[chengsta]

I have the x5 paired with the original c5.  I have owned the c5 for a year now and I still love it.  No reason to upgrade.  The x5 is really great once you have it on the right firmware you desire.   

 

[PinkLed]

I have had the c5 for about 8 months now and have to say its a great piece of equipment. Paired with my cowon X9 and triple fi 10s, I'm certainly in basshead heaven. The build quality is great as well except for one issue, the bass toggle broke off after a few months. I emailed JDS Labs and they said they will replace my C5, however when I suggested using the on off toggle, or something similar (which is metal) as the same switch for the bass toggle in further revision, they claimed they have never heard of anyone having this issue before. I was just wondering if anyone has had a similar experience. As an electro-mechanical engineer myself, I deal with issues like this on a regular basis. Customer feedback and suggestions are vital to the improvement of the product and I was just taken back by their response. 
 
Besides that small gripe, buy one, you wont regret it.

 

[luisdent]

I have had the c5 for about 8 months now and have to say its a great piece of equipment. Paired with my cowon X9 and triple fi 10s, I'm certainly in basshead heaven. The build quality is great as well except for one issue, the bass toggle broke off after a few months. I emailed JDS Labs and they said they will replace my C5, however when I suggested using the on off toggle, or something similar (which is metal) as the same switch for the bass toggle in further revision, they claimed they have never heard of anyone having this issue before. I was just wondering if anyone has had a similar experience. As an electro-mechanical engineer myself, I deal with issues like this on a regular basis. Customer feedback and suggestions are vital to the improvement of the product and I was just taken back by their response. 

Besides that small gripe, buy one, you wont regret it.

I've had mine for a while as well. And i've done a lot of iem comparisons and used that switch probably thousands of times, literally. Mine feels sturdy still. I'll let you know if it ever breaks, but so far so good.

 

[chengsta]

I switch my switch all the time too, still strong after a year!

 

[miceblue]

Likewise, I toggle the switch a lot and I basically throw it in my backpack. The nub itself doesn't stick out very far at all (maybe 2 mm), so that is odd that that happened to you.

 

[miceblue]

It was brought to my attention that the Lightning Apple Camera Connection Kit has an on-board DAC in it. Does anyone know the pathway an audio signal goes through with that in the audio chain? i.e. does it go through both the CCK DAC as well as the C5D's DAC?

 

[bartus]

It was brought to my attention that the Lightning Apple Camera Connection Kit has an on-board DAC in it. Does anyone know the pathway an audio signal goes through with that in the audio chain? i.e. does it go through both the CCK DAC as well as the C5D's DAC?

That would be silly, You can't feed a DAC with a DAC output, so the answer is no. There is definetly DSP in the CCK to extract the digital sound singal (otherwise we could use a normal lightning cable) but this wil stay in the digital domain.

 

[psonoda]

The lightning to USB adapter does not have a dac. The lightning to 30 pin adapter does. (Pretty sure). My understanding is that was made to offer analog out for sound devices that used the analog instead of the only digital lightning connector. Both the lightning and the 30 pin to USB adapters have a chip on board to allow the pass through of the digital audio signal.

 

[PinkLed]

Thank you for your experiences guys.
 
I still believe they should use a metal toggle and this is why:
 
The toggle is an amber rod surrounded by soft a plastic. I know this because the amber rod was all that was left when the toggle broke. I also had the piece that broke, being the gray plastic. I put this part into pliers and with slight pressure it began to deform. I could still switch the amber rod with a pen, however eventually the amber rod bent as well. Now its completely nonfunctional.  From a mechanical standpoint in my opinion the design is poor. The amber rod, being much harder then the soft plastic shell broke through its outer gray coating. The amber rod is thin, and the end of it is narrow and sharp. Over time, years and years, I assume more of you will have this issue. No design is perfect, but it seems like a simple fix to just use a slightly more expensive metal toggle. I have receivers from the 70s that work just as well as the day they left the shop, all metal construction. The went out of their way making the housing aluminum instead of plastic, why cheap out on the controls? Of course nothing is built to last forever, but from my experience in the R&D process even if something works thousands of times but fails once, its up to the engineer to figure out what went wrong that single time. I just find it hard to believe that there are not others out there that have had my issue.

 

[bartus]

  Thank you for your experiences guys.
 
I still believe they should use a metal toggle and this is why:
 
The toggle is an amber rod surrounded by soft a plastic. I know this because the amber rod was all that was left when the toggle broke. I also had the piece that broke, being the gray plastic. I put this part into pliers and with slight pressure it began to deform. I could still switch the amber rod with a pen, however eventually the amber rod bent as well. Now its completely nonfunctional.  From a mechanical standpoint in my opinion the design is poor. The amber rod, being much harder then the soft plastic shell broke through its outer gray coating. The amber rod is thin, and the end of it is narrow and sharp. Over time, years and years, I assume more of you will have this issue. No design is perfect, but it seems like a simple fix to just use a slightly more expensive metal toggle. I have receivers from the 70s that work just as well as the day they left the shop, all metal construction. The went out of their way making the housing aluminum instead of plastic, why cheap out on the controls? Of course nothing is built to last forever, but from my experience in the R&D process even if something works thousands of times but fails once, its up to the engineer to figure out what went wrong that single time. I just find it hard to believe that there are not others out there that have had my issue.

 

I suppose you mean an amber colored rod?!? Besides I suppose that it is not a question of saving money to use these switches, otherwise they would have used this type of switch for  on/off as well. Other brands like Ray Samuels Audio use similar switches for products in higher price ranges.

 

[PinkLed]

   

I suppose you mean an amber colored rod?!? Besides I suppose that it is not a question of saving money to use these switches, otherwise they would have used this type of switch for  on/off as well. Other brands like Ray Samuels Audio use similar switches for products in higher price ranges.

 
 
I believe the rod is made of amber. Its hard to see from the image but it is indeed translucent. Mixing materials of different harnesses is something that can cause issue. 

 

[jseaber]

   I believe the rod is made of amber. Its hard to see from the image but it is indeed translucent. Mixing materials of different harnesses is something that can cause issue. 

 
The switch is a premium brand used by many manufacturers: NKK p/n G23AV
 
You can find composition data here:
http://www.nkkswitches.com/pdf/Gtoggles.pdf
 
Its actuator is composed of "Glass fiber reinforced polyamide"

 

[bartus]

   
 
I believe the rod is made of amber. Its hard to see from the image but it is indeed translucent. Mixing materials of different harnesses is something that can cause issue. 

I didn't want to sound to direct or harsh at the beginning (as we Dutch people can be) but now I'm interested what do you think as an electro-mechanical engineer that amber is? Cause I can't think of any structural application in industrial design were amber could be applied other than for pure esthetic value.

 

[PinkLed]

 
I didn't want to sound to direct or harsh at the beginning (as we Dutch people can be) but now I'm interested what do you think as an electro-mechanical engineer that amber is? Cause I can't think of any structural application in industrial design were amber could be applied other than for pure esthetic value.

Semantics, and irrelevant to the issue. Mixing materials of different harnesses in a manner where friction is a factor is, well to be blunt, amateur. Amber has a harness similar to nylon. The rubber coating over the "Glass fiber reinforced polyamide" hardness much less. Plain and simple. 
 
FYI, I design transformer substations not micro switches. If a customer complains about a control component, I scrap it and get a better one. 
 

   

I suppose you mean an amber colored rod?!? Besides I suppose that it is not a question of saving money to use these switches, otherwise they would have used this type of switch for  on/off as well. Other brands like Ray Samuels Audio use similar switches for products in higher price ranges.

They would still be saving money. This ones basic math. Switch A costs 5$ switch B costs 10$. X= B+B = 20$, Y = B+A = 15$. X > Y.
 
In order to change the switch they would most likely have to redesign the PCB in order to fit the larger metal IO switch into further revisions, but I think its worth it. 
 
My other gripe, one day I was using my C5 and there was a rattling inside. I opened it up and out fell a 1/4" x 1/4" x 1/8" thk. piece of plastic. It was a part associated with the PCB mounting.
 
I have bought plenty of "premium products" and many of them have failed. Just because everyone uses it and it has become an industry standard does not mean better options do not exist. 
 
Additionally the aluminum end plates are inconsistent on both sides of my C5. One of them overhangs, the entire plate is offset. The other side is fine. 
 
Also, almost all of the labels (such as IO, + -) are faded, some of them totally gone. 
 
I was not going to rip the product like this but I felt no other choice now that my legitimacy is being questioned. These issues are much more relevant then knowing the difference between tree resin and synthetic tree resin, in my humble opinion. 
 
The saying "they don't build them like they use to" is a bit of an understatement on this one. 

 

[jseaber]

  Semantics, and irrelevant to the issue. Mixing materials of different harnesses in a manner where friction is a factor is, well to be blunt, amateur. Amber has a harness similar to nylon. The rubber coating over the "Glass fiber reinforced polyamide" hardness much less. Plain and simple. 
 
FYI, I design transformer substations not micro switches. If a customer complains about a control component, I scrap it and get a better one. 
 
They would still be saving money. This ones basic math. Switch A costs 5$ switch B costs 10$. X= B+B = 20$, Y = B+A = 15$. X > Y.
 

 
 
Single part cost of an NKK G23AV: $7.70/ea
Single part cost of the rear, metal power switch: $2.90/ea
 
We continue to use the relatively expensive NKK brand because they're appreciated. We've evaluated a long list of alternative switches; cost is not part of the decision process. We maintain records of all customer issues, and your broken toggle is an isolated event covered by our 2-year warranty. Unless unreported, no other C5 or C5D switches have been damaged. That said, I've worked as an electrical engineer in high reliability industrial environments and understand your concern. The NKK switches meet long-term reliability expectations and outlast the product warranty (NKK G22AV was used in our c421 amp). If there's demand for a Toughbook style amp/DAC, we'll build one. Or have a look at Objective2.
 
Machining: Our machinists inspect each batch of endplates as soon as they're removed from our Haas CNC for a post-machining cleanse. As a secondary measure of protection, we use custom trays in the engraving process which physically cannot accept misshaped parts. And to ensure maximum quality, we've recently required our head of production to inspect each batch of machined parts again after engraving. Bad parts are rejected at each inspection point and are sent to a recycling bin. Only acceptable parts make it to our assembly department.
 
Engraving: Regardless of the application method, we've found that silkscreen and engraving processes onto silver endplates can wear off after significant physical contact (usually measured in years). Laser engraving onto black anodized aluminum is far more robust since it physically alters the oxide layer and cannot be removed. If customers were unhappy, we'd discontinue silver endplates. If you have any concern about long-term artwork wear, black is a better choice.
 
 
@PinkLed: I'm sorry C5 has mechanically disappointed you. All products should match the photos at JDSLabs.com, and outlast their 2-year warranty. We'll be glad to refund the amp or replace the entire unit. Let us know what you prefer.