[idvsego]

 
Quote:

 
I caution against one of your points, though.... upgrading video cards *DOES* give you very tangible, real and definitley measurable benefits if you go from a pair that is old and outdated to a new cutting edge card, and yes this does translate into a different and objectively better gameplay experience.
 
The same cannot necessarily be said of going from a $200 headphone to a $1000 one or adding a $500 amp into the chain.

But goign from a $400 video card to a $800 video card usually only adds benchmark numbers, not real world benefits.  $100 to $300 huge difference.  but going from a $5 IEM to a $50 is big too.  Its the basic principle of diminishing return.

 

[estreeter]

Resurrecting this old thread for a couple of reasons:
 
1. When I read it 2 years ago, it made a lot of sense. I have to ask if the improvements in portable kit over that (relatively short) timeframe have negated some of the OPs objections.
 
2. I thought he made an especially good point about LOD cables costing ludicrous amounts of money, and there really were very few choices 2 years ago.
 
3. I cant help feeling that some of us are still making the same mistakes he highlighted in that original post.
 
Please try to separate religious beliefs from your thoughts when replying, and remember that its all in the name of getting the most bang for our buck. This isnt meant to be an attack on those who have invested a lot of money in portable kit - I certainly dont have a Woo WA22 and a pair of orthos on my bedside table - but it might strike a chord with someone just starting to spend a little more than they had originally planned.
 
Peace out
 
estreeter

 

[Kubernetes]

An interesting post.  I admittedly gave up on portable hifi years ago.  The fact is that ambient sound will render moot all your efforts to squeeze that last bit of SQ out of your equipment.  And let's face it, carrying a portable amp is unwieldy.  You have extra cables, a separate volume control, likely you've got the whole rig strapped together like a brick and  you're driving these ludicrously expensive IEMs out of it (and everything still goes to poop every time a truck drives by).  I've pretty much settled on "good enough" when mobile because the amount of cash it requires to get a smidgen more quality is insane.  As of now my portable rig is my Samsung Vibrant (which sounds excellent, btw) and ESW9s.  It's good sound and convenient, and I'm happy for the time being.

 

[GeorgeGoodman]

I love this thread. The OP is obviously making some extreme claims, but there is much truth is what he says. Spending a crazy amount of money on an LOD you use for portable use is not a good use of money at all, especially when I see how much I could make one for myself. But things are getting much more convenient and Hifiman has put out three players that have great amps inside them, as the OP stated would be practical. A lot has change in a few years.

 

[GreatDane]

Quote:

Resurrecting this old thread for a couple of reasons:
 
*

Good observation.
 
My 6 G Nano/Pico Slim is really treating me to some fine sound. It doesn't get much smaller than that.

 

[crumpler]

 
Agreed! It's just my iPhone4 and SM3s now when i do decide to go portable. Money is much better spent on the home rig IMO. 
 
Quote:

An interesting post.  I admittedly gave up on portable hifi years ago.  The fact is that ambient sound will render moot all your efforts to squeeze that last bit of SQ out of your equipment.  And let's face it, carrying a portable amp is unwieldy.  You have extra cables, a separate volume control, likely you've got the whole rig strapped together like a brick and  you're driving these ludicrously expensive IEMs out of it (and everything still goes to poop every time a truck drives by).  I've pretty much settled on "good enough" when mobile because the amount of cash it requires to get a smidgen more quality is insane.  As of now my portable rig is my Samsung Vibrant (which sounds excellent, btw) and ESW9s.  It's good sound and convenient, and I'm happy for the time being.

 

[violinvirtuoso]

Though I agree with the OP for the most part, using a "portable rig" has become easier nowadays. LODs can be had for $10, and can be made for even less. You can also get super small, custom made LODs pretty cheap as well. Portable amps are also getting slimmer and smaller. Just look at the trend in new amps: RSA Shadow, ALO Rx (1/2), Headstage Arrow, Pico Slim, etc. Though I agree that it isn't worth it (in terms of dollar value), the size factor is starting to go away.

 

[freeky1]

Wow, how did I ever miss this thread before now?  This has become my favorite thread ever!  So many things that I agree with.  I had been wrestling with the idea of an amp, but I am honestly satisfied with the sound straight out of my J3,  Whether I'm running my Grados or my Audio Technicas or my Monsters, the sound always puts a smile on my face.  I just couldn't bring myself to lay down $300+ for what seem to be very large, heavy, low-tech devices.  Now I know why.  Because no matter how hard you try...no matter how much you spend...no matter how much weight you are willing to tote around, the sound that you get from a "portable rig" will never even come close to the sound that you can get from a reasonably priced home rig.  While the introduction of devices like the Hifiman hm-801 may combine a quality PDAP and amplifier into one unit, the Hifiman hm-801 is so ridiculously huge that I am afraid that it would stay at home with my iPad most of the time.  It's too large to carry around all the time.  And don't even get me started on the high dollar LODs and mini to minis...nothing but snake oil!

 

[estreeter]

1. No argument re LOD cables, or cables in general - but that extends well into the fullsize arena. As far as the cost of parts to make a portable amp, thats the same argument that says that Microsoft Office should cost no more than the retail price of a DVD plus P&H. Open Office  (and others Open Source solutions) has been a viable free alternative for years, but we still have customers walk into our store and pay full freight for MS Office - go figure.
 
2. A good pair of headphones is a good pair of headphones, whether you are wearing them in a hotel room or on a bus. Its the rest of the 'portable rig' which the OP seems to question.
 
3. I would argue that DAPs have improved by a significant margin, but then I have never owned a *Mod anything. Those who want to persist with 10+year old Portable CDPs and tote the CDs around with them are welcome to it - IMO, that is as silly as anything else the OP is referring to in his rant.
 
4. End of the day, it all comes back to the Lisa III. With the (recommended) PSU and shipping, I believe thats a thousand dollar purchase (happy to hear otherwise). I would dearly love to read a comparison between the Lisa III and a fullsize equivalent, Even two years ago, I think the OP could have solved many of his issues simply by passing on his portable amp purchases in favour of a good fullsize amp - he didnt, and a lot of his post reads like regret, pure and simple.
 
Personally, I havent given up on the concept of a good transportable rig that I could lay out in a hotel anywhere in the world without the need for a power adapter. For those who have different priorities, its a no-brainer to spend the money on your 'home' rig or, as one HFier already pointed out, is there a law that says you cant have both ?

 

[freeky1]

Quote:

1. No argument re LOD cables, or cables in general - but that extends well into the fullsize arena. As far as the cost of parts to make a portable amp, thats the same argument that says that Microsoft Office should cost no more than the retail price of a DVD plus P&H. Open Office  (and others Open Source solutions) has been a viable free alternative for years, but we still have customers walk into our store and pay full freight for MS Office - go figure.
 
2. A good pair of headphones is a good pair of headphones, whether you are wearing them in a hotel room or on a bus. Its the rest of the 'portable rig' which the OP seems to question.
 
3. I would argue that DAPs have improved by a significant margin, but then I have never owned a *Mod anything. Those who want to persist with 10+year old Portable CDPs and tote the CDs around with them are welcome to it - IMO, that is as silly as anything else the OP is referring to in his rant.
 
4. End of the day, it all comes back to the Lisa III. With the (recommended) PSU and shipping, I believe thats a thousand dollar purchase (happy to hear otherwise). I would dearly love to read a comparison between the Lisa III and a fullsize equivalent, Even two years ago, I think the OP could have solved many of his issues simply by passing on his portable amp purchases in favour of a good fullsize amp - he didnt, and a lot of his post reads like regret, pure and simple.
 
Personally, I havent given up on the concept of a good transportable rig that I could lay out in a hotel anywhere in the world without the need for a power adapter. For those who have different priorities, its a no-brainer to spend the money on your 'home' rig or, as one HFier already pointed out, is there a law that says you cant have both ?

Agreed!  I have decided that my portable rig will consist of my Cowon J3, a decent pair of headphones, and a (cheap Monster) mini to mini interconnect to attach my J3 to my stereo in my truck.

 

[LevA]

Quote:

 
Personally, I havent given up on the concept of a good transportable rig that I could lay out in a hotel anywhere in the world without the need for a power adapter. For those who have different priorities, its a no-brainer to spend the money on your 'home' rig or, as one HFier already pointed out, is there a law that says you cant have both ?

 
this...
 
portable rig: 

 
 
but I could not do without my transportable rig..and that is at home out in the balcony, a quiet cafe, hotel room, on extended trips etc..
 

just a 240gb ipod video coupled with TTVJ portable hybrid..as close to tube sound you can get on portable. 

 

[GeorgeGoodman]

Quote:

1. No argument re LOD cables, or cables in general - but that extends well into the fullsize arena. As far as the cost of parts to make a portable amp, thats the same argument that says that Microsoft Office should cost no more than the retail price of a DVD plus P&H. Open Office  (and others Open Source solutions) has been a viable free alternative for years, but we still have customers walk into our store and pay full freight for MS Office - go figure.
 
2. A good pair of headphones is a good pair of headphones, whether you are wearing them in a hotel room or on a bus. Its the rest of the 'portable rig' which the OP seems to question.
 
3. I would argue that DAPs have improved by a significant margin, but then I have never owned a *Mod anything. Those who want to persist with 10+year old Portable CDPs and tote the CDs around with them are welcome to it - IMO, that is as silly as anything else the OP is referring to in his rant.
 
4. End of the day, it all comes back to the Lisa III. With the (recommended) PSU and shipping, I believe thats a thousand dollar purchase (happy to hear otherwise). I would dearly love to read a comparison between the Lisa III and a fullsize equivalent, Even two years ago, I think the OP could have solved many of his issues simply by passing on his portable amp purchases in favour of a good fullsize amp - he didnt, and a lot of his post reads like regret, pure and simple.
 
Personally, I havent given up on the concept of a good transportable rig that I could lay out in a hotel anywhere in the world without the need for a power adapter. For those who have different priorities, its a no-brainer to spend the money on your 'home' rig or, as one HFier already pointed out, is there a law that says you cant have both ?

I have to disagree. The RSA SR71B, and the Ibasso PB1 and PB2 are more powerful than the Lisa III, and at least one of them (the SR71B) has been declared better sounding by Skylab. Their prices are, respectively, $650, $229, and $325. That is a far cry from a thousand. 
 
Yes, they are all balanced. But balancing a headphone is not that expensive. You can probably get someone on head-fi to balance any headphone for about $50-60, and you can do it for much less if you do it yourself. The Lisa III is near the top of the heap when it comes to portables, but I believe there are better options now.
 
This thread is really about the practicality of a portable rig. I do not have a portable amp yet, but I plan to get one. Size and the "inconvenience" does not bother me nearly as much as it did the OP or many others in this thread. At the end of the day, spending your money wisely is always a good thing, and demeaning somebody else's decision to have a nice portable rig will get you nowhere. Especially with the great amps coming out today, the gap between desktop and portable performance rapidly closing. The Ibasso potables can power almost any headphone, even the HE-6 and K1000, to very near the limit of their capabilities or slightly below, in the case of the PB1. You can probably find a desktop amp that can do that for around the same price, but it might be hard.
 
BTW, very nice rigs above, LevA. I love the look of the transportable one especially. 

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

 The Lisa III is not top of the heap anymore when it comes to portables.   
  I do not have a portable amp yet, but I plan to get one.
 
 

 
You've quoted Skylab's opinion of the SR71B and ignored his opinion of the Lisa III. You haven't heard any of these amps, but you know they are all on par with fullsize amps based on their quoted specs. O-kay.
 
George, you are the person that Luminette wrote this thread for. I really don't need you to list the asking price for various portables - thanks for your time.

 

[estreeter]

Nice rig, LevA. Eminently transportable.

 

[GeorgeGoodman]

The last thing I want is a stupid fight like most of this thread is. I have taken what I know from members such as Jamato and Hiflight who have good home amps as well as the HE-6 and K1000. Go look in the PB2 thread. I agree the Lisa III is powerful and nice, but it seems expensive and outdated to me. It not being top of the heap was too strong, and I edited it out. However, Mike, (the guy who runs headfonia.com) says in the comments in the PB1 unboxing thread that he tried the Lisa III with the HE-5 and got distortion at medium volume. Hiflight has stated he can run the HE-6, a much more demanding headphone than the HE-5, from the PB2 so well it is almost the same as his speaker amp. The Lisa III is very nice, but to my eyes and brain it doesn't match up to the competition in price, size, or performance.
 
I admit I haven't heard any of the amps I talk about, but I am just trying to get a sense of perspective. I can do that with members I trust on head-fi. If you think differently, I would like to hear what you have to say.