MrSpeakers Alpha PRIME: Impressions and Discussion Thread
Feb 24, 2015 at 4:13 PM Post #1,171 of 2,891
  Yes, they're running a promotion.  We have a lot of customers who use their products, and they appear to have a lot who were interested in ours, so as they ran promos with Audeze and HiFiMan in the past, I thought we'd give it a try. 

That's fair enough. I know they're very popular these days (and very "unpopular" as well), and I know they've run promos with other companies I love. But the worry is that this company is or has become nothing but an endless stream of promos. Nonetheless, I respect that it's your decision to make. I don't want to derail the thread. 
 
  Wow, a team-up with LH? If that is true, it's really disappointing. 

I'm saying this in a non-aggressive or argumentative way, but he IS a business owner, so this makes sense. Especially when those products are popular and the bundles have worked well in the past.

I don't doubt the promos have "worked well" in the past. And I understand that Dan is a business owner. 
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 4:19 PM Post #1,172 of 2,891
For me I am not going to support Light Harmonic business model, ever. This sounds more like a sort of a group buy and users are waiting on the previous promotional items as well.     
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 4:20 PM Post #1,173 of 2,891
  That's fair enough. I know they're very popular these days (and very "unpopular" as well), and I know they've run promos with other companies I love. But the worry is that this company is or has become nothing but an endless stream of promos. Nonetheless, I respect that it's your decision to make. I don't want to derail the thread. 
I don't doubt the promos have "worked well" in the past. And I understand that Dan is a business owner. 

It's all good. I'm not buying one regardless, as I don't like the Alpha Primes much. The midrange and brightness was kind of weird to me.
 
But anyway, That IS what they have become, and I honestly will not do business with them beyond the Geek Pulse I had already paid for (and can't get a refund for.) I'm still waiting on the survey they promised me a week ago.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 6:07 PM Post #1,174 of 2,891
Well, I've been an LH backer since 2013 and have been a vocal supporter and critic in equal measures.  Whatever the roller coaster of the past (and ongoing) LH campaigns, from seeing Dan's input on this forum I have confidence in MrSpeakers to deliver (probably before my Pulse gets here!). I'm very happy that I can now afford a new Prime rather than looking on the second hand market as I've been doing recently, so thanks from one happy customer-to-be here.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 7:01 PM Post #1,175 of 2,891
  Wow, a team-up with LH? If that is true, it's really disappointing. 

 
Why? I'm a backer who've had to deal with almost every sort of problem they've had. The delays, the customer service black outs, incorrect shipments, etc. 
 
It's just growing pains. Their success in crowdfunding was beyond their wildest expectations and they are struggling to manage. I still think that they provide excellent value and the delays are unfortunate but at least they do eventually deliver. 
 
I personally think that it's great that Dan has teamed up with them because as he said, some MrSpeakers fans are backers and some backers are MrSpeakers fans. 
 
Case in point being me. I'm a bit upset though that I couldn't wait and already bought a unit second hand Prime unit for MORE than the current offer. I am also wondering on the colour in case I prefer it to the claret.  :)
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 8:43 PM Post #1,176 of 2,891
Since this is the MrSpeakers forum and not the LH Labs one let's have a nice pic of this evening's Hotel room rig.
 
 

 
Extra points if you can guess the USB cable....
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 8:48 PM Post #1,177 of 2,891

I was encouraged elsewhere to post this here. It’s bits and pieces of my impressions.
 
I’ll say it off the get go. MrSpeakers products have quite a bit more production variety than most other headphones at the price range. Difference in quality can sometimes be seen as well.
 
Anyway, I have owned both the 2014 Mad Dog Pros and the 2014 Alpha Dogs, both of which I enjoyed thoroughly and consider them great value for their price and more. This is partially due to the lack of good closed back in the price range though.
 
I had not heard the Alpha Prime, and my opinions were based mostly on impressions and measurements. This is a summary of my thoughts on the Alpha Prime originally:


“I have not heard the AP, but I have owned and heard both the later version of MD and AD…enclosure makes a huge difference, although in the case of speakers, that's more valid, as headphones barely have space inside and between the driver and ear for enormous differences in enclosure design to change drivers’ characters.


However…the price was unwarranted and not in the same league built-wise and sound quality wise as similarly priced headphones in the $1K range. The enclosure of the AD and AP are exactly identical. YET for the same pads, headband, drivers and enclosure, you pay $400 more. I don't know how much work was done on the drivers themselves, but it can't warrant $400 more. I can buy a pair of HD 800 drivers for $500.


And at the end of the day, based on impressions and comparisons I have read, it just doesn't look or feel or sound like a flagship when compared to other flagships, and it is at most an incremental update, more neutral, compared to the AD. Speaking of the $600 Alpha Dog and the R&D and trial and error that has gone into it and its improvements over the original Fostex and the Mad Dog, it certainly gives you the sound quality for its price and more. And the extra cost of the pads and enclosures and all the nice extra touches certainly warrants at least $500-$600 for the finished product.


Nevertheless, with the Alpha Primes, there is just so far you can extend a $50 driver and $150 headphones before you hit a ceiling and modification becomes so incremental in its improvements, the time consumed is the only thing you're charging customers for (and MrSpeakers prices that extra time and effort and possible failure rates of driver modification at $400 extra over the Alpha Dogs). Based on MrSpeakers own estimates, there is a 75% failure rate when it comes to modifying the drivers for Alpha Prime. That failure rate is being passed on to the end user.”
 
Come a few weeks after and I have now had a chance to hear 2 different Alpha Primes, both with noticeably different sound signatures (though not significantly so), which is disappointing given both are supposed to be the same product. What I said above were more or less validated through my experience.
 
First of all, for all intents and purposes, it is identical in terms of aesthetics to the Alpha Dog. Nothing new here.
 
There is quite a bit of bass, but it lacks the impact, and warmth of Alpha Dog or anything else. It's thinner and hollower than its predecessors.
 
The treble is good, except for the occasional peak and sizzling, which I find horribly annoying. Only shows up on some recordings though. What it reminds me is when you turn the treble nob on vintage amps up a bit more than it should be.
 
There is zero air and airiness a lot of us enjoy. None at all. It's just missing the soundstage and natural sound some other headphones have. It's worse than the Mad Dog in this aspect, and that was already a closed-in headphones.
 
There was distortion at higher volume.
 
And the worst part of all, it lacks everything in the mids. Whether it was vocals or piano or anything, just sounded low-fi through and through.
 
Nothing has any presence, and compared to my HD800, the Alpha Prime lacks crispness and rolls over all the details. Just in general, female vocals, pianos and acoustic music sounded wrong. Not even close to proper. I’d say the mids on the Amperior or Momentum was much better presented than the Alpha Prime, and that’s a $700 price parity.
 
Now, for a pair of headphones, it sounds adequate. Certainly not terrible. But for a $1000 pair of headphones, especially compared to its peers in the $1000 category, give or take $300, it is just non-competent. It isn't even close. I find it a step backwards from the Alpha Dog. It sounds more like a more refined Mad Dog (in some aspects only) than a better Alpha Dog.
 
In the end, it isn't a terrible headphones. They sound good, but only for perhaps half the price. Maybe $600. DEFINITELY not $1000. I cannot imagine how anybody could be paying a $1000 for these, wait months and be able to smile while listening to them. They don't sound good at all. I had to force myself to listen to them for several hours each (two Alpha Primes) over two days, just to be able to pinpoint what the heck was wrong with them.
 
Again, I heard two different Alpha Primes, and while there were differences in the sound, one had more sibilance than the other, and the other had better mid and low bass, both pretty much had all the problems I explained above.
 
Also remember, they are VERY difficult to drive. They are more inefficient than any Fostex modifications I have ever seen. Bring your best highest power amp you have for orthodynamics.
 
I should include that the two Alpha Prime and all comparisons to my existing headphones were done through the Concero HD -> Auralic Taurus MKII, and using balanced cables with the Alpha Primes.
 
Disclaimer: YMMV, and these are all subjective personal opinions and impressions of my own. I am young, have sharp ears, play a number of instruments effectively, and have been described to have pitch perfect ears as a teenager. In no way am I implying all Alpha Primes sound like this, or everybody’s impressions will be similar. Thank you for reading.
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:06 PM Post #1,178 of 2,891
Thank you Kapanak for your impressions. You and I differ on our experience with the Prime's. My milage is satisfied for the fun they bring.
 
beerchug.gif

 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:07 PM Post #1,179 of 2,891
i guess you didnt read a few pages back about the extra modification to the drivers. Not easy. anyway i am sure you will read some disagreements shortly. can u recommend a better "closed" headphone for the price?
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:13 PM Post #1,180 of 2,891
  Since this is the MrSpeakers forum and not the LH Labs one let's have a nice pic of this evening's Hotel room rig.
 
 

 
Extra points if you can guess the USB cable....

Hope you didn't pay full price for that cable; that is, if it's what I think it is. 
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:14 PM Post #1,181 of 2,891
  Thank you Kapanak for your impressions. You and I differ on our experience with the Prime's. My milage is satisfied for the fun they bring.
 

 
They could sound fun with some recordings. Honestly, my impressions were mostly to point out the variation in production even between two models. That's why some Alpha Primes I am sure sound much better than what I heard.
beerchug.gif

i guess you didnt read a few pages back about the extra modification to the drivers. Not easy. anyway i am sure you will read some disagreements shortly. can u recommend a better "closed" headphone for the price?

 
Oh I read that. It explains a lot about the distortion I hear. Honestly, the "amazing closed cans for $1000" is like one of the most asked questions on Head-Fi, and there simply isn't an answer for it. They all have problems. I'd say you'd have to go as far as the LCD-XC to get superb closed back performance, but that's a $1000 more in Canada. The point is, Alpha Prime is NOT the answer for even "good closed back for $1000".
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:17 PM Post #1,182 of 2,891
 
  Since this is the MrSpeakers forum and not the LH Labs one let's have a nice pic of this evening's Hotel room rig.
 
 

 
Extra points if you can guess the USB cable....

Hope you didn't pay full price for that cable; that is, if it's what I think it is. 

Grab the Perks when they make sense.....
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:50 PM Post #1,184 of 2,891
  Since this is the MrSpeakers forum and not the LH Labs one let's have a nice pic of this evening's Hotel room rig.
 
 

 
Extra points if you can guess the USB cable....

 
Wow! Split Lightspeed! I have the red non-split one but I actually wanted the white split one. 
 
Feb 24, 2015 at 9:54 PM Post #1,185 of 2,891
 
I was encouraged elsewhere to post this here. It’s bits and pieces of my impressions.
 

 
What amp and DAC did you try them with? 
 
I found that to get the best out of the Primes you need to have a good dac/amp. 
 
I also found that they were far superior to the ADogs that I did not like. I think that you should also consider them for being a closed non-leaking headphone. When you compare them with open headphones, of course you will find that they have a slight advantage in certain aspects. 
 
I too would have preferred if they were closer to 600-700 but if the LCD-3 is 2K and the LCD-XC not far from that, then I think 1K for the Prime is more than fair. 
 

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