[abheybir]

Absolutely! However, these differences are typically at levels that are magnitudes below the threshold of audibility unless something is broken or a pathological use case is observed, such as a 2000-foot 24 AWG speaker wire attempting to drive 200W RMS transducer to ear-splitting volumes.

2000foot, damn!! well no offense I am just sharing my impressions based on different cables I have for my IEMs and headphones (silver, copper, hybrids). I don't think its some placebo.

 

[sonitus mirus]

2000foot, damn!! well no offense I am just sharing my impressions based on different cables I have for my IEMs and headphones (silver, copper, hybrids). I don't think its some placebo.

As has been mentioned quite a bit, IEMs and very sensitive headphones may be impacted by otherwise minor but measurable differences that would not typically make any observable difference with the majority of connections. Though, the difference from commonly used materials, all other things being equal, is easily shown through simple mathematics equations that it would be impossible for a human to detect any audible changes. It would still follow basic rules of LRC, it is only that a smaller value could be responsible for a difference that could be heard.

 

[bigshot]

When you go to Amazon and shop for an interconnect, it's been designed to perform transparently for the purpose of connecting one audio component to another. It doesn't matter if it's silver or copper, it has been designed to sound the same- perfect. The only time cables sound different is when you are using the wrong cable for the purpose, like the example Sonitus points out with certain non standard IEMs.

I am just sharing my impressions based on different cables I have for my IEMs and headphones (silver, copper, hybrids). I don't think its some placebo.

The way to know for sure is to do a simple line level matched, direct A/B switched blind listening test. EVERYONE is subject to expectation bias, including you and me. The way to eliminate that possibility is to not just depend on what you feel is correct, but to take the time to actually check and see with a controlled comparison.

 

[Claypole]

Do people still claim that copper cables sound smooth and warm, whilst silver ones are bright and airy, with sparkly highs? What if they made a cable out of gold? Would that be smooth and warm, but also bright and airy with sparkly highs?

Has anybody successfully guessed what material a cable is made out of from a DBT? Or do they need to read the marketing guff before hearing these differences? (Night and day differences that can’t be measured).

 

[sonitus mirus]

Do people still claim that copper cables sound smooth and warm, whilst silver ones are bright and airy, with sparkly highs? What if they made a cable out of gold? Would that be smooth and warm, but also bright and airy with sparkly highs?

Has anybody successfully guessed what material a cable is made out of from a DBT? Or do they need to read the marketing guff before hearing these differences? (Night and day differences that can’t be measured).

Lot's of people still do make ludicrous claims, including many audio review sites, more than a few engineers, and plenty of other experts in the audio industry. For every fact you throw at the issue to support known science, there are an equal number of irrational and conflated excuses to illogically refute this science. It is practically a hopeless endeavor to rationalize with the other side and correct the misconceptions.

 

[Maxx134]

Tonally it sounded the same but for whatever reason the staging and imaging improved over the stock cable. A

I believe I have a possible reason or culprit. Crosstalk. Poor insulation between wires.

Longer cables should have higher resistance

But music is like an "AC" signal, continuously changing in frequency, so what you should say is "impedance".
If every component has RLC, we would have changes according to frequency.

I like to offer speculations in this thread (in the past), because I always get great answers to suggestions.

This time I like to propose a possible element not totally considered.
Magnetism.
It is involved with electricity, hand in hand, but not discussed.

Quote:
"Electricity and magnetism are essentially two aspects of the same thing, because a changing electric field creates a magnetic field, and a changing magnetic field creates an electric field. (This is why physicists usually refer to "electromagnetism" or "electromagnetic" forces together, rather than separately.)"

What if the wires are (because of the electrons) creating stray magnetism?
Would that interference affect nearby conductors? Especially because of such changes of frequency in music?

Regardless, I do feel insulation is very important, especially for headphone cables.

Do people still claim that copper cables sound smooth and warm, whilst silver ones are bright and airy, with sparkly highs? What if they made a cable out of gold? Would that be smooth and warm, but also bright and airy with sparkly highs?

Yes... Goollddaa.. its better.
Gold sounds "golden"

 

[bigshot]

Crosstalk is the left channel and right channel bleeding together. Do you think the wires were crossed and it was turning to mono? Crosstalk is very rare with modern home audio. It was a big thing back when tape heads went out of align, or grooves in LPs got hot and bled across. The only way a wire could cross with another wire is if bare wires were touching.

Magnetism? uh... no. Generally insulation in headphone cables is important for microphonics. That's acoustic, not electronic.

 

[Paul Mohr]

I think it was in my head to be honest. I have stressed lately due to my mothers death and all that comes with it since I was her guardian. Lately nothing sounds the same to me or as good to be honest. When I am feeling a bit better I am going to try it again multiple times. I am willing to bet in the end I probably won't be able to tell the difference. Or one day one will sound better and the next the other one will. Which means its me.

And no, magnitism doesn't not effect music signals. As in having a magnet near a cable or something. I have tried it. Now it will effect a signal if its used in choke coil or something like in a crossover. They aslo use magnetic cores to remove hum in some power cables. So I wouldn't suggest wrapping your heaphone cable around one or anything lol. I am not an engineer or tech though. I am sure someone else here could explain exactly how magnatic fields work. And I don't think the electricity in audio could create a magnetic field. I just don't think that is how it works. A transformer is basically an electro magnet I think. Someone correct me if I am wrong. 8th grade science was a LONG time ago for me lol.

 

[Maxx134]

I think it was in my head to be honest

One thing you should never do in audio, is doubt yourself. Don't let your scientific side of your brain, stop you from enjoying the artistic musical side.
If it sounds better one day enjoy it.
Some days it doesn't sound as good.
Your mind has everything to do with perception. Sometimes you can perceive more.

As in having a magnet near a cable or something

Static magnets don't count.
Quote:
"Static magnetic fields are not described by a simple formula, because magnets always have a north pole and a south pole, so the magnetic field always loops from one pole to the other."

Also, I disagree with comments to the contrary. Magnetism cannot be discounted.
Quote:
"moving (changing currents, aka music) give rise to magnetic fields"
"Likewise, changing magnetic fields gives rise to electric currents"
They are intertwined. You cannot dismiss them. A "moving" electrical charge creates a magnet field.

I am not speculating on audible effects.
I am just stating what exists.
Anything else would be conjecture.
I did propose it as a "possible explanation" but if you rather use the age old "brain fooling you" explanation, then how can science progress forward.
Theories need observation to be validated, but when you take away "observation" with "its in your head" reasoning, then we have a stumbling block of doubt.

Actually I am using a narrow viewpoint, just to get my idea across.
Feel free to counter my points.

 

[bigshot]

Can you explain to me why magnetism would make the signal in one channel cross over into another channel in a separate wire? Is this something you actually think is likely?

 

[Maxx134]

Can you explain to me why magnetism would make the signal in one channel cross over into another channel in a separate wire? Is this something you actually think is likely?

Actually I rather not be boxed into that speculation of it being the actual signal, but instead an interference on the actual signal.
I have only been proposing insulation is more important than considered.

As for crossing from one conductor ro another. It looks terribly bad when you see all the braiding in headphone cables. So one reasons come to mind.
"induction" created on a wire from an external magnetic field.


If you don't think magnet force not exist explain the reason why they tell you to turn off all electrical devices on a plane when taking off.
Electrical devices give off electro magnetic waves of interference.

 

[bigshot]

Actually I rather not be boxed into that speculation of it being the actual signal, but instead an interference on the actual signal.

The problem is that crosstalk isn't interference. It's the blending of two channels to reduce separation. That is what affects soundstage, the same as crossfeed. If you want to talk about interference, the most common one is RF interference, and it is obvious as noise that is separate from the signal, not crosstalk between two stereo channels. And RF isn't caused by insulation, it is caused by inadequate shielding.

It's great to speculate, but speculation doesn't mean much if you don't understand the principles you're speculating about. This isn't my bailiwick, but I know enough about it to know what crosstalk isn't.

I'm honestly not trying to trick you or box you into a corner with arguments. I'm just trying to focus my end of the conversation on things that are actual possibilities here. I'm not big on pie in the sky theories.

 

[castleofargh]

I believe I have a possible reason or culprit. Crosstalk. Poor insulation between wires.

Sure, crosstalk is a thing. For some specific tasks, it’s something we have to take very seriously, and for some cables, we even have to be careful about short lengths of straight wires while terminating them. And then for other stuff, it’s irrelevant until crosstalk reaches a massive amount.
IMO, How the aliens managed to kidnapped me, should be on our minds after we have been able to confirm that aliens exist, and that I was kidnapped.

But yes, it’s about magnetic fields(crosstalk from wires. For aliens’ kidnapping method, IDK).

 

[someguyontheinternet]

I had only one instance where I was using a USB cable to my DAC that happened to cross my keyboard's USB cable and that actually did create an audible effect.
It was annoying trying to figure out where the problem came from. One day I accidentally dropped the Fiio Q1 I was using at that time from my display stand and the noise was gone. When I put it back the noise also came back. I slowly went from one position to the other and noticed the noise appeared exactly when the USB cable for my keyboard and the USB cable for the Q1 crossed.

So I guess it can happen. Using an old USB cable I had lying around solved the problem though. My guess is that the cable I used to connect the Q1 was simply of bad quality and that this problem should not appear too frequently. Since I never spend any amount over 10€ on USB cables I don't think it's a common problem, especially not a problem worth spending hundreds of $ (or more) on.

 

[Lumithium]

Few weeks ago I went to an audio shop and I was lucky enough to try out MAD24 with different PWaudio cables. And here's my thoughts.

I only heard MAD24 once before that and it was a month prior in AV show, which is very noisy on its own. And I have no recent experience of PWaudio cable rolling. I never heard of Gold 24, Monile, Antigoma and it's feat. 60 varient before. The salesperson purposefully didn't tell me anything about the cables, their name, prices, their materials etc, beforehand and told me just listen and tell him my thoughts. The Gold 24 cable aside, this is pretty much as blind as it gets, as there is no price bias, and I can't even tell which cable is which just by the looks because they are all almost identical.

In the few hours of testing, I was able to tell the difference between Gold 24 and the rest pretty easily. I can feel the separation and space between the sound being slightly different and it sounds more revealing, though not by a significant margin.

The rest of the cables aren't as clear of a cut. I was able to tell the slight difference between feat 60 and it's original shielding version. One had slightly more distinct sound while the feat. 60 sounds a little more musical. However when I try to find the difference between Monile and Antigoma, I couldn't. There is maybe a very slight sound difference but I couldn't pinpoint it consistently. At first I thought he just throws an extra pair of Antigoma to throw me off. I was only convinced after he show me the name of the cable. All these cables did show cables do make a difference, at least on the analog side.

And there is absolutely no way I will know the difference between the cables in everyday use as I was testing them in the best case scenario possible, a pretty quiet room that has a lower noise floor than my home.