[chickenmoon]

what if i was now?

Good Lord, help us...

 

[Mus1c]

Good Lord, help us...

hahaha

 

[Shadowsora]

I am trying to find a smooth analytical iem to step up from ATR, I have a lot of treble cannons which are really well perceived by most people but I am not really into this signature, anyone has a recommendation?
 
I don't plan to buy it immediately so my budget can go up to 90$(Euros actually).

 

[CoiL]

  I am trying to find a smooth analytical iem to step up from ATR, I have a lot of treble cannons which are really well perceived by most people but I am not really into this signature, anyone has a recommendation?
 
I don't plan to buy it immediately so my budget can go up to 90$(Euros actually).

I actually have something that has little better details/clarity/separation than ATR but also has better soundstage size and imaging than 5th gen ATE... but... this IEM is still under developement and can`t tell about it, yet

 

[crabdog]

  I am trying to find a smooth analytical iem to step up from ATR, I have a lot of treble cannons which are really well perceived by most people but I am not really into this signature, anyone has a recommendation?
 
I don't plan to buy it immediately so my budget can go up to 90$(Euros actually).

That sounds how people have been describing the Tennmak Cello.
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/757838/tennmak/765#post_13235642

 

[Shawn71]

I actually have something that has little better details/clarity/separation than ATR but also has better soundstage size and imaging than 5th gen ATE... but... this IEM is still under developement and can`t tell about it, yet

"under development",what do you mean by that coil?.....iis it somethin youve been given a sample to fine-tune some mfr's model or its just you are into your usual diy style.

 

[Shadowsora]

  I actually have something that has little better details/clarity/separation than ATR but also has better soundstage size and imaging than 5th gen ATE... but... this IEM is still under developement and can`t tell about it, yet

Waiting with crossed fingers!

 

[SomeTechNoob]

  I am trying to find a smooth analytical iem to step up from ATR, I have a lot of treble cannons which are really well perceived by most people but I am not really into this signature, anyone has a recommendation?
 
I don't plan to buy it immediately so my budget can go up to 90$(Euros actually).

KZ ZS3 is a pretty good step up from the ATR.  A little bit on the bassy side, with slightly recessed mids and trebles.  Clarity overall is a lot better than the ATR to my ears.

 

[VShaft]

  But is $50 that expensive for a set of earphones? You get to step up in tier by spending a little more cash.
 

 
I'm also a beginner in this hobby, and here's my problem with the so called "stepping up in tier":
 

I read reviews for a $5 IEM and there's criticisms like:

- all good, but treble is grainy, or
- all good, but sub-bass/mid-bass/whatever-bass could be more present, or
- all good, but the mids are so and so, or
- all good, but it's difficult getting a good seal, or
- etc. etc. etc.

And then I see reviews for a $50 IEM, and you read all of that, again, word for word. Even for $500 IEMs.
 
And than you come to ask yourself, wait a minute, if a $5 IEM and a $50 IEM and $500 IEM have the same faults and qualities, isn't it wiser to stick to the cheaper models? Because for $5 I can forgive grainy treble, or lacking sub-bass, or whatever it is... but for a $500 IEM, I don't want it to be lacking in this, or have too much of that - I want it to be just right. In a word, perfect.
 
Now, I know nothing's perfect, and that reviews are subjective and the earphones are judged according to the other models in their price range (that is, the "lack of xyz" in $5 IEM is not the same as "lack of xyz" in a $500 IEM). But it's certainly disconcerting to an audio enthusiast on a budget to read the same kinds of criticisms for a KZ ATR, and a Campfire Audio model. The question imposes itself: is it worth spending ten times (or a hundred) more for an IEM that basically has the same flaws as your current "cheapo"?
 
This being the reality, it's much easier to put your trust in a budget IEM than a premium one. Even more so, I'm more trusting of a cheaper Chinese model, than a pricier brand name model. It seems to me the Chinese are surpassing the brand names i the low and mid-end audio, at a fraction of a cost. Am I wrong?

 

[crabdog]

   
I'm also a beginner in this hobby, and here's my problem with the so called "stepping up in tier":
 

I read reviews for a $5 IEM and there's criticisms like:

- all good, but treble is grainy, or
- all good, but sub-bass/mid-bass/whatever-bass could be more present, or
- all good, but the mids are so and so, or
- all good, but it's difficult getting a good seal, or
- etc. etc. etc.

And then I see reviews for a $50 IEM, and you read all of that, again, word for word. Even for $500 IEMs.
 
And than you come to ask yourself, wait a minute, if a $5 IEM and a $50 IEM and $500 IEM have the same faults and qualities, isn't it wiser to stick to the cheaper models? Because for $5 I can forgive grainy treble, or lacking sub-bass, or whatever it is... but for a $500 IEM, I don't want it to be lacking in this, or have too much of that - I want it to be just right. In a word, perfect.
 
Now, I know nothing's perfect, and that reviews are subjective and the earphones are judged according to the other models in their price range (that is, the "lack of xyz" in $5 IEM is not the same as "lack of xyz" in a $500 IEM). But it's certainly disconcerting to an audio enthusiast on a budget to read the same kinds of criticisms for a KZ ATR, and a Campfire Audio model. The question imposes itself: is it worth spending ten times (or a hundred) more for an IEM that basically has the same flaws as your current "cheapo"?
 
This being the reality, it's much easier to put your trust in a budget IEM than a premium one. Even more so, I'm more trusting of a cheaper Chinese model, than a pricier brand name model. It seems to me the Chinese are surpassing the brand names i the low and mid-end audio, at a fraction of a cost. Am I wrong?

It's all relative. $500 for some people is just lunch money. But once you go up a level in terms of audio it's hard to go back down again. A $500 IEM is not 100 times better than a $5 one. After the $150-200 mark diminishing returns kick in pretty hard but there's definitely improvements to be heard. I'm listening to the LZ A4 right now and it's just amazing. There's no way I'm going to reach for the KZ ZST at home but when I'm at work and want something almost 'disposable' in terms of cost to shove in my pocket or throw on the desk the ZST does an admirable job for its low asking price.

 

[ayao]

   
I'm also a beginner in this hobby, and here's my problem with the so called "stepping up in tier":

I read reviews for a $5 IEM and there's criticisms like:

- all good, but treble is grainy, or
- all good, but sub-bass/mid-bass/whatever-bass could be more present, or
- all good, but the mids are so and so, or
- all good, but it's difficult getting a good seal, or
- etc. etc. etc.

And then I see reviews for a $50 IEM, and you read all of that, again, word for word. Even for $500 IEMs.
 
And than you come to ask yourself, wait a minute, if a $5 IEM and a $50 IEM and $500 IEM have the same faults and qualities, isn't it wiser to stick to the cheaper models? Because for $5 I can forgive grainy treble, or lacking sub-bass, or whatever it is... but for a $500 IEM, I don't want it to be lacking in this, or have too much of that - I want it to be just right. In a word, perfect.
 
Now, I know nothing's perfect, and that reviews are subjective and the earphones are judged according to the other models in their price range (that is, the "lack of xyz" in $5 IEM is not the same as "lack of xyz" in a $500 IEM). But it's certainly disconcerting to an audio enthusiast on a budget to read the same kinds of criticisms for a KZ ATR, and a Campfire Audio model. The question imposes itself: is it worth spending ten times more for an IEM that basically has the same flaws as your current "cheapo"?
 
This being the reality, it's just much easier to put your trust in a budget IEM than a premium one. Even more so, I'm more trusting of a cheaper Chinese model, than a pricier brand name model. It seems to me the Chinese are surpassing the brand names i the low and mid-end audio, at a fraction of a cost. Am I wrong?

 
This is just limited to what I have and what I've heard, but none of the "cheapo" earphones I've heard are close enough to the upper tier earphones (I've heard) to say that they have the same faults and qualities. I can compare the $5 ATR with the $500 C6IEM no problem, but there are going to be more differences than similarities, despite both having a "dark, warm but balanced" signature. The following opinion might be controversial, but every KZ earphone I've heard apart from the ZST and ZS1 series sounds artificial somewhere in the mids, and it's not all in the same place (some around 3-4khz, some around 5-7khz).
 
I think isolated reviews that share the same descriptions (e.g. sub-bass can be more present on the ZST and ER4), would have different descriptions when in direct comparison with each other (ER4 sounds anemic and the ZST sounds boomy)
 
Also, be careful of audio terms since they are subjective in itself. "Clear, engaging vocals" for someone might mean "too shouty" for someone else.
 
The topic of money is also pretty tricky. Someone might have a budget of $30, while $195 might be "good value" for someone else. Someone might think the <$20 XE800's value-for-money is better than the $80+ GR07, while someone else might think the "refined tuning" of the GR07 is worth the money over the XE800. As much as they are "ridiculously overpriced", I've honestly never heard anything as fatigue-free as the Adel U12, or any fully-sealing IEM with such vast soundstage as the JH Audio Layla.
 
Blindly starting out with KZ is nice because they offer so many different choices at such a low price. Buying one or two pairs most likely won't put you in debt. It's a good starting point to see what kind of signature you prefer, though it's possible you might change preferences in the future. I personally went from "V-shaped" to "neutral" to "warm/balanced".
 
If you want to spend "lots of money" on an earphone and want it to be "perfect", the only thing I can recommend would be to visit an earphone store that allows you to demo everything. I only had this opportunity during a short vacation in Tokyo, but it was definitely worth it! I found that the K3003, FX850 and Unique Melody earphones weren't to my tastes, I actually liked the cheap TTPOD T1E, and I wish to own the DN2000, Heaven VIII and TG!334 in the future.
 
All in all, what really matters is whether or not you enjoy music with the earphones. If an earphone makes you angry and triple-post in a thread (not sure if it was sarcastic though), it might be a good idea to try a different earphone or just get used to it. I was outside the whole day today, and brought the ZST and Layla with me. I used both earphones equally, and can tell you that the ZST didn't make me mad or anything; I was still happy listening to the ZST.

 

[hendrixj]

Does anyone know of a silver cable that fits the ATR's? I have them for my ZST and ZS3 and much prefer how they fit in my pocket. I'm not a fan of the stock cables but can't find one for the ATRs to save my life. Any help would be much appreciated.

 

[Shawn71]

Does anyone know of a silver cable that fits the ATR's? I have them for my ZST and ZS3 and much prefer how they fit in my pocket. I'm not a fan of the stock cables but can't find one for the ATRs to save my life. Any help would be much appreciated.

ATR have fixed cable unlike zst/3 which has removable cable to buy after-market cables of your choice.........you need to have little diy skills to diy with atr as it involves opening the shells desolder the stock cables and install your preferred cable and glue the shells back.

 

[hendrixj]

Well that's not worth it. Thanks though. Still good earbuds. Can't complain.

 

[To.M]

The cable for ATR/ATE looks like a removable one, which may be deceiving. I remember once I disassembled one broken pair of ATE to see how it is connected and to be completely sure it is non-removable, silly me!