[buldogge]

  Great news!
 
By the way, do you also have the "newest" version of the C3g, the one the rest of us have? If so, it would be interesting to know how the "new" ones and the "newest" ones compare sonically. 

I do...all Siemens...(2) marked 'Post', (2) not...all screen printed cans.  
 
Might be my imagination, but...these C3G "new" seem like they have a little more gain...or perhaps a little more highs/treble presentation, at the least.
 
I'll report more after I modify the adapters and am running both, instead of the one I ran on flying wires.
 
TA
-Mark

 

[TomNC]

@DecentLevi
 
Based on my experience so far, The MAC 4100 is overall a better headphone amp (using the headphone output) than the MK3 in that the former has a large envelop of dynamic ranges and larger sound stage, let alone the convenience of EQ with the buttons. But the modern amps like MK3 can resolve more details though the MAC has enough details for my ears. Thus, I either use the MAC or the MK3, but not both (with one as a preamp). Since I heard clipping from HD-650 driven by the MK3 but not by the MAC, with the same DAC (CEntrance DACport), I thought there was no point using the MK3 as a preamp.
 
I have only limited experience with Mk3 tube rolling: change the stock power tubes to 6N6P-IR which is said to have a life of >10000 hrs.
 
As to driver tubes, I tried a few. The Mullards tend to produce lush, warm sounds, which can be too much for my LCD-3 phones. Then I end up with GE JAN 5654W due to their balanced sound (somewhat warm but also resolving, energetic). Also, they are very cheap on ebay.
 
Now that I start to follow this thread, more choices are open to me, but I would concentrating on HE-6 driven through speak tap of vintage receivers for a while before I invest more on MK3 tube rolling. I need to have a better understanding of whether the clipping I heard from the MK3 is determined by the design of the MK3 or the tubes I have used.

 

[mordy]

Man, I am learning new things all the time... So we have C3g old and C3g new. Let's throw in some more variants:
 
C3b  4V/1.1.A

 
C3c 4V/1.1A

 
C3d 18V/0.24A

 
C3e 18V/0.24A
 

 
C3f 18V/0.24A
 

 
 
 

 
C3g 6.3V/0.37A This is the one we all use
 

 
 
C3g/S 6.3V/0.37A. When the final factory-tests of a C3g revealed a transconductance equal or higher than 105% of the nominal value ( 14000 µmhos), these tubes were marked with the suffix /s. The S is handwritten on the tubes (see below). These are the ones I use - great driver tubes.
 

 
C3m 20V/0.125A
 

 
C3o 6.3V/0,4A
 

i think that this tube has similar electrical characteristics to the C3g but a different pinout (same pinout as C3m).
 
I am only aware of amps that use the C3g and C3m tubes. Does anybody have any experience with the other variants?
 
There are a few more C3 tubes in the alphabet soup, but they are not pentodes and totally different tubes as far as I know.
 
 
 

 

 

[mordy]

Hi TomNC,
 
I may not have understood your post, but you state that you heard clipping using the LD MKIII amp with your headphones. I have clipping many times since I try to turn up the volume on the MKIII as much as I can to get better sound when I use it as a preamp. Different recordings, different tubes and different input sources can produce clipping. The LD MKIII can accommodate tubes that can have amplification factors varying from 2 to 100. The simple remedy is just to turn down the volume control until the clipping disappears.
 
If the distortion does not disappear after turning down the volume, it is most likely a faulty recording.
 
Is there some other factor here that eluded me?

 

[TomNC]

@mordy
 
Thanks for discussion. I am pretty sensitive to clipping and hardened bass. But a considerable portion of music I listen to are rock songs which need certain levels of loudness for impact. With the LD MK3, it often occurs that while the vocals are at right volume I like but some instruments are already hot. This is a primary factor that I sold my Grado RS1i though there are many things I like about the Grado. In comparison, listening from the MAC 4100, the highs can extend a large range without signs of clipping. With the same loudness, the MK3 is far more prone to clipping than the MAC.

 

[SonicTrance]

 That's a lot of C3 tubes Mordy! I only knew about the last three, interesting.  

 

[gibosi]

 
C3o 6.3V/0,4A
 

i think that this tube has similar electrical characteristics to the C3g but a different pinout (same pinout as C3m).

 
And of all the other C3 variants, the C3o is the most suitable for use in our Little Dots. Considering that buldogge is now an expert at building adapters, perhaps he will turn his eyes to a pair of these next.

 

[buldogge]

   
And of all the other C3 variants, the C3o is the most suitable for use in our Little Dots. Considering that buldogge is now an expert at building adapters, perhaps he will turn his eyes to a pair of these next.

Hahaha...I trolled eBay this morning looking for these...prices are no different and there are less of them.  Seems to be a lot of C3Ms out there...
 
If anyone sees the C3G Neu type for sale (missing pin 5), please let me know...I do have (2) back-ups already though, luckily.
 
-Mark

 

[Audiofanboy]

Hi everyone! Sorry again for my long absence... I'd been amp-less for over a year (and away from my home country) and couldn't follow the new trends on this thread, so there was little point in me posting here. But I always kept reading the thread to keep up with the new ideas!
 
I'm finally getting my amp back next week (my folks are coming to visit me in Japan and bringing most of the gear I left behind with them) so I'm back in the game! After reading rb2013's epic 6922 shootout, I bought an $8 holy grail Reflektor 1975 6N23P to celebrate; that should be with me next week too! I'll see how they fare against the Amperex pinched waists.
 
But who still uses 6922 here huh? None of the cool kids, that's for sure...
 
So I need to try some C3G in my amp first. I don't really have time lately to be building adapters and stuff, so here's a question: what's the best way to get 6AK5-C3G adapters? Get them from those shady Chinese sellers on ebay? Wait until some kind soul puts up a classified? Or should I buy all the parts and try making them myself?
 
Another thing I'm wondering about is power tubes. I know everyone says using 6AS7 as power tubes is a huge step-up and glorious and all, but for the time being I'll be using the MK IV as a preamp, so I don't really need all that power. Do you think it's worth getting/making adapters and buying a separate power supply for those too?
 
Sorry about all the questions right off the bat. I feel like a newbie haha... But I should be posting more often I think, I've missed the whole tube rolling thing too much for a year!

 

[gibosi]

  Hi everyone! Sorry again for my long absence... I'd been amp-less for over a year (and away from my home country) and couldn't follow the new trends on this thread, so there was little point in me posting here. But I always kept reading the thread to keep up with the new ideas!
 
I'm finally getting my amp back next week (my folks are coming to visit me in Japan and bringing most of the gear I left behind with them) so I'm back in the game! After reading rb2013's epic 6922 shootout, I bought an $8 holy grail Reflektor 1975 6N23P to celebrate; that should be with me next week too! I'll see how they fare against the Amperex pinched waists.
 
But who still uses 6922 here huh? None of the cool kids, that's for sure...
 
So I need to try some C3G in my amp first. I don't really have time lately to be building adapters and stuff, so here's a question: what's the best way to get 6AK5-C3G adapters? Get them from those shady Chinese sellers on ebay? Wait until some kind soul puts up a classified? Or should I buy all the parts and try making them myself?
 
Another thing I'm wondering about is power tubes. I know everyone says using 6AS7 as power tubes is a huge step-up and glorious and all, but for the time being I'll be using the MK IV as a preamp, so I don't really need all that power. Do you think it's worth getting/making adapters and buying a separate power supply for those too?

 
It's great to have you back!
 
The 75 Reflektor 6N23P is one of my top tubes. My other favorite 9-pin double triodes are E80CC (the old 50's Eindhoven and Hamburg and the early 1970's US-made) and the E182CC (1970's US-made).
 
I personally have had very good luck with the Chinese-made C3g adapters and see no reason not to get a pair. These ready-made adapters will enable you to quickly get a feel for the sound of the C3gs, which I think is the best we can get in the LD. After spending some time with my Glenn OTL, I have come to the conclusion that the LD bias points are much better suited to the C3g than they are to 6SN7, for example.
 
And since I have the 1+, I will have to defer to others about power tubes....

 

[MIKELAP]

  Hi everyone! Sorry again for my long absence... I'd been amp-less for over a year (and away from my home country) and couldn't follow the new trends on this thread, so there was little point in me posting here. But I always kept reading the thread to keep up with the new ideas!
 
I'm finally getting my amp back next week (my folks are coming to visit me in Japan and bringing most of the gear I left behind with them) so I'm back in the game! After reading rb2013's epic 6922 shootout, I bought an $8 holy grail Reflektor 1975 6N23P to celebrate; that should be with me next week too! I'll see how they fare against the Amperex pinched waists.
 
But who still uses 6922 here huh? None of the cool kids, that's for sure...
 
So I need to try some C3G in my amp first. I don't really have time lately to be building adapters and stuff, so here's a question: what's the best way to get 6AK5-C3G adapters? Get them from those shady Chinese sellers on ebay? Wait until some kind soul puts up a classified? Or should I buy all the parts and try making them myself?
 
Another thing I'm wondering about is power tubes. I know everyone says using 6AS7 as power tubes is a huge step-up and glorious and all, but for the time being I'll be using the MK IV as a preamp, so I don't really need all that power. Do you think it's worth getting/making adapters and buying a separate power supply for those too?
 
Sorry about all the questions right off the bat. I feel like a newbie haha... But I should be posting more often I think, I've missed the whole tube rolling thing too much for a year!

 First of all welcome back .man.  Those adapters from China are right around the corner from you shouldnt take long to get them personnally i made my adapters but of course its less trouble to buy them  .About the 6AS7 im shure mordy is going to  encourage you to go for it .i use 6as7 but with a couple of WooAudio amp i have love the look of those tubes .For power tubes on the MK3 these days i use 6SN7 tubes with adapters  sounds good .Take it easy .                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      

 

[Audiofanboy]

Wow, as quick as ever! Thanks for your answers!
 
So I guess I'll just bite the bullet and eventually get a pair of those Chinese adapters, and save myself all the DIY trouble... Just one question to the MK IV or IV SE users: do these adapters fit through the brass rings? I have a faint memory I read they didn't...
 
Now I just have to find some nice C3Gs to go with those. ebay seems to be running out of cheap ones too. Anyone want to part with a pair?
 
Quote:

   
It's great to have you back!
 
The 75 Reflektor 6N23P is one of my top tubes. My other favorite 9-pin double triodes are E80CC (the old 50's Eindhoven and Hamburg and the early 1970's US-made) and the E182CC (1970's US-made).
 
I personally have had very good luck with the Chinese-made C3g adapters and see no reason not to get a pair. These ready-made adapters will enable you to quickly get a feel for the sound of the C3gs, which I think is the best we can get in the LD. After spending some time with my Glenn OTL, I have come to the conclusion that the LD bias points are much better suited to the C3g than they are to 6SN7, for example.
 
And since I have the 1+, I will have to defer to others about power tubes....

 
 

   First of all welcome back .man.  Those adapters from China are right around the corner from you shouldnt take long to get them personnally i made my adapters but of course its less trouble to buy them  .About the 6AS7 im shure mordy is going to  encourage you to go for it .i use 6as7 but with a couple of WooAudio amp i have love the look of those tubes .For power tubes on the MK3 these days i use 6SN7 tubes with adapters  sounds good .Take it easy .                                                     

 

[superdux]

hi Audiofanboy,
 
yes i'd also like to know how the 75s compare to your Amperex pinched waists because i couldn't afford them thats why I'm eager to listen to the 75s grey shield kwtubes just sent me. I'm rolling a 73 ATM. And yes i concur with Gibosi when he says he hasn't heard anything better than the C3Gs. But hopefully i will also be able to claim the Voskhods as so called Holy Grails.
As for those chinese adapters i had them fail on me twice so i would consider asking someone tech savy (looks around in the forum) if he can build you some. I can only talk of the one Chinese seller who's name I forgot.(something with happy in it).
Oh and i stated the prices i saw those 75 grey shield 6N23P Voskhods go for and i have to correct myself: that was 159$ for a matched pair.

 

[Audiofanboy]

But even if the "HG" 6N23P tube was better than the 6922 PW, I think I would still keep the PW, as they really do something no other tube I've owned does. rb2013 talked about "flow", the ability to draw you in a magical musical world for hours on end, and the PW did that better than any other tube. Still, I'm really curious about the 6N23P!
 
I guess I got lucky about the price. I just read rb2013's shootout, was like "oh, let's take a look on ebay and have ourselves a good laugh" and bam, found one tube for 8 bucks... Just goes to show.
 
I see what you mean about those ebay adapters. Indeed one seller, happy something, sells adapters made from chopped up tubes, while the other seller seems more legit.

 

[Shaffer]

 First of all welcome back .man.  Those adapters from China are right around the corner from you shouldnt take long to get them personnally i made my adapters but of course its less trouble to buy them  .About the 6AS7 im shure mordy is going to  encourage you to go for it .i use 6as7 but with a couple of WooAudio amp i have love the look of those tubes .For power tubes on the MK3 these days i use 6SN7 tubes with adapters  sounds good .Take it easy .                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      

Mike, are the 6SN7s plug and play with the adapters on a LDIII, or is there more involved?