-400. As it's brighter than the 400s I wouldn't like it.
 
Maybe low sub bass is a better term. ATH-M50 is flatter in high bass / low mid. It can seem like a lack of warmth. Low sub bass I refer to doesn't make headphones warm, it makes them vibrate. I have unusually good hearing. I can hear a true tone down to 20 hz. ATH-M50 has it. You hear that low 808 in "Weekend" completely. I'm not sure about how those other folks think it lacks subs.

I will agree that my 400 does seems to have more spread out bass than the 400S. The 400S has a bit of a low midbass hump but does not get in way of the midrange. Overall I still think that 400S is a very clean sounding headphone. Once I get the extra 400S pads for my 400S I will try it on the 400. You have the advantage that your ears can hear the sub bass better than mine. Some time ago I dabble in creating electronic music and one of the things I learn was not to put too much low bass otherwise the driver may create distortion byproducts and you are hearing the distortion not the true clean bass.  On the ATH-M50 I was just showing that different folks have different expectations what deep bass is. One time I made the mistake in getting a true sub for my home theater. There was quite a few action movies that will not trigger the sub and a few organ recordings also did not trigger the sub. For earth shaking bass and body bass that will rattle the walls and windows you need a sub that is tune to the midbass like this one at HSU research http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/mbm-12mk2.html which would be a better sub for my home theater needs in the first place.

 

[Mark Up]

Great response. Good to talk to others here into music / studio stuff. I have a customized sub that goes near 20 hz, and a room that can create it. I've got custom towers that go down there too. I spent an awfully long time tuning and setting that to get as flat a response as possible. Flat response has a lot more lower sub bass than other folks mistakenly think of as "flat". The same way some listen on small studio monitors that don't go below 50 hz and have really no idea what goes on down there. I mix and master a lot of sub bass heavy stuff where there is a big kick subby kick often hitting while the subby bass line or 808 is ringing out. Use of side-chaining in multi-band compression on just the sub lows can make proper room for it, so both are heard clearly.

The real key to a full range sound that won't trouble woofers or affect the low mids or quality is avoiding the dissonant "beating" that would happen when two different sub frequencies (ie. 64  hz and 60 hz) hit at the same time and the woofer has to fight to produce both. Having one at a time loud down there, and focusing on sine waves woofers smoothly produce vs the more squared waves (not just in sounds, but caused by clipped peaks, inter-sample peaks, etc.). Meaning, I have been able to keep a lot more going on to 20 hz without affecting sonic quality. It can be done, it just takes work and OCD, which is why a lot of us are here in OCD over headphones, heh. It's not so much wanting a big bass, really just wanting it full range. So you aren't missing anything.

 

[avitron142]

   
So a bit too much bass then?  Hmm... I quite like the bass (just a tad too much I suppose) on my X2 through my modi/magni stack, so maybe this wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing.

Then go for it! Getting a planar magnetic like these instead of a (regular) dynamic headphone will show mostly through the awesomely layered and detailed bass - that's one big thing planar's are known for. 

 

[Music Path]

-

 

[Music Path]

  @Mark Up Forgot to mention one genre which is especificly focused on bass and bass layering. Its caled Future Bass or some call it Bass only:
These go deep, good for plannars 

:

Better source:
https://soundcloud.com/annie-mac-presents/free-music-monday-tcts-feels


Better Source:
https://soundcloud.com/fulsonic/thieves-dilate-thorn

 -> This is more Trap
Better Source:
https://soundcloud.com/judexperience/rihanna-you-da-one-j-u-d-remix?in=judexperience/sets/remixes
 

 

[Mike43110]

Any more comments on the bass extension?
I am currently on the fence (damn exchange rate and difficult returns thanks to being in South Africa!) and was wondering if anyone else has comments on the 20-50hz range. My IEMs can produce that
There is of course always waiting for innerfidelity's frequency graphs though.

 

[MarcelE]

btw if anybody thinks that those 20Hz are only good for dance music etc so listening to other music you don't mind missing them.
There's also the classical organ music (not that I'm a big fan of that), but here's a fun sample.
Mind you this is NOT a demo to test your headphones as the camera mics just couldn't take it, but fun to watch nonetheless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEVd2vdWYc0

Wish there were some more reviews and freq graphs of the 400s.

 

[Mike43110]

btw if anybody thinks that those 20Hz are only good for dance music etc so listening to other music you don't mind missing them.
There's also the classical organ music (not them I'm a big fan of that), but here's a fun sample.
Mind you this is NOT a demo to test your headphones as the camera mics just couldn't take it, but fun to watch nonetheless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEVd2vdWYc0

Wish there were some more reviews and freq graphs of the 400s.

​
Agreed! However, they are very new - making availability of reviews and freq graphs unlikely.

 

[avitron142]

  ​
Agreed! However, they are very new - making availability of reviews and freq graphs unlikely.

I'm about to publish a review in a day or two - I didn't focus as much on the sub-bass though. Maybe I'll do some tests and add them in.

 

[raybone0566]

I'm about to publish a review in a day or two - I didn't focus as much on the sub-bass though. Maybe I'll do some tests and add them in.

Thanks, looking forward to your impressions.

 

[john57]

btw if anybody thinks that those 20Hz are only good for dance music etc so listening to other music you don't mind missing them.
There's also the classical organ music (not that I'm a big fan of that), but here's a fun sample.
Mind you this is NOT a demo to test your headphones as the camera mics just couldn't take it, but fun to watch nonetheless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEVd2vdWYc0

Wish there were some more reviews and freq graphs of the 400s.

I saw that video that shows a organ with 64ft and 128ft stop. It is a home organ and none of the churches in Colorado have a 64ft pipe.  A 64ft and 128ft stop bass is below the threshold of hearing but you will hearing other things vibrating. I would not even try to play this. 

 

[JPlaquia]

  I'm about to publish a review in a day or two - I didn't focus as much on the sub-bass though. Maybe I'll do some tests and add them in.

Looking forward!

 

[Mark Up]

Listen to this with them. On the "and the beat goes boom" parts, the first half has an 808 sub boom you can hear on any system. The second half boom is 17.3 hz, with harmonics in the lower 20-25 hz area. You won't hear it on the HE-400S, but it can be heard on a lot of other headphones that I have tried. Put it to the test. https://youtu.be/VAZz_X5Uq5Q