[Prog Rock Man]

Quote:

I won't argue that people don't hear a difference, because clearly they do. If patients can knowingly take placebo (read: fake) medication and get clinically significant improvements, then it doesn't surprise me that people can listen to different cables and hear improvements.
 
I will say there is no actual difference. I will also say that people can (and clearly do) hear improvements with different cables. And so long as they are clear on the understanding that science proves there's no difference, I'm fine with that. If you or someone else is happier, and perceives improvements with cables, that's fine.
 
The point I'm trying to make is that the two conflicting views are not necessarily mutually exclusive. And again, so long as you understand the science, if cables make you happier with your system then go for it. I'll even say it's probably worth the investment.
 
Now I'll just have to hide from people on both sides of the fence...

I agree with you JxK. I was a believer, until I made my own interconnect and some other cables and then read every blind/ABX test I could find on the internet.  Those who say I can hear a difference come unstuck when presented with a blind test, or refuse to take part as they are 'flawed'. But, I am quite happy that they still say they can hear a difference for the placebo effect you mention.

 

[Currawong]

Quote:

From page 1 of this thread, I give you proof...tried and tested since 1983.
 
That said, there's no accounting for human perception and the power of suggestion. I posted this story in another thread, but I believe it's worth posting again. I've spoken with a self proclaimed audiophile who used expensive silver cables for his speakers. When asked, I found that he understood and (get this!) agreed that the science proves his cables make no difference. Upon further questioning, he admitted being unable to hear a difference in DBT. But such was the power of suggestion and all those years of believing he heard a difference that when he saw those silver cables, despite all knowledge to the contrary, he perceived an improvement.
 
So was it worth the money? Tough call.
 
I do think that people need to understand that science and testing prove, beyond any and all reasonable doubt that aftermarket cables are a scam. But if after understanding this they still "hear" improvements, well, who am I to tell them differently. After all, it has been shown that placebo can still be effective even when patients know they are taking a placebo.

Your post is a lovely demonstration of how anti-cable people abuse science as proof of their arguments.  You talk about speaker cables and link to a page about why aftermarket speaker cables are BS, yet use this to generalise all cables.  OOPS!  This kind of attitude makes it no more worth discussing than discussing spirituality in a forum full of religious fanatics.

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

I agree with you JxK. I was a believer, until I made my own interconnect and some other cables and then read every blind/ABX test I could find on the internet.  Those who say I can hear a difference come unstuck when presented with a blind test, or refuse to take part as they are 'flawed'. But, I am quite happy that they still say they can hear a difference for the placebo effect you mention.

It's good that you've found your own comfort zone on the issue.  Now you can move on and concentrate on other things.  It makes for a better focus on the music and the rest of your gear.  I'm with Jazz in that I don't mind the uncertainty and my comfort zone is currently that I trust my own ears.    I recable my cans and do appreciate the improvements when they occur.  It's not all the time that this happens, but when it does, I do appreciate it and move on.
 
Just how much else do you need to convince yourself about anyway.  Don't for a minute think that the mental tom-foolery stops with cables.  

 

[Head Injury]

Quote:

Your post is a lovely demonstration of how anti-cable people abuse science as proof of their arguments.  You talk about speaker cables and link to a page about why aftermarket speaker cables are BS, yet use this to generalise all cables.  OOPS!  This kind of attitude makes it no more worth discussing than discussing spirituality in a forum full of religious fanatics.

Can I ask what the difference between speaker cable and interconnects would be? Or why one would change the sound and one wouldn't?
 
Headphone cables as well, of course. And the internal wirings of amps, because some people prefer silver or something for those too.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Slightly off topic. Anyone heard of Sennheiser, AKG, or Sony purchasing a cable company? One instance? Food for thought.
 
 
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[Prog Rock Man]

Quote:

Slightly off topic. Anyone heard of Sennheiser, AKG, or Sony purchasing a cable company? One instance? Food for thought.
 
 
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It is not a whole company purchase, but Goldring use QED to make their cables. 
 
http://goldring.co.uk/headphones/ns1000.htm
 
"Detachable, single sided 1m cable, designed by Britain's leading hi fi cable manufacturer, QED"

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

It is not a whole company purchase, but Goldring use QED to make their cables. http://www.goldring.co.uk/headphones/ns1000.htm.
 
"Detachable, single sided 1m cable, designed by Britain's leading hi fi cable manufacturer, QED"

The period at the end messes up the link. Otherwise, got it. Thanks.
 
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Goldring?!?
http://www.goldring.co.uk/headphones/ns1000.htm
 
 
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[Prog Rock Man]

I have sorted the link and why the lol? 

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

I have sorted the link and why the lol? 

Sorry, I have never heard of Goldring.
 
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"lol" sorted
 
 
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[Prog Rock Man]

Neither had I until the NS1000s started to get very good reviews and then went from £160 to £50, so I got some! But the QED cable is only 1 m long and I needed longer. So I got a Sony headphone extension cable off Amazon for £5 and straight away, to me it sounded thin and tinny compared to just with the QED cable. So I bought another from ThatCable on ebay for £5 and the fullness of the sound returned.
 
I am sure the ThatCable has a higher placebo rating

.
 
 

 

[nick_charles]

Quote:

Sorry, I have never heard of Goldring.

 
Peasant

 
Turntables, cartridges, very popular british audio manufacturer back in the 60s/70s !
 

 

[JohnFerrier]

Okay, okay. I stand sorted. Wasn't I on a side? Where did JxK go?!?
 
 
lol

 

[rsw1959]

Interesting topic.  Does this mean Ken ALO is ripping off people?  That is, he mod's headphones generally only by adding new cables?  Is this just a compete waste of money? 

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Interesting topic.  Does this mean Ken ALO is ripping off people?  That is, he mod's headphones generally only by adding new cables?  Is this just a compete waste of money? 

What do you think?
 
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He sells to ppl's imaginations? Is that a rip off?
 
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Quote:

I have not read through this entire thread, but to the OP, do you believe that ALO is basically a giant sham, making money off products that do absolutely nothing to improve sq?

 
hmmm . . . two ppl questioning ALO . . .

 
 
.

 

[dallan]

Glad my ears don't get over questioned when listening to dacs, amps and sources and be told that it is just my imagination or I may still be using an ipod hp jack out to the white earbuds.......other than that it is just placebo because you can see the earphones are different and there is this cool toy between it ect. ect......and besides you can't trust yourself from fooling you, so just chuck that ridiculous hobby why don't you.  Can you believe people are actually tricking you into headphone amplifiers and dacs!  They come build in.