[stemplar]

http://www.esstech.com/index.php?cID=419
 
,,..The ES9218’s integrated DAC supports up to 32-bit 384 kHz PCM and DSD512 data in master or slave timing modes...,,
poweramp alpha 3 (my FAVORITE with the HighGain trick )  , Neutron , ....And much more

 

[Sound Eq]

ok now its over and the software changed from 10b to 10c, in the summary it said that phone functionality will be improved
 
wonder what is meant by that, it was a 500 mb update
 
about 10 day ago there was also a 500 mb update but did not look if the software changed when it was installed

 

[koluludome]

http://www.esstech.com/index.php?cID=419


,,..The ES9218’s integrated DAC supports up to 32-bit 384 kHz PCM and DSD512 data in master or slave timing modes...,,
poweramp alpha 3 (my FAVORITE with the HighGain trick )  , Neutron , ....And much more

Dac is supported but android limit and downsampling signal eventhough the sound is processed in DAC but the signal was limited by android SRC

 

[koluludome]

ok now its over and the software changed from 10b to 10c, in the summary it said that phone functionality will be improved

wonder what is meant by that, it was a 500 mb update

about 10 day ago there was also a 500 mb update but did not look if the software changed when it was installed

Have update for two days ago for my model h990ds

All the description is said about the system, nothing for what we hope

At least we can have more stable software which will not overheat our phone like lg g4 software problem

 

[jt25741]

  Okay, my V10 died today, so I'm getting an H990DS V20.
 
I've read through the last 30 pages, and I'm confused.  Does the V20 play 16-bit 44.1kHz files natively?  If so, with which apps?  Thanks in advance for answering.

 
Review a bit here: The way Delta Sigma DACs or variants on bitstream technology --- no PCM files ever play natively.      In a perfect world, what happens with a modern DAC like the ESS Quad DAC is it is upsampled first, to 4X input frequency.  In your case it is 44.1/16 Red Book type file is upsampled X 4 = 176.4Hz by DAC.   It is also padded to 32 bit, from 16bit  at the same time.     Then 8X oversampling occurs, and conversion to DSD/Delta Sigma type format then continues which is not PCM anymore, and further filtered.     It is heavily processed before it is Analog, within the same chips.
 
The only thing that is different in the case of Android is, the OS upsamples the 44.1 to 48khz before input to the DAC     So Android does 44.1 -> 48, then DAC does its 4X upsample so 48Khz ->  192Khz.       Everything else is the same.   What is wrong with this?  Not much IMO, especially if you use something like PlayerPro DSP plugin with Sox resampler set to 48Khz.    WIth Sox doing the upsampling, it does a  much clearer job, with proper filtering --- versus a decimation and crude treatment the OS would do.   When Android sees a 48Khz stream, it passes it through.    So fidelity can be optimized here with SOX.    The 48Khz issue is pervasive, and effects FireOS/Amazon and all android based devices.     I hope there are some ways around it ultimately with OS improvements.    For Hi-Res support, over 48Khz...like 96Khz and above, those files are also converted back down to 48Khz.     Best to use SOX to do this, not the OS.      But Hi-Res files are rare vs CD quality as in your example.   Playing back Greater than CD quality music on V20 is not straight forward or even possible right now.
 
The 44.1 -> 48Khz upsampling is not super easy, as it is not a multiple like 2X, 4X etc...... Best fidelity would be let the DAC take 44.1 directly and do 4X upsampling on it.      The extra step in Android from 44.1->48Hz in a purest perspective is not optimal, but the merits of the ESS DAC design, and integrated headphone amp all matter much much more than this triviality.       I am floored by the V20, and think it sounds fantastic for any phone and most media players I have heard.

 

[ZMan2k2]

Thank you for such a clear and concise answer.  It answers my question beautifully.

 

[koluludome]

Thanks for clarify with such a great review.
Agree with the sound impression. Axon7 is sound good too but for overall performance I choose v20 instead

 

[eio]

it's more complicated than that, android does provide ways to feed data stream directly to dac without resample.
but that doesn't mean it's easy to support every data format, lots of work still need to be done, and they are mostly dependent on the implementation of platform vendors (qualcomm) and codec vendors (ess).
 
and app support is also a problem, being N doesn't help in this regard. the good news is, we can expect great improvements in the future 

 

 

[acoletti]

So, something that did not work in the past now works, and I hear a significant improvement.  In PlayerPro with DSP pack disabled, I was unable to play DSD/DSF files which made me beleive that the DAC was not being utilized for sure.   Today I received an Update on my ATT H910 version and it now works.  Seems like the frequency response is correct at lower db as well as the overall ability to drive my Audeze e7's has greatly improved.  I have not connected this to an external source to see what the bitrate really is, but the player is not DSP enabled and is playing at the DSD bitstream.  In the past, when I had the DSP pack disabled, I was unable to play the DSF files, invalid format and such.  

 

[acoletti]

  it's more complicated than that, android does provide ways to feed data stream directly to dac without resample.
but that doesn't mean it's easy to support every data format, lots of work still need to be done, and they are mostly dependent on the implementation of platform vendors (qualcomm) and codec vendors (ess).
 
and app support is also a problem, being N doesn't help in this regard. the good news is, we can expect great improvements in the future 

 

 
Unless it can, I know the Onkio DX-1 DAP does pass direct DSD decoding to the internal sabra dac.  

 

[Sound Eq]

sp does player pro with the dsp not down sample
 
what settings do you use in dsp player pro

 

[Dellwolf]

So, something that did not work in the past now works, and I hear a significant improvement.  In PlayerPro with DSP pack disabled, I was unable to play DSD/DSF files which made me beleive that the DAC was not being utilized for sure.   Today I received an Update on my ATT H910 version and it now works.  Seems like the frequency response is correct at lower db as well as the overall ability to drive my Audeze e7's has greatly improved.  I have not connected this to an external source to see what the bitrate really is, but the player is not DSP enabled and is playing at the DSD bitstream.  In the past, when I had the DSP pack disabled, I was unable to play the DSF files, invalid format and such.  

Did you mean to say Audeze EL-8?

 

[TJ Max]

Review a bit here: The way Delta Sigma DACs or variants on bitstream technology --- no PCM files ever play natively.      In a perfect world, what happens with a modern DAC like the ESS Quad DAC is it is upsampled first, to 4X input frequency.  In your case it is 44.1/16 Red Book type file is upsampled X 4 = 176.4Hz by DAC.   It is also padded to 32 bit, from 16bit  at the same time.     Then 8X oversampling occurs, and conversion to DSD/Delta Sigma type format then continues which is not PCM anymore, and further filtered.     It is heavily processed before it is Analog, within the same chips.

The only thing that is different in the case of Android is, the OS upsamples the 44.1 to 48khz before input to the DAC     So Android does 44.1 -> 48, then DAC does its 4X upsample so 48Khz ->  192Khz.       Everything else is the same.   What is wrong with this?  Not much IMO, especially if you use something like PlayerPro DSP plugin with Sox resampler set to 48Khz.    WIth Sox doing the upsampling, it does a  much clearer job, with proper filtering --- versus a decimation and crude treatment the OS would do.   When Android sees a 48Khz stream, it passes it through.    So fidelity can be optimized here with SOX.    The 48Khz issue is pervasive, and effects FireOS/Amazon and all android based devices.     I hope there are some ways around it ultimately with OS improvements.    For Hi-Res support, over 48Khz...like 96Khz and above, those files are also converted back down to 48Khz.     Best to use SOX to do this, not the OS.      But Hi-Res files are rare vs CD quality as in your example.   Playing back Greater than CD quality music on V20 is not straight forward or even possible right now.

The 44.1 -> 48Khz upsampling is not super easy, as it is not a multiple like 2X, 4X etc...... Best fidelity would be let the DAC take 44.1 directly and do 4X upsampling on it.      The extra step in Android from 44.1->48Hz in a purest perspective is not optimal, but the merits of the ESS DAC design, and integrated headphone amp all matter much much more than this triviality.       I am floored by the V20, and think it sounds fantastic for any phone and most media players I have heard.

Do you think its good to leave the 32 bit output on in playerpro?

 

[RockStar2005]

Order this. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KE5NJ7W?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage

Connect this first to the jack stick and then the IE 80 into this. It will trigger aux mode and give you more than enough power and great audio. I use it with the V10.

Hey stenog,

So connect it to phone first and then headphones?

Also.......will this work on regular headphones too?

Thanks.

 

[jagwap]

Hey stenog,

So connect it to phone first and then headphones?

Also.......will this work on regular headphones too?

Thanks.

It should.

My current workaround is a 3.5mm splitter: 1 x 3.5mm plug into 2 x 3.5mm sockets. I cut off the 2nd socket and replaced it with 2 SMT 470ohm resistors to ground, one on each channel. Covered it all in heatshink and hotmelt. Now I get high inpedance mode without a volume control in the way.