[Lazostat]

I wanna buy a new smartphone and i like the music capabilities most. But i wanna listen music while running and with the classic headphones i have now its not comfortable. I will buy bluetooth headphones. So from what i know the dac cant be transferred. Does it still have a good sound quality even with bluetooth mode, compared to other phones? Should i look for something else?

I like the price ( below 400 euros ) and the dimensions..


There are many that report bad or wrong sound :

https://www.reddit.com/r/lgg6/comments/652l7v/lg_g6_bluetooth_audio_quality/
https://www.reddit.com/r/lgg6/comments/6bkjp8/g6_audio_over_bluetooth/
http://www.lg.com/uk/support/product-help/CT00008356-20150332135127-others
https://forum.xda-developers.com/sprint-g6/help/poor-bluetooth-audio-quality-t3626949


Maybe i wont listen music through bluetooth in the end..

 

[vver]

I have a sennheiser HD 598 which is 50 ohms and comes with a 6.3 mm to 3.5 mm adapter to connect to a standard 3.5 mm jack.Will this on its own trigger the hi impedence mode?
If I use the hack of using a headphone splitter to trigger the external audio mode for low impedence headphones PX 100 II and AT M40X will this make these low impedence headphones sound better.

Also if the Quad DAC always results in superior sound why does LG not just let people select this themselves? What is the logic behind denying access to Quad DAC for a lot of headphones which people are likely to have for portable listening?

 

[maxxevv]

Think there is some confusion. A DAC is a digital analogue/audio convertor, it converts your digital media into analogue signals to your headphone jack. That's just the converted signal.
Then, there is the amplifier, it takes this signal and 'amplifies' it to a higher power output to match the power requirements of the output device.

As far its been mentioned, the Quad DAC is on as long as you set it on.

The difference really is the amount of amplification which the phone drives based on the impedance of the device connected.

So even at 16ohms, the DAC is on. Just that it does not push the amplification power required for higher impedance. So when you 'bluff' the phone with a splitter or connector, the phone just pushes a higher current/ power output through the headphone jack. The DAC is on, regardless.

The problem with doing the above is that some earphones are very power sensitive, and coercing the phone into a higher output mode may mean it delivering higher current/ voltages than what the earphone can take and in the process damaging it.

The 50 Ohm impedance is also dependent on rating of your headphone and how its done. Whether it refers to its 'maximum impedance' or it 'mean average impedance'. My Vivo XE800 earphones are rated at 51 Ohms ( I've not measured it personally yet) but it doesn't invoke the high impedance mode on my G6.

 

[vver]

Think there is some confusion. A DAC is a digital analogue/audio convertor, it converts your digital media into analogue signals to your headphone jack. That's just the converted signal.
Then, there is the amplifier, it takes this signal and 'amplifies' it to a higher power output to match the power requirements of the output device.

As far its been mentioned, the Quad DAC is on as long as you set it on.

The difference really is the amount of amplification which the phone drives based on the impedance of the device connected.

So even at 16ohms, the DAC is on. Just that it does not push the amplification power required for higher impedance. So when you 'bluff' the phone with a splitter or connector, the phone just pushes a higher current/ power output through the headphone jack. The DAC is on, regardless.

The problem with doing the above is that some earphones are very power sensitive, and coercing the phone into a higher output mode may mean it delivering higher current/ voltages than what the earphone can take and in the process damaging it.

The 50 Ohm impedance is also dependent on rating of your headphone and how its done. Whether it refers to its 'maximum impedance' or it 'mean average impedance'. My Vivo XE800 earphones are rated at 51 Ohms ( I've not measured it personally yet) but it doesn't invoke the high impedance mode on my G6.

So since I don't really have high impedance headphones will I be better off going with HTC 10(SD 820 is marginally slower than 821 and HTC generally has better build quality) and if the price drops Sony XZ Premium?

 

[drftr]

Like maxxevv I'm either buying the G6 (the Plus version) or the HTC 10. But I have just added the new LG Q8 to that list, which basically is a smaller version of the V20 (already sold in Japan as the V20 Pro or the V34) with the same quad DAC as the G6+ and the V20. I'd be very happy if members could share the potential difference in sound quality through headphones between the V20/G6 and the HTC 10 to come to a final decision.

Concerning the single DAC / quad DAC / amplifier confusion I think you should read as follows, but please correct me if I'm wrong:

The amplifier is split into 2 parts: a pre amplifier and a power amplifier. Every DAC has it's own built-in pre amplifier, and the ONLY thing the power amplifier is doing is amplify ANY incoming signal say only once to make things easy. This means that if you have an easy to drive earphone it is happy with the single signal of the pre amplifier of 1 single DAC. If however you have power hungry earphones or headphones that have a very high resistance, without any tricks the power amplifier would have to be much bigger to drive those cans. A bigger power amplifier would make the telephone bigger, much more power hungry and could even lead to heat issues.

The trick around this is to keep the power amp amplifying only once BUT increase its incoming signal. But that solution would mean using the pre amplifier of the single DAC in overdrive which will cause its own problems. Solution number 3: Amplify the incoming signal by multiplying its sources! In this way if difficult to drive cans are connected your smartphone decides it needs to activate FOUR single DAC's with their FOUR pre amplifiers (all of those 8 parts with exactly the same top quality), bundle their signals, and deliver it to the power amp. Issue solved!

For that reason I'd say there is no quality gain to be had by using 4 vs 1 DAC / pre amplifier combinations. And please don't confuse sound quality with how loud the signal is. Also, if you're using an equalizer to distort the sound in a way you like the end result better (not my personal cup of tea) these monsters may or may not react differently to the loudness of the incoming signal, which is the (bundled) signal(s) of the pre amplifier(s). What I'm trying to say with this is that if you're not using the purist signal possible when somehow comparing single DAC vs quad DAC you may very likely only be reviewing how the equalizer is responding to the different incoming signals.

Hope this helps...

But please don't forget about our G6 (+) HTC 10 question...

 

[drftr]

Like maxxevv I'm either buying the G6 (the Plus version) or the HTC 10. But I have just added the new LG Q8 to that list, which basically is a smaller version of the V20 (already sold in Japan as the V20 Pro or the V34) with the same quad DAC as the G6+ and the V20. I'd be very happy if members could share the potential difference in sound quality through headphones between the V20/G6 and the HTC 10 to come to a final decision.

Concerning the single DAC / quad DAC / amplifier confusion I think you should read as follows, but please correct me if I'm wrong:

The amplifier is split into 2 parts: a pre amplifier and a power amplifier. Every DAC has it's own built-in pre amplifier, and the ONLY thing the power amplifier is doing is amplify ANY incoming signal say only once to make things easy. This means that if you have an easy to drive earphone it is happy with the single signal of the pre amplifier of 1 single DAC. If however you have power hungry earphones or headphones that have a very high resistance, without any tricks the power amplifier would have to be much bigger to drive those cans. A bigger power amplifier would make the telephone bigger, much more power hungry and could even lead to heat issues.

The trick around this is to keep the power amp amplifying only once BUT increase its incoming signal. But that solution would mean using the pre amplifier of the single DAC in overdrive which will cause its own problems. Solution number 3: Amplify the incoming signal by multiplying its sources! In this way if difficult to drive cans are connected your smartphone decides it needs to activate FOUR single DAC's with their FOUR pre amplifiers (all of those 8 parts with exactly the same top quality), bundle their signals, and deliver it to the power amp. Issue solved!

For that reason I'd say there is no quality gain to be had by using 4 vs 1 DAC / pre amplifier combinations. And please don't confuse sound quality with how loud the signal is. Also, if you're using an equalizer to distort the sound in a way you like the end result better (not my personal cup of tea) these monsters may or may not react differently to the loudness of the incoming signal, which is the (bundled) signal(s) of the pre amplifier(s). What I'm trying to say with this is that if you're not using the purist signal possible when somehow comparing single DAC vs quad DAC you may very likely only be reviewing how the equalizer is responding to the different incoming signals.

Hope this helps...

But please don't forget about our G6 (+) HTC 10 question...

 

[jagwap]

On the Quad DAC and amplification aspects, it seems no one is entirely clear on how this is working, even if they sound sure.

Here's my educated guess: hifi mode means the ESS DAC and amplifier is being used rather than the Qualcomm one. The different output/impedance modes affect both the DAC and the amp. In normal mode it sees low impedance headphones, which do not usually need high voltage output as they are generally more sensitive than high impedance ones. So full volume is only 0.44V rms (coincidence that this is around the EU limit?). However their sensitivity means they also good at making noise audable.

Here's where the Quad DAC comes in. Adding DACs in parallel is not new. Each time you double the number of DACs you add 3dB dynamic range, which is good. However the subtlety behind this is that the output doubles (6dB) while the noise increases by only 1.413 (3dB), the difference is the improvement: 3dB. But notice the noise goes up, which would be bad for sensitive headphones. In high impedance mode it is likely to be twice as noisy with all four DACs on, but that won't matter much in high impedance lower sensitivity headphones. External is half way between the two at 1V rms.

So each mode step has increased output. To achive this the amp will need higher voltage rails. In a phone it is not simple to output the 1.9Vrms of high impedance mode. A special power supply is needed, and as nothing is perfect it will drain more power. So the high impedance mode is only there when needed to minimise battery drain.

So do you need all four DACs on? Up to you, but the most sensite IEMs may be a bit noisy, and the extra output cannot be used unless you want hearing damage.

For me I have Audeze Sines and Oppo PM3, and the Audeze really needs high impedance mode on my more dynamic music.

 

[Guppy_]

I wonder if this is the case with the LG G6:

http://www.androidauthority.com/lg-v20-quad-dac-explained-713587/


The Quad DAC’s low power mode shuts down three of the four DACs when they’re not needed, to increase battery life when playing lower quality audio or using lower quality headsets. – Ken Hong, global communications director for LG

Granted it's for the v20, but probably applies for the g6

 

[V10V10]

Hi guys, I recently bought G6+ version with 128GB storage and the Quad DAC after my V10 had a sudden death.

I have Audiotechnica R70x and Beyerdynamic A20 amp which was amazing combination with V10 and also now on G6. I am wondering what mode should I use for essentially an analogue out to the A20 amp? High impedance or external mode?And what volume would be appropriate, I tried 50, 60 and 75 with not much difference in the sound from A20. Am I in danger of overloading input by using max volume from the G6?

Listening to Tidal Hi-Fi quality all the time.

 

[maxxevv]

I would say use "External Device", since that's what its designed for.

As for volume, never tried connecting my G6 to an Amp yet, but I would think 50% from the G6 is safe and anyway, its the job of the external amp to pump up the power, not that of the phone if its to be used as a DAC/DAP device.

 

[V10V10]

Yes, External device makes sense, but then it would be a line out level signal, not the amplified one? I am not sure about this, but yes G6 is now a preamp in my case.

 

[artpiggo]

I always use 100% volume when use smartphone/DAP as a source connecting line out to external amp.

 

[maxxevv]

Really depends on your phone.

The G6 has an external device mode that really ramps up the output signal, so may not be necessary in this case.

 

[Guppy_]

is there any way non-root to get around the 75 volume limit?

 

[king conan]

That's not a limit. 75 means max volume.

If you need more volume to have to use the external mode but 75 is again the max.