[Prog Rock Man]

Stu, can you spot the difference between LODs in a blind test?
 
(I bought my custom Pailiccs LOD, for £18 off ebay from a seller in Glasgow, before FiiO brought out their own one. It was the cheapest at the time. I would not buy it now.)

 

[MusicalChillies]

If you were at my house, gave me both options, I would tell you straight away, with the tracks I chose.
I stand by that 110%.
 
If you asked me to change iems, not sure, haven`t done that yet mate, why would I, the coppers with my Denon large silicone tips are just first class.
 
You say you bought a custom lod, probably from the same guy as me, pualics plug, what do you use now and/or before?
You can see in my pic the lod.
Stu

 

[Prog Rock Man]

The LOD looks like this.......
  
   
 
I have not tried any other LOD, because I doubt I would hear any difference and because I don't use my portable setup that often.
 
Can you get a mate to swap LODs in such a way you cannot see which one you are listening to and do a blind test?

 

[MusicalChillies]

Funny I had the Fii0 E5 amp, sold it along with my shure 750dj headphones. (check my sales), nearly the same cable.
I don`t need a mate to tell me, I have 2 items which I can tell the difference from.
I`m not going to post anymore, I know what what I hear.
If people cannot hear a difference then fair doo`s, I can, not even a close one.
 
I am not being bolshy, just posting what I hear and a little bit amazed actually.
Send me a pm mate if you want, I will even send you my fii0 lod to do a comparison but I notice you are not using iems?
Stu 

 

[Prog Rock Man]

Hey Stu, you are in the sound science part of the forum, where you need a thicker skin to survive! I do not think you are being bloshi at all. I was all for cables until I read about all of the blind tests that have been done and some major hifi dignitaries such as the founder of Linn failing such tests. Then I made my own cable out of the cheapest stuff I could find on ebay after teaching myself to solder. It works just as well as any other cable I have.
 
So in myself I go with the blind tests and save myself a fortune in cables.
 
I am sure that differences in cables are caused by placebo, psychoacoustics and attenuation resulting in volume differences. Blind testing where volume has been equalised shows that when you take the other factors out of the equation, there is no reliable difference.

 

[MusicalChillies]

Hi mate, ok harder skin lol.
I am pretty new to this high end sound format, for iems anyways and amps.
This was never a search for 1 cable beats another, I just happen to sit with 2 items that does that.
I was in the search for which opamp sounds better than the other and just stumbled across this.
Switching my lod instantly after a track and listening again proved it to me, same seal in the ear, volume etc.

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Hi mate, ok harder skin lol.
I am pretty new to this high end sound format, for iems anyways and amps.
This was never a search for 1 cable beats another, I just happen to sit with 2 items that does that.
I was in the search for which opamp sounds better than the other and just stumbled across this.
Switching my lod instantly after a track and listening again proved it to me, same seal in the ear, volume etc.

There are psychological variables that have to be accounted for when you see both LODs and know which one is being used, and there could also be attenuation between cables for all we know.  Do a level matched DBT for yourself and see if you feel you can reliably identify them after - I doubt you will.
 
As for opamps - even ones rated poorly here can be good.  The circuit made with a particular opamp in mind will probably sound better than one with the "best" (I use that tongue-in-cheek) shoved in but oscillating.

 

[MusicalChillies]

Please mate, do not insult my intelligence.
Good luck on a thread that is false.
 
Stu

 

[nick_charles]

Quote:

Please mate, do not insult my intelligence.
 

Shike does not need to, you have already done that very nicely yourself !
 
But seriously, the literature is riddled with the vulture-picked corpses of those with utter certainty of their convictions that A and B are fundamentally different but who when required to verify this in controlled tests are wholly unable to do so...it is not a matter of intelligence or golden ears so much as psychology and the biases that humans have, For starters back in the 1980s Masters and Clark found listeners who sighted could describe huge differences between amps, under DBT they were wholly unable to replicate this feat. In a prior thread someone simply told that he was listening to a much chepaer amp heard all the faults in the amp, sadly he was actually listening to his own beloved amp.
 
Also, you talk about
Quote:

Switching my lod instantly after a track and listening again

 
but it is far from instant. You have to remove one LOD, plug in the other then start the track again, how many seconds does that take ? Enough to interfere with audio memory. And volume matching is an absolute must in any controlled tests, a difference of even 0.25 db can be detected.
 
Instead of doing a DBT you could just record the same track via the two LODs and compare the files, carefully trimmed of course, you might be surprised...
 

 

[lazard]

Trying to convince someone that audio cables don't make a difference is like trying to convince someone that God exists.  Can't be done nor should it be done.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Why bother trying to convince other people of anything?  Going on some type of crusade to prove your view on a topic is a waste of time.

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Please mate, do not insult my intelligence.

Where did I insult your intelligence?  I'm saying you're using a faulty testing procedure - that's a fact.
 
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nick_charles
 
In a prior thread someone simply told that he was listening to a much chepaer amp heard all the faults in the amp, sadly he was actually listening to his own beloved amp.

 
Oof, that's got to be a blow to the ego.  Has this persons opinion of amps changed by chance?
 
Quote:

Why bother trying to convince other people of anything?  Going on some type of crusade to prove your view on a topic is a waste of time.

In audio there's little point besides enjoying the hobby and trying to help those new focus their funds more wisely on differences that can be proven.  
 
However, beyond audio there's plenty of reason to convince people of certain things.

 

[AudioGlow]

Well, I don't know that if I believed that cables don't make a difference that I'd care if others did or not. I can tell you for sure from selling hifi and being a listener and enjoyer of music for many years, I KNOW they make a difference. Now weather there's a noticable difference between two cables you may have tried I do not know. When you get to a point that the resoloution of your system reaches a very high level, it's much more easy to dicern subtle differences. The point of diminishing returns is another issue altogether. There are people who spend $15,000 on a 1m rca interconnect. I'm sure they sound good, but for me they don't sound THAT good. Lol 

 

[vhbaske]

"How do you convince people that cables don't make any difference?" 

 
 
Well, open a cable selling shop and you will see the difference, in your pocket, that is !!!
 

 

[Shike]

Quote:

Well, I don't know that if I believed that cables don't make a difference that I'd care if others did or not. I can tell you for sure from selling hifi and being a listener and enjoyer of music for many years, I KNOW they make a difference

Care to prove it then?  As a dealer it would be highly beneficial for you if you could do so too, would it not?
 
 
Quote:

"How do you convince people that cables don't make any difference?" 

 
 
Well, open a cable selling shop and you will see the difference, in your pocket, that is !!!
 

I couldn't do that, I'd have problems looking at myself in the morning doing something so unethical.