[Mr BubbaHyde]

Had a feeling you would respond that way

1) https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-zen-dac-discussion-impression.917041/post-16322075
- Read it. Go ahead.
- When is SOON? When you make it up?
- A commit was made with no timelines. Hence the point.

2) You act as if we don't understand agility in development. I am a software developer. I get the nature of fluctuating factors contributing to mixed time lines. EVERY organization in the known technology space makes commitments.

3) Yes, you did commit. Clarified in point 1.

4) Its not about I feel, its about the evidence. ifi is neglecting its commitments. FULL STOP. Wee really don't care how many variables there are in the mix, and MONTHS of waiting patiently is evidence that we are considerate. It is clear that you all are not.

Questions still stand. try answering and stop deflecting with "its hard." YUP. It is. So what? We have to be considerate to ifi, but you don't have to be considerate to us? We are the ones paying you, and you are the ones making commitments. If you can't control your own development, just say you can't and expect to compensate all impacted.

Before you respond, again, GO BACK AND READ WHAT YOU HAVE WRITTEN. Don't edit anything, because I did capture it all based on this conversation.

Been watching this closely as an original Zen Dac V1 owner and lover, and I have to step in and say that parsing words for yours or Ifi's benefit helps no one...

The actual quote says "should" not "definitely", here it is... " That's correct, and we should have a firmware with MQA decoding available soon."

Maybe we all need to take a step back, especially when we are talking about sub 200 dollar units.

I have never had an issue with the MQA quality of the Zen Dac V1, What am I missing?

Cheers!!

 

[iFi audio]

To make it short and hopefully uderstandable this time around: providing full MQA decoding for ZEN DAC V1 products that came later was the original plan. However, just recently I was told that it's not as simple as a firmware swap, even in case of those specific ZEN DAC V1 units with latest XMOS. That's all there is to it.

To make it even shorter: we wanted to provide MQA decoding utility, but that's not possible as it turned out and that's where we are right now. If anyone feels offended by that, our sincere apologies!

Also, it's good to have you around and I have no issues with addressing matters that were forgotten, but please mind your tone (...and everyone into that dispute) OK? Things are getting a bit out of control and I'd like to keep this place civilized

 

[Effigy]

To make it short and hopefully uderstandable this time around: providing full MQA decoding for ZEN DAC V1 products that came later was the original plan. However, just recently I was told that it's not as simple as a firmware swap, even in case of those specific ZEN DAC V1 units with latest XMOS. That's all there is to it.

To make it even shorter: we wanted to provide MQA decoding utility, but that's not possible as it turned out and that's where we are right now. If anyone feels offended by that, our sincere apologies!

Also, it's good to have you around and I have no issues with addressing matters that were forgotten, but please mind your tone (...and everyone into that dispute) OK? Things are getting a bit out of control and I'd like to keep this place civilized

1) Great! Thats a bit better - hey @Mr BubbaHyde - this is what I am talking about. They don't need to defend themselves. They just need to be transparent
2) @iFi audio - thats a little ambiguous after months of the issue straggling. No one is "offended" but consumers expect commitments to be satisfied.
3) Can you provide a date? Are you willing to compensate @Milan79? He like others have been waiting.

MOST APPRECIATED.

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

1) Great! Thats a bit better - hey @Mr BubbaHyde - this is what I am talking about. They don't need to defend themselves. They just need to be transparent
2) @iFi audio - thats a little ambiguous after months of the issue straggling. No one is "offended" but consumers expect commitments to be satisfied.
3) Can you provide a date? Are you willing to compensate @Milan79? He like others have been waiting.

MOST APPRECIATED.

Well now everyone's happy, and MQA "should" be able to be enjoyed fully now,...

As if anyone really knows what that is...

Cheers!!

 

[iFi audio]

They just need to be transparent

We are and we've been here long enough to know that, plese see our recent conversations that make the point rather well

thats a little ambiguous after months of the issue straggling. No one is "offended" but consumers expect commitments to be satisfied.

I've already explained where we are on the subject of MQA, transparently at that and as soon as I got information from our R&D, so there's no need to have that discussion further. Consumers not satisfied with our products can let us know about it here: https://support.ifi-audio.com

Thanks!

3) Can you provide a date? Are you willing to compensate @Milan79? He like others have been waiting.

I'm not sure what you're referring to here and what dates you expect, but if it's the MQA subject still, please see above. As for @Milan79, he knows where to find us so I'd leave any further actions to him

 

[Milan79]

Hello.
First of all, I want to thank Effigy for supporting my cause. I thought MQA support would be possible on my Zen Dac, but in the end IFI Audio wrote me that it would not be possible, even though it contains an XMOS 216 chip. It doesn't matter, nothing happens. I am extremely satisfied with the sound of Zen Dac. MQA only has Tidal and I have a huge collection of music in flac, so it's not a priority for me.

 

[Effigy]

Hello.
First of all, I want to thank Effigy for supporting my cause. I thought MQA support would be possible on my Zen Dac, but in the end IFI Audio wrote me that it would not be possible, even though it contains an XMOS 216 chip. It doesn't matter, nothing happens. I am extremely satisfied with the sound of Zen Dac. MQA only has Tidal and I have a huge collection of music in flac, so it's not a priority for me.

For what its worth, you raised it a long time ago. Given that no update was provided by ifi, it started to bother me - when you raised it AGAIN, I had forgotten as well, and had responded back to you with incorrect information initially that ifi didn't correct. I'm glad you got resolution.

Commitments matter.

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

For what its worth, you raised it a long time ago. Given that no update was provided by ifi, it started to bother me - when you raised it AGAIN, I had forgotten as well, and had responded back to you with incorrect information initially that ifi didn't correct. I'm glad you got resolution.

Commitments matter.

I'm still very confused and again ask, what is the issue with MQA support on the Zen Dac?

The ZD does support and has since the day I got mine not long after launch! So what am I missing??

Cheers!!

 

[Effigy]

Could you please tell me how "Should" is a commitment, or am I missing some other interpreted quote? Please direct me...

If you can it should read..

To all iFi owners of this product we "WILL" have this feature ready very soon! That's a commitment. Not "Should"

And again, I have many many things that are "self induced" whining about a company's do's and do not's, and then ranting about them in a forum where the product, at this point in it's life cycle, technically speaking is old news!

Soon someone will be along to tell me not to feed the trolls...

Cheers!

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-zen-dac-discussion-impression.917041/page-50#post-16322075

The issue was/is that Zen DAC v1 (later models) has the SAME XMOS chipset as V2. It can technically be made to act as FULL MQA decoder, not just as a renderer, something promoted as a distinct feature in v2. Technically ifi CAN create a fix, but has decided that they are not prioritizing the solution full MQA decode available on v1. Suspect this means "never."

Specific reason related to inability to simply release a firmware update, - likely involves changes to the hardware - which is appreciably more difficult to do, as it would likely require more from the user, and likely raise support costs significantly, and would more than likely result in excessive RMAs for the devices, as its clear that the Zen DAC was not built as a user friendly "right to repair" style technology. This is fair - genuinely, but not communicating it openly is the problem - after the commit.

If full MQA decode is important to some people, and to some it is, then this commit would be important, and represents a saved ~175 USD. If it is important, you have two options 1) Upgrade 2) Find something else. (See Tone 2 Pro, etc.)

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/ifi-zen-dac-discussion-impression.917041/page-50#post-16322075

The issue was/is that Zen DAC v1 (later models) has the SAME XMOS chipset as V2. It can technically be made to act as FULL MQA decoder, not just as a renderer, something promoted as a distinct feature in v2. Technically ifi CAN create a fix, but has decided that they are not prioritizing the solution full MQA decode available on v1. Suspect this means "never."

Specific reason related to inability to simply release a firmware update, - likely involves changes to the hardware - which is appreciably more difficult to do, as it would likely require more from the user, and likely raise support costs significantly, and would more than likely result in excessive RMAs for the devices, as its clear that the Zen DAC was not built as a user friendly "right to repair" style technology. This is fair - genuinely, but not communicating it openly is the problem - after the commit.

If full MQA decode is important to some people, and to some it is, then this commit would be important, and represents a saved ~175 USD. If it is important, you have two options 1) Upgrade 2) Find something else. (See Tone 2 Pro, etc.)

So just so I am clear you are saying the ZD V1 Can not do the full MQA, because it is "just a renderer"?

This is where I am getting confused, as it most certainly can.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

 

[Effigy]

So just so I am clear you are saying the ZD V1 Can not do the full MQA, because it is "just a renderer"?

This is where I am getting confused, as it most certainly can.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

https://www.mqa.co.uk/how-it-works

The differences, as per the source.

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

https://www.mqa.co.uk/how-it-works

The differences, as per the source.

I'm well aware of that page...

Again, are you saying the Zen Dac V1 cannot do the full MQA, because it's "just a renderer", in other words you are not hearing a fully unfolded MQA file if you listen to Tidal?

Thank you

 

[Effigy]

I'm well aware of that page...

Again, are you saying the Zen Dac V1 cannot do the full MQA, because it's "just a renderer", in other words you are not hearing a fully unfolded MQA file if you listen to Tidal?

Thank you

Ummm no… (???)

I’m saying that ifi made a commitment to have a solution for v1 to operate as a decoder.

To be clear, again, this is about a commitment ifi made, not about MQA being unfolded using one method or another. If @Milan79 is content, then all good.

 

[Mr BubbaHyde]

Ummm no… (???)

I’m saying that ifi made a commitment to have a solution for v1 to operate as a decoder.

tTo be clear, again, this is about a commitment ifi made, not about MQA being unfolded using one method or another. If @Milan79 is content, then all good.

That's all well and good, and I am happy you got a resolution that you both feel satisfied with.

However I am not satisfied that disinformation, is posted in this thread that might affect someones thoughts on this product. You keep stating that somehow the ZD v1 is not a full decoder, without presenting the fact that will in fact do all the necessary work for you to hear a Tidal MQA file! There is nothing extra needed or Firmware fixed to be able to enjoy Tidal MQA.

You keep presenting facts like somehow the ZD V1 needs a firmware fix to be able to be a full MQA decoder, meaning Hardware by Your standard. When it absolutely does not need this! and yes I understand the so called "commitment" that you are referring to, that is beside the point.

Again please clarify your remarks, as to me and many others that have read them they are misleading, The Zen DAC V1 in no way, shape, or form needs any upgrade to be able to enjoy full MQA?

Please tell me I'm wrong.

 

[Effigy]

That's all well and good, and I am happy you got a resolution that you both feel satisfied with.

However I am not satisfied that disinformation, is posted in this thread that might affect someones thoughts on this product. You keep stating that somehow the ZD v1 is not a full decoder, without presenting the fact that will in fact do all the necessary work for you to hear a Tidal MQA file! There is nothing extra needed or Firmware fixed to be able to enjoy Tidal MQA.

You keep presenting facts like somehow the ZD V1 needs a firmware fix to be able to be a full MQA decoder, meaning Hardware by Your standard. When it absolutely does not need this! and yes I understand the so called "commitment" that you are referring to, that is beside the point.

Again please clarify your remarks, as to me and many others that have read them they are misleading, The Zen DAC V1 in no way, shape, or form needs any upgrade to be able to enjoy full MQA?

Please tell me I'm wrong.

You’re wrong.