[King CATalyst]

Nice to see another space cowboy in here!

 

[MrGoat]

The Valhalla 2 sits at my desk unused... we can pair these two together.

I leave it in high gain because my mind reckons it may have less feedback in higher gain.

Sounds good...the sibilance is smoothed over a bit. As time goes by, as I Iisten to the randomised playlist, something really bugs me about the sound...it's rough, cold and not enjoyable.

I grab the PX100s and plug them in and switch the Valhalla 2 to low gain and there it is...the full tone. But the centre mids and upper mids lose the solidarity and liquidity of the Jubilees.

I plug the Jubilees and the mids return....but everything sounds crystal clear...the treble is clean as, without sibilant grain. The sound is very complete.

It's the gain switch at the back of the Valhalla 2...the Jubilee lose control of the treble mids and upper mids...bass and everywhere in high gain. The sound is Ragged, lean, bright and smeary, it's a mess.

Going to low gain and after extensive listening...well, I don't long for the low mids of the HD650...which is what's been happening with the Jubi on my solid state reference.

The treble is pristinely clear, liquid and no grain at all... sibilance is proper juicy and not sandpaper dry. The low mids merge better into the rest of the mids... I gain an extra layer of imaging down low. The soundstage is more liquid and larger.

It's the magic of tubes on low gain in the Valhalla 2...after a lengthy period of enjoying tune after tune...this may well make this combination the best musical combination I have ever had the pleasure of owning.

The thing I can't explain is how the headphone has a output transformer saturation effect built in...so that even on Schiits OTL... I get a bit of that transformer coupled saturation sound that I love.

When I no longer feel the need to plug in the HD650 for that wonderful tone and the Jubilee is giving me the same hit with more precise treble and imaging and saturation that only expensive tube amps can give...well, all by going low gain on the Valhalla 2, I ain't got no complaints.

I am going to put it this way...if right now someone asked me I could only keep one combo in my entire collection. It would be these. Matched to the right tube characteristics...these are it.

Thanks for the heads up. I had not tried low gain mode until now. I agree with you completely. I love the Valhalla 2 with the HD58x. Currently using 1968 Reflektors 6n23p, they have a crazy deep bass sound that extends very low. My first impressions were only using high gain. I have not had this tube amp very long, I have used the Asgard 2 for many years until the past month or so. Because of this I did not realize the Gain switch isn't just volume control like on the Asgard 2, it does change the sound enough to be noticeable.

All the negative things I said about the HD58x are gone using low gain mode, it is no longer fatiguing at all or too energetic in the high frequencies. Low gain really tamed things down where the needed to be. Although, now I have to run the volume dial at 2 O'Clock to get the volume I want (as opposed to 11 O'clock in high gain). The low gain mode just balances out the Bass and Highs and makes it even more neutral and less overly extended. That being said, I still enjoy high gain mode, but it is a little fatiguing after a few hours. High gain mode is more energetic and louder in the highs and lows, definately moves more air and you can feel it on your face and ears. For long sessions, low gain is the way to go, very non fatiguing but does take away some of the bass and "sparkle" up top. This is probably the way they are suppose to sound, I would imagine from Sennheiser. I have really been enjoying the HD58x, they play everything just beautifully and sound amazing. I have choose the HD58x every music session the past few days (and movies), reserving the mighty HD650 for only spinning records now days. The HD650 still wins with vinyl, even more so death/black metal in vinyl format, the guitar tone and heavy distortion are simply unbeatable, which is why the HD650 will always stay with me. Although, if I only owned the HD58x, I would still be satisfied.

 

[SP Wild]

Thanks for the heads up. I had not tried low gain mode until now. I agree with you completely. I love the Valhalla 2 with the HD58x. Currently using 1968 Reflektors 6n23p, they have a crazy deep bass sound that extends very low. My first impressions were only using high gain. I have not had this tube amp very long, I have used the Asgard 2 for many years until the past month or so. Because of this I did not realize the Gain switch isn't just volume control like on the Asgard 2, it does change the sound enough to be noticeable.

All the negative things I said about the HD58x are gone using low gain mode, it is no longer fatiguing at all or too energetic in the high frequencies. Low gain really tamed things down where the needed to be. Although, now I have to run the volume dial at 2 O'Clock to get the volume I want (as opposed to 11 O'clock in high gain). The low gain mode just balances out the Bass and Highs and makes it even more neutral and less overly extended. That being said, I still enjoy high gain mode, but it is a little fatiguing after a few hours. High gain mode is more energetic and louder in the highs and lows, definately moves more air and you can feel it on your face and years. For long sessions, low gain is the way to go, very non fatiguing but does take away some of the bass and "sparkle" up top. This is probably the way they are suppose to sound, I would imagine from Sennheiser. I have really been enjoying the HD58x, they play everything just beautifully and sound amazing. I have choose the HD58x every music session the past few days (and movies), reserving the mighty HD650 for only spinning records now days. The HD650 still wins with vinyl, even more so death/black metal in vinyl format, the guitar tone and heavy distortion are simply unbeatable, which is why the HD650 will always stay with me. Although, if I only owned the HD58x, I would still be satisfied.

I have those exact same Russian tubes and my first instinct was that those were the tubes for the Jubilee...but they are in my Musical Fidelity V3 hybrid amp...and I have no idea where I stored that amp.

Different tubes have different output impedance and I have no doubt the reflektors sound acceptable in high gain.

I still have the stock tubes in the Valhalla V2 and the reflectors have more body and tone than the stock tubes.

The HD650 will always breath better in the mid bass and low mids and sound more open and resolving there. My guess is that the HD650 drivers have a lower resonant frequency (Fs) and the Jubilee drivers have a higher Fs.

That is why many still prefer the HD650 sound.

I put it this way...the HD650 puts you on stage with likely what musicians hear when performing...jamming or rehearsing, wherever, on stage or not.

The Jubilees put you in the audience...with the best seat in the house away from reverberation in the venue and closer to direct sound from the performance.

 

[turbomustang84]

I've seen this video before, not exactly informative honestly and i find written formats easier to follow.

that video leaves out too much because he did not even know how to take the clips off in order to disassemble the headphones and that is the first thing to do but if you are leaving the black on the metal sliders be careful not to scratch the paint.
now I personally would take it completely apart and then use very fine grot sand paper to scruff the paint on any surface you plan to paint

 

[Mark Up]

Just my personal taste. The stock sounded best. There is no high end grain issue to me which is surprising as I'm hyper-sensitive to treble. There is a bit more true mids to high mids poke on the mod version, and even with the Loki bass boost it's still there. Of course, how they sound on that object is different than on the head, but I want to thank you for doing that. It still shows a difference in them easily verified. I was really worried I'd hear a person's voice in each video describing the sound difference they heard, and no actual headphone output. LOL. I find out of my iPhone 5s (that gen of the iPhones through the last gen to have a headphone jack were considered to be the best DAC of any smartphone) nowhere near the full level, these cans are great stock, and certainly usable that way. Plugging them into my Focusrite Scarlett 6i6 (latest version, rev 2) headphone outs, well under 50% volume (probably 30-40% tops) these do scale up. There seems to be more bass but it's that there really is no roll off on the Focusrite, they design every in and out in that box to be neutral and flat for studio use. Slight uptick in treble detail perhaps, but still smooth, fatigue free, accurate experience. Sony MDR-1A with Meze 99 pads in the other headphone out for a more closed (yet surprisingly wide) super sub bass heavy experience. I await the hopeful completion of Advanced Audio's GT-R, on Indegogo (only $199 for what will be $100-$200 more once they are for sale) is a steal. Still many left to get at that price. It's a nice fit between them. Seems they have more sub bass than the HD58X and a little less than the Sony. They are semi-open so they're more open than the ported Sony but more closed than the HD58X. Very comfortable. I think people here would like them. I preferred that model to every other planar I tried that day for punchiness vs. the 2D sound I'm used to. No over-saturated midrange, better treble detail, very light weight, comfort, and most of all, sub bass extension.

 

[VRacer-111]

Yeah, its funny how a small piece of material covering the magnet hole to the driver can drastically effect the sound. The modded one is more detailed and definitely brighter, but still slightly smoother in the treble than stock. The Vmoda Boom PRO mic seems to overemphasis bass and doesn't resolve the best, especially in regards to both low and high frequencies, does better with the mids.

Still have different things left to try on it, this was just the first shot at playing around with the HD58X. I also tried 22mm dots of the stock foam and a different less dense felt (colored green) with 12mm dot of single ply tissue. Stock foam dot unsurprisingly sounded pretty much identical to stock... LOL. So if you want open the grilles but keep the stock sound cut 22mm circles out of the stock foam to protect the driver. The green felt had close to the same bass level as stock but tone was a little weird and was not as clean sounding as the black felt - too close to stock sound while the black was much different, more open/expansive sounding as well.

Want to try the stock foam with different materials behind it, and different densities of foam - but the denser you go the more bass you loose. Need to dig more than surface level into the DIY-AudioHeaven article on the mods. I really like the clarity, detail, and expansive sound that black felt/tissue combo gives, but the bass loss and brightness is a bit too much. Loki can fix it mostly, but not ideal. Would really like to keep the modding to the back side of the driver for now... don't want to mess with pads yet - know how picky the HD6XX series is and have never heard any Dekoni pads I've actually ever really liked.

I really need a 3rd and 4th HD58X to better compare mods... LOL

 

[MrGoat]

WOW! I impulse ordered a Schiit Loki mini. And holy schiit. The HD58x responds very well to this little thing. These cans have the potential to be bass canons, impressive for open backs.

 

[WilliamLeonhart]

Thanks for the heads up. I had not tried low gain mode until now. I agree with you completely. I love the Valhalla 2 with the HD58x. Currently using 1968 Reflektors 6n23p, they have a crazy deep bass sound that extends very low. My first impressions were only using high gain. I have not had this tube amp very long, I have used the Asgard 2 for many years until the past month or so. Because of this I did not realize the Gain switch isn't just volume control like on the Asgard 2, it does change the sound enough to be noticeable.

All the negative things I said about the HD58x are gone using low gain mode, it is no longer fatiguing at all or too energetic in the high frequencies. Low gain really tamed things down where the needed to be. Although, now I have to run the volume dial at 2 O'Clock to get the volume I want (as opposed to 11 O'clock in high gain). The low gain mode just balances out the Bass and Highs and makes it even more neutral and less overly extended. That being said, I still enjoy high gain mode, but it is a little fatiguing after a few hours. High gain mode is more energetic and louder in the highs and lows, definately moves more air and you can feel it on your face and ears. For long sessions, low gain is the way to go, very non fatiguing but does take away some of the bass and "sparkle" up top. This is probably the way they are suppose to sound, I would imagine from Sennheiser. I have really been enjoying the HD58x, they play everything just beautifully and sound amazing. I have choose the HD58x every music session the past few days (and movies), reserving the mighty HD650 for only spinning records now days. The HD650 still wins with vinyl, even more so death/black metal in vinyl format, the guitar tone and heavy distortion are simply unbeatable, which is why the HD650 will always stay with me. Although, if I only owned the HD58x, I would still be satisfied.

I barely use high-gain on any of my amps, but this is interesting to learn. But I think you do find the HD650 and the HD58x to be very similar? I'm still debating on whether to keep both my HD58x and my HD6xx or to sell one of them. Pretty much all of my other headphones sound distinctly different (1 Grado, 1 ATH, 1 Master & Dynamics) so I don't really have a reason to keep the HD58x.

 

[Tuneslover]

WOW! I impulse ordered a Schiit Loki mini. And holy schiit. The HD58x responds very well to this little thing. These cans have the potential to be bass canons, impressive for open backs.

Yup the Loki is my favourite mod and I don't have to butcher my headphones either.

 

[J The Killer]

Anybody tried using bluetooth with 58X or any other 6' series?

 

[Anarion]

Anybody tried using bluetooth with 58X or any other 6' series?

One simply doesn't use wired headphones wirelessly.

 

[MrGoat]

I barely use high-gain on any of my amps, but this is interesting to learn. But I think you do find the HD650 and the HD58x to be very similar? I'm still debating on whether to keep both my HD58x and my HD6xx or to sell one of them. Pretty much all of my other headphones sound distinctly different (1 Grado, 1 ATH, 1 Master & Dynamics) so I don't really have a reason to keep the HD58x.

I always run in high gain mode, especially when I am only using the HD650, they need high gain mode to sound proper. I still run the HD58x in high gain as well unless the sound gets too "energetic" for me, but my ears are getting more accustomed to the Hd58x every day. I even run my LSR305 monitors using high gain on the amp, but I have the monitors turned to volume 5 so they match the same volume as the headphones. High gain is just more enjoyable, imo, more going on up top and deep below. Also, it picks up small details better. It's all personal preference, however. But, I assume different tubes, different amps, and different music, this will give different opinions.

In terms of which to keep? Only you can know that. I will be keeping both, because I really don't like other headphones besides the HD6** series. Ive tried many others, most are either missing something or are too fatiguing. I spent years trying different headphones before settling on the 650, and then was satisfied (and still am) for the next 4+ years. So to find another headphone that is a similar sound signature but improves on everything about the 650 and is more neutral with added sub-bass. It is a no brainer to keep them, especially at the price it is.

Keep in mind I don't collect headphones. The HD58x are only the 2nd pair I have chose to keep in a long time. And i still use the HD650 for playing records, as the 650 is greatly superior with vinyl and/or poor recordings. But all my records are metal of some kind, so that plays into why I prefer the 650 there as well. If I am doing any serious listening, or listening to vinyl/tapes/anything analog, or listening for a long period of time, I will always choose my HD650. If I am doing anything else, browsing the internet, watching videos or movies, and listening to random music online, I have been choosing the HD58x all week (mainly for that sweet sub-bass). And that I see how the HD58x bass responds to the Loki mini eq, it justifies me keeping them even more. It really makes them a very versatile headphone. Although, I would be happy with either. If you have a lot of headphones, I could see why it might be tempting to sell one pair as they are pretty similar in terms of sound signature; but that is why I like them. Although, still, different enough to my ears to justify keeping both.

 

[477621]

The HD650 will always breath better in the mid bass and low mids and sound more open and resolving there. My guess is that the HD650 drivers have a lower resonant frequency (Fs) and the Jubilee drivers have a higher Fs.

That is why many still prefer the HD650 sound.

I put it this way...the HD650 puts you on stage with likely what musicians hear when performing...jamming or rehearsing, wherever, on stage or not.

The Jubilees put you in the audience...with the best seat in the house away from reverberation in the venue and closer to direct sound from the performance.

Hmm... I feel the HD58X are closer to the on stage sound than the 650. As a long time band member I look for that feel and sound in my headphones. I want things to sound correct. I really didn't get on with the 650 as they sounded fake compared to my IT pair (565 Ovations). The 58X feel to be cut from the same cloth as my faithful Ovations. They give me the on stage sound and tone.

I know this personal audio thing is well... Personal. But to me, the 58X feels much closer to the on stage sound to me.

 

[Anarion]

I have no idea how you guys can possibly default to high gain... Heck, if I don't use the volume pot the comfortable volume range is <8% on low gain (so I guess I don't even need to say how loud normal and high are). Some kind of volume controller is a must so I'll usually use 18% volume for AE-5 and vol pot around 33-40% (same would apply to O2 when using line out and 1x gain). I can't see how high gain could do any good with these unless the DAC that feeds the AMP is unbelievably weak.

 

[MrGoat]

I have no idea how you guys can possibly default to high gain... Heck, if I don't use the volume pot the comfortable volume range is <8% on low gain (so I guess I don't even need to say how loud normal and high are). Some kind of volume controller is a must so I'll usually use 18% volume for AE-5 and vol pot around 33-40% (same would apply to O2 when using line out and 1x gain). I can't see how high gain could do any good with these unless the DAC that feeds the AMP is unbelievably weak.

Well, I have never used an O2 amp. But, My volume range on both my Schiit Valhalla 2 and my Asgard 2 was from 7 O'clock to 2 O'clock on the dial until too loud (the dial maxes out at almost 6 O'clock which would be murder). So plenty of headroom and plenty of room to adjust volume to your desired listening level on high gain. I personally feel like I have less room to adjust on Low Gain mode because everything below 12 O' Clock is too quiet. As I said before, gain modes are different for different amps. With the Asgard 2, a solid state amp, I found the gain switch really just changed the volume; where as the Valhalla 2 does change the sound signature a little bit more when switching between gain modes (mainly in the very highs and very lows). I am sure tubes make a difference there as well, though. Lots of variables to consider here.