[Audioexcels]

 
Quote:

Hi
 
I have been testing for a week the hiface two and had the chance to compare to hiface 1, EVO and Stello U3. Just finished translating the article, if you want to check.
 
this is a good piece of electronics as far as I have heard. it will most probably please poeple with common equipments, but I find it a little bit short for very good DACs.
 
http://musiq-audiophile.blogspot.fr/2012/04/m2tech-hiface-two-english-version.html
 
regards
musiq
 

 
I like it more than the Audiophilleo and the Evo sounds well, not all that great for the price.  I'd have to have one side by side the Hiface 2, but I bet the differences are only minor rather than something truly worthy.  What kind of hi-end USB converter should I be listening to and why do you say the dac should be good when my opinion is the system itself should be good?  Thanks for any pointers on more reference based USB converters OR other sources that are superior to what you have mentioned.  Thanks for the review.  It is a very good one, very straight forward and to the point even if I disagree especially with the Evo.  

 

[ManBeard]

where can you buy this?
 
so far i have only found it at http://hifiheaven.net/store/M2TECH-HiFace-Two-R-USB-Hi-End-SPDIF-Output-Interface?filter_name=hiface $185

TweekGeek carries it as well: http://www.tweekgeek.com/hiface-two/ same price.

 

[MusiqSound]

 
Quote:

  Thanks for the review.  It is a very good one, very straight forward and to the point even if I disagree especially with the Evo.  

 
You are welcome. We must admit that an opinion is just an opinion. Mine through my reviews is only my personal view on the subject. There is no problem for you to have a different one or have lived a different experience with it!
 
The EVO is not perfect for sure, it is just going a little bit farther on my opinion and also with another tonal signature.
 
To be sure to catch the difference of the key, I used a Starlight Platinum S/PDIF cable, it is a very good one that allows to leave the musical message flow without too much harm. 
 
The main difference is with the way the details are reproduced and also a lot with 3D and space, EVO offers a largest realistic scene as well as better depth on my test system. In the same way, for example, the Stello U3 goes even farther with micro-information and small details, when you play test tracks at -60db, -40db or 0db you will experience to hear the difference in the way the adapters behave at iso-source. You also hear the difference in background noise
 
I recognize that also depending on the source software, the listening experience can be VERY different... 
 
have a good day,
musiq

 

[Audioexcels]

 
Quote:

 
 
You are welcome. We must admit that an opinion is just an opinion. Mine through my reviews is only my personal view on the subject. There is no problem for you to have a different one or have lived a different experience with it!
 
The EVO is not perfect for sure, it is just going a little bit farther on my opinion and also with another tonal signature.
 
To be sure to catch the difference of the key, I used a Starlight Platinum S/PDIF cable, it is a very good one that allows to leave the musical message flow without too much harm. 
 
The main difference is with the way the details are reproduced and also a lot with 3D and space, EVO offers a largest realistic scene as well as better depth on my test system. In the same way, for example, the Stello U3 goes even farther with micro-information and small details, when you play test tracks at -60db, -40db or 0db you will experience to hear the difference in the way the adapters behave at iso-source. You also hear the difference in background noise
 
I recognize that also depending on the source software, the listening experience can be VERY different... 
 
have a good day,
musiq

 
Thanks a lot musiq for your opinions and objective knowledge.  I do not think the Evo is bad, just not what I would expect for the price.  Same goes for the Audiophilleo or other $500+ stuff.  I just don't hear whatever it is that others seem to hear.  In the end, even sound cards like the Xonar ST sound equally similar.  I put down the original Hiface, but it too is not exactly much different to the point that it too would easily hold its own and fool anyone in an a/b (not strict a/b, just basic swtichbox w/equal levels).  Now one thing I have indeed noticed is these sources, whatever they may be, will have a tendency to emphasize or de-emphasize detail.  For example, the Hiface 2 seems to be more balanced/neutral all in all vs. say, a Xonar ST.  Xonar ST seems to push more midrange/lower midrange/midbass/etc. where Hiface doesn't do this as much.  So one may say the Hiface has the better upper detail because the Xonar mid "expression" is covering up some of that higher mid-treble info.  But you keep listening, and you realize, it's so darn close, even Xonar's upper detail sounds far more than adequate and not lacking vs. the Hiface 2, just as the Hiface 2 midrange not as fleshed out is actually fleshed out plenty fine.  Thing I remembered with the Audiophilleo is it had such a razor sharp mid-high range that it literally sounded like my speakers were peaking/honking and it was terribly annoying.  I can see how people with more sugar coated speakers/headphones/etc. would love the Audiophilleo for this kind of character because it certainly does something in this region to "energize" it.  The Audiophilleo is the ONLY device I have heard that actually did what it did in my system...it just did not sound right, especially when every other source was very quite even in terms of not having substantial enough differences to say what is or is not better.  Evo dd the same as the Xonar, more fleshed out, leading to that 3-D sound I think you are talking about probably because it is fleshing out the mids more, similar to vinyl)  But in the end, as I have said previously, it really comes down to what one wants to spend and obviously how each device affects the sound in their system.  For me not really hearing the differences tells me that it is greatly possible the computer is causing the issues...as in, give me a mega buck transport or just a diy transport with all the necessary upgrades to take stock to rock, and I bet this beats out anything in the PC world, though again, I'm  really not convinced since I do have some cdp's around here and they don't do something "special", but simply sound "subtle" in difference from the PC based stuff...so PC is for me, just covenience, and fact that it can sound as good as what I have heard from external transports is good enough for me to know it is plenty fine as a source.  I really do feel that once you get into a very nice dac, particularly one that has a pre-dac), and a very transparent front end, along with very transparent speakers, that source just does not phase me as having anything substantial anymore.  Maybe future will prove wrong and the source will be heard as being something I can indefinitely say makes that kind of change in sound that isn't like changing a KT88 output tube from a JJ to a Sovtek to a Svetlana, etc. etc.)

Cheers and keep up the good work!

 

[realmassy]

 
Quote:

 
The EVO is not perfect for sure, it is just going a little bit farther on my opinion and also with another tonal signature.

 
If you think about what a usb to spdif converter is you realize that such a converter can not have a tonal signature, a timbre or anything like that.
 
The result will always depend on the combination of the converter and the dac. Same converter will sound different on different dacs: how can it possibly sound aggressive, muffled, or harmonic rich?

 

[leeperry]

 
 
Quote:

If you think about what a usb to spdif converter is you realize that such a converter can not have a tonal signature, a timbre or anything like that.
 
The result will always depend on the combination of the converter and the dac. Same converter will sound different on different dacs: how can it possibly sound aggressive, muffled, or harmonic rich?

 
PSU noise? The H2 is following the XMOS datasheet and has a SC4626A SMPS controller from Semtech which has a working freq of
 2.5MHz(http://www.semtech.com/images/datasheet/sc4626.pdf) feeding the XMOS chip itself. We all know how colored SMPS sound like.

 

[realmassy]

 
Quote:

 
 
 
PSU noise? The H2 is following the XMOS datasheet and has a SC4626A SMPS controller from Semtech which has a working freq of
 2.5MHz(http://www.semtech.com/images/datasheet/sc4626.pdf) feeding the XMOS chip itself. We all know how colored SMPS sound like.

 
Interesting. So could that explain a converter sound signature?

 

[MusiqSound]

 
Quote:

For example, the Hiface 2 seems to be more balanced/neutral all in all vs. say, a Xonar ST.  Xonar ST seems to push more midrange/lower midrange/midbass/etc. where Hiface doesn't do this as much....the Hiface 2, just as the Hiface 2 midrange not as fleshed out is actually fleshed out plenty fine.  Thing I remembered with the Audiophilleo is it had such a razor sharp mid-high range that it literally sounded like my speakers were peaking/honking and it was terribly annoying....  For me not really hearing the differences tells me that it is greatly possible the computer is causing the issues...

 
This is very interesting remarks as my own test with Xonar were not that good. I recall about some kind of "projection" on midrange and it was really nice with DVDs, killer with Call of Duty ... but not that much when streaming to the DAC!
 
I think you are right in your analysis when you say that the fleshed feeling comes from additional midrange information out. This is part of the tonal signature of the EVO. It does not sound crystal clear such a Stello or Audiophileo. What you experienced with this one is most probably a wrong selection of USB or S/PDIF cable with your specific electronics... Those two transports are very straight and analytic. Details are sharp but do not annoy only if you have very transparent cabling. This is also the drawback you can observe with modern and top performing equipment... You hear defects easily!
 
Now is computer part of it? I absolutely believe it. Latency results from both OS and playback software. I came to the conclusion after having done a lot of work/tests/debug with Josef from JPlay that these two elements have a HUGE influence as well. It is also what comforted me after I decided to publish a large guide on how to configure the computer for better audio performance (sorry it is in french on my web site).
 
 

 

[Patu]

 
Quote:

 
OT: how do you find the Naim?
This DAC has been forever in my shortlist, but I had never the opportunity to listen to it
 

 
My whole setup is Naim so Naim DAC was a natural choice for me. It offers everything Naim has to offer, great PRaT, punchiness and clarity. It really takes you into the music. Compared to the integrated DAC in Naim SuperNait, it's on a completely different level. Integrated DAC sounds small, muffled and somehow reserved in comparison. There's just more of everything with Naim DAC. I haven't really compared it with other DACs in the same price range. We did compare it to Rega DAC in another Naim setup. Rega held its own and came really close to Naim in sound quality. Considering the price, Rega is a bargain but Naim offerend slightly more in instrument separation and punchiness. 
 
 
Quote:

Hi
 
I have been testing for a week the hiface two and had the chance to compare to hiface 1, EVO and Stello U3. Just finished translating the article, if you want to check.
 
this is a good piece of electronics as far as I have heard. it will most probably please poeple with common equipments, but I find it a little bit short for very good DACs.
 
http://musiq-audiophile.blogspot.fr/2012/04/m2tech-hiface-two-english-version.html
 
regards
musiq
 

 
Could you tell more about the difference between Stello U3 and HiFace 2. I'll probably audition the U3 also when my local dealer gets the shipment.

 

[MusiqSound]

 
Quote:

 
 
My whole setup is Naim so Naim DAC was a natural choice for me. It offers everything Naim has to offer, great PRaT, punchiness and clarity. It really takes you into the music. Compared to the integrated DAC in Naim SuperNait, it's on a completely different level. Integrated DAC sounds small, muffled and somehow reserved in comparison. There's just more of everything with Naim DAC. I haven't really compared it with other DACs in the same price range. We did compare it to Rega DAC in another Naim setup. Rega held its own and came really close to Naim in sound quality. Considering the price, Rega is a bargain but Naim offerend slightly more in instrument separation and punchiness. 
 
 
 
Could you tell more about the difference between Stello U3 and HiFace 2. I'll probably audition the U3 also when my local dealer gets the shipment.

 
 
[size=10pt]My listening experience in regard to Naim DAC was close to yours. I would only be reserved towards your Rega DAC and Naim DAC [/size]comparison. To my ear it was really having a big difference, especially in the perception of the soundstage, details, it was really feeling more “achieved”; When you add the external power supply, it also raise to a new level of quality which cannot be reasonably compared.
 
[size=10pt]Regarding U3 facing hiFace 2, I happen to have the two pieces of equipment at the same time to test; switching from one to another was a bit difficult because they happen to use the same piece of software but not the same version from Thesycon… So to be sure I have added the hiFace EVO in between, compared hiface 2 to EVO, hiface 2 to U3 and EVO to U3. To be honest, even if the components are very close to each other inside (I am preparing the article on the U3 at the moment, I will publish it soon), the hiface 2 does not sound as well as the EVO which itself does not sound the same than the U3 [/size][size=10pt]J[/size][size=10pt]. In the overall, at iso-setup (computer/cables/amp/speakers) the EVO is softer and mellower than hiFace which sounds more “analytic” without the brio of  Antelope or Weiss in this register. The U3, to my ear, gives a cleaner picture than the EVO, especially in details, this is sharper and the planes are sometimes better defined. I find that the EVO is warmer in sound signature than the U3, this last one sounds sharper, one could say “cleaner”... [/size]
 
[size=10pt]So…….This is more a question of taste, in the overall I would say that these products fall in the same range, not especially “better” or “worst”. Depending on my additional tests for my article, I might change of opinion though. If ever I had a wrong setup during my first test session …the second session planned will tell! [/size]
 

 

[WarrenR]

Is anyone having an issue where the HiFace 2 doesn't get recognised by the mac mini after a couple of days?  I'm having to take out the HiFace and put it back into the USB socket to be recognised again.
 
My V-Link never did this.
 
Cheers.

 

[realmassy]

It did happen once or twice so far, nothing major though.

 

[WarrenR]

Yeah its a pain.
 
I might fire off an email to M2Tech.

 

[Audioexcels]

 
Quote:

It did happen once or twice so far, nothing major though.

 
How has your Hiface been sounding and has there been any "break in"?  I'm always suspect of break in, but curious.  As another mentioned, I found some response about adding an Aqvox or other battery? based supply to help improve the sound.  Their experience with the Aqvox on a Hiface 1 was better than the Jkeny modified MK2 unit.

 

[realmassy]

Break-in? obviously none
I can't hear any differences, it sounded great since day 1.
As for the external PSU, I'm curious as well, but I'm not going to be a Guinea Pig...I'm waiting for other people's feedback.