[koven]

I am going to cancel my order. The wait takes way too long.

Even hand made custom build niche products I use for sports are delivered faster.

Why not just grab this one? Discounted and no wait.. https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-hugo-m-scaler-black.894358/

 

[dmance]

@Rob Watts
I notice all OP SR settings have an audio delay equivalent of full 1M taps. Can I assume the respective output sample rates are just downsampled from the full 705.6/768. For example feeding a 48k signal with blue OP SR and single BNC does, in fact, scale to full 16fs (768k) but then does an elegant downsample (linear?) to 192k?
It's sounds gloriously close to full dual coax BTW.
Dan

 

[GreenLeo]

I am going to cancel my order. The wait takes way too long.

Even hand made custom build niche products I use for sports are delivered faster.

Try KGBHSE.

 

[Boogie7910]

Chord m scaler chord hugo TT 2 and Empyrean headphones, with the stand over 12 grand, keep pinching myself

Can't wait to hear your impressions as this could be my set up in the future. Holding off on ordering the Empyreans for now because changes appear to be coming at work and it's unpredictable what choice I may have to make, so best to hold on to my money for the time being.

 

[Triode User]

@Rob Watts
I notice all OP SR settings have an audio delay equivalent of full 1M taps. Can I assume the respective output sample rates are just downsampled from the full 705.6/768. For example feeding a 48k signal with blue OP SR and single BNC does, in fact, scale to full 16fs (768k) but then does an elegant downsample (linear?) to 192k?
It's sounds gloriously close to full dual coax BTW.
Dan

I have asked a sort of similar question and I think the answer I got was that pass through is in deed proper pass through and by implication therefore not your surmised downsampled version of a fully Mscaled stream. Will await the horses mouth answer though.

 

[hmartin]

@Rob Watts
I notice all OP SR settings have an audio delay equivalent of full 1M taps. Can I assume the respective output sample rates are just downsampled from the full 705.6/768. For example feeding a 48k signal with blue OP SR and single BNC does, in fact, scale to full 16fs (768k) but then does an elegant downsample (linear?) to 192k?
It's sounds gloriously close to full dual coax BTW.
Dan

Outputting 192 kHz from 768 kHz is just transmitting every 4th sample and skipping the rest as long as the original was 192 kHz or less. (So that 192 kHz fullfill Nyquist)

Edit: Passthrough is volume adjusted? So not a the original signal but it would be nice to know dither etc for this mode etc

 

[Tao8]

and on living with the m scaler ongoing... have to say the m scaler continues to amaze me and has proven such a marvellous thing. While as discussed there’s clearly plenty of purely sonic improvements it’s really about how it locks in the engagement in the music. It’s very compelling with the m scaler engaged with the 1 million taps in full flight.

Analytically listening for differences seems counter-intuitive because it sets you into a mode of actively listening that just seems to miss the whole value of just experiencing that dance of rhythms and sensations that is just feeling the music.

The expression of timbre as the m scaler settles in becomes more nuanced and natural, the impression of physical presence of the instruments (and their attached players) is just so implicit.

The microdynamic shading is absolutely quicksilver and so the technical skill and nuance in performance becomes like a weft and weave, just super expressive.

I feel all these traits come through increasingly and even more expressively over the first weeks as the m scaler really settles in. It is still absolutely addictive in a completely positive sense, it always adds to the richness of the music experience and takes nothing away. Super impressed and absolutey happy at the not inconsiderable investment in the m scaler but return on investment is high. It pays every time I play. Just completely love it.

 

[dmance]

Outputting 192 kHz from 768 kHz is just transmitting every 4th sample and skipping the rest as long as the original was 192 kHz or less. (So that 192 kHz fullfill Nyquist)
...

Rob would never use a decimation filter! He has spent hours online going into the incredible nuance of noise shaping. So only taking every fourth sample would be very audibly distorting.
I must have golden ears ...but I can distinguish when I accidentally have set the windows playback volume to 60% - so the samples to the HMS have less dynamic range and are subtlety 'off' from the original.

 

[paul2qute]

Apart from getting delivered to the wrong address my M scaler has arrived safely

 

[Rob Watts]

@Rob Watts
I notice all OP SR settings have an audio delay equivalent of full 1M taps. Can I assume the respective output sample rates are just downsampled from the full 705.6/768. For example feeding a 48k signal with blue OP SR and single BNC does, in fact, scale to full 16fs (768k) but then does an elegant downsample (linear?) to 192k?
It's sounds gloriously close to full dual coax BTW.
Dan

See answer below:

Outputting 192 kHz from 768 kHz is just transmitting every 4th sample and skipping the rest as long as the original was 192 kHz or less. (So that 192 kHz fullfill Nyquist)

Edit: Passthrough is volume adjusted? So not a the original signal but it would be nice to know dither etc for this mode etc

This is correct. The 4* filter is identical to a 16* filter with only a quarter of the OP samples used; and this works because it is Nyquist bandwidth limited by the action of the filter. Another way of looking at it is to design a 4* (48>192) oversampled WTA filter; the coefficients used are absolutely identical to a quarter of the 16* (48>768) coefficient set. So it's not a good idea to think of it as 768k that's decimated down to 192k, as it's identical to the 4* (48>192) WTA filter anyway.

Yes its volume or gain adjusted, and dither employed is gaussian 24 bit (technically very close to Gaussian) as this sounds much better than triangular or rectangular dither.

 

[dmance]

@Rob Watts
Regarding the 'popping' noise that some have reported. Well i have experienced such ...just recently with the arrival of my MScaler as I was experimenting with all inputs. Its manifest as low volume/energy random pops about every 3-4 seconds. Single pops or in groups of 2-3. Good news ...its not a systemic issue but still bothersome. Here is my input for you - and the rest of the community.

• I own a Hugo2 and MScaler - I listen through both headphones and an efficient loudspeaker system
• My playback is direct from Windows10 laptop using JRiver MC 22 (mostly) plus other various.
• I never noticed it with the Hugo2 since I always used TOSLINK via a USB converter
• Its present on both MScaler and Hugo2 - USB input. Sonic signature of popping is the same on both.
• I hear it with PCM 24/96 FLAC content - but not sure if exclusively
• I hear it only on USB. Never on TOSLINK or SPDIF inputs.
• i hear it only with JRiver MC 22
• Never hear with Chome-based playback (chrome can play FLAC)
• Never hear with other Windows media players: VLC, Groove Music, Windows Media Player 12.
• Did not try other versions of JRiver but i've used this product for at least a decade - no issues
• Its not present on PSAudio DirectStream (Sr.). I have not tried other DACs ...but I've owned several in the past and did not hear this issue
• Its not a USB cable issue - i used every USB cable I had
• Its not a JRiver MC settings issue - tried everything i could

Here is a 100% guarantee file that demonstrated the issue for me. Its a 30-sec clip of 'Sting - August Winds' which I presume can be provided to the community under Fair Use. Download from DropBox here.

In my opinion, the issue is either a windows audio subsystem problem that has crept in - or Chord's USB implementation that perhaps now reveals this issue uniquely with Jriver MC. I'd appreciate feedback from other MC users in the community. I could upgrade to the latest JRiver or move to other players to resolve this.

Thanks,

Dan

 

[aldavey]

I've had a forced week off listening. Just spent the last hour back with HMS/TT2. This is the best reproduction of music I've heard after 45+ years of listening, even with my relatively modest original HD800s. One outstanding track that sounded completely revelatory - 'Phil Collins, 'Something In The Air', Tidal/Roon.

 

[JaZZ]

...The 4* filter is identical to a 16* filter with only a quarter of the OP samples used; and this works because it is Nyquist bandwidth limited by the action of the filter. Another way of looking at it is to design a 4* (48>192) oversampled WTA filter; the coefficients used are absolutely identical to a quarter of the 16* (48>768) coefficient set. So it's not a good idea to think of it as 768k that's decimated down to 192k, as it's identical to the 4* (48>192) WTA filter anyway.

So «Pass-through» mode isn't true pass-through mode, right? And all in-between steps are downconversions from either 705.6 or 768 kHz, right? No criticism, just want to be sure. It also implies that even in pass-through mode the full 1 million taps are used, with corresponding RFI production.

 

[Rob Watts]

@Rob Watts
Regarding the 'popping' noise that some have reported. Well i have experienced such ...just recently with the arrival of my MScaler as I was experimenting with all inputs. Its manifest as low volume/energy random pops about every 3-4 seconds. Single pops or in groups of 2-3. Good news ...its not a systemic issue but still bothersome. Here is my input for you - and the rest of the community.

• I own a Hugo2 and MScaler - I listen through both headphones and an efficient loudspeaker system
• My playback is direct from Windows10 laptop using JRiver MC 22 (mostly) plus other various.
• I never noticed it with the Hugo2 since I always used TOSLINK via a USB converter
• Its present on both MScaler and Hugo2 - USB input. Sonic signature of popping is the same on both.
• I hear it with PCM 24/96 FLAC content - but not sure if exclusively
• I hear it only on USB. Never on TOSLINK or SPDIF inputs.
• i hear it only with JRiver MC 22
• Never hear with Chome-based playback (chrome can play FLAC)
• Never hear with other Windows media players: VLC, Groove Music, Windows Media Player 12.
• Did not try other versions of JRiver but i've used this product for at least a decade - no issues
• Its not present on PSAudio DirectStream (Sr.). I have not tried other DACs ...but I've owned several in the past and did not hear this issue
• Its not a USB cable issue - i used every USB cable I had
• Its not a JRiver MC settings issue - tried everything i could

Here is a 100% guarantee file that demonstrated the issue for me. Its a 30-sec clip of 'Sting - August Winds' which I presume can be provided to the community under Fair Use. Download from DropBox here.

In my opinion, the issue is either a windows audio subsystem problem that has crept in - or Chord's USB implementation that perhaps now reveals this issue uniquely with Jriver MC. I'd appreciate feedback from other MC users in the community. I could upgrade to the latest JRiver or move to other players to resolve this.

Thanks,

Dan

No idea about this. I use MC 21, 22 and 24, always on USB, never had an issue. Except for a lap-top that had problems with 192 - and that was fixed by running the processor at 100% all the time. Perhaps it's a processor interrupt/overhead issue.

So «Pass-through» mode isn't true pass-through mode, right? And all in-between steps are downconversions from either 705.6 or 768 kHz, right? No criticism, just want to be sure. It also implies that even in pass-through mode the full 1 million taps are used, with corresponding RFI production.

No it's not correct to think of the intermediate steps as down conversions - the data output is absolutely identical to a 192k (say) dedicated 192k WTA filter.

And of course pass-thru isn't bit perfect as it has to compensate for the M scaler filter attenuation.

 

[JaZZ]

No it's not correct to think of the intermediate steps as down conversions - the data output is absolutely identical to a 192k (say) dedicated 192k WTA filter.

And of course pass-thru isn't bit perfect as it has to compensate for the M scaler filter attenuation.

O.k., thanks, I understand. My main concern was that the full 1 million taps are always active, no matter which mode is selected. Which explains why Triode User has found the HMS bypass mode to sound very slightly sharper/brighter than the direct connection of the DAVE to the source.