I didn't realize Penon's range of higher-end cables are available on a separate store before Googling them, here's a link in case anyone else searched Penonaudio.com in vain. The Draco looks like quite a beast!
I didn't realize Penon's range of higher-end cables are available on a separate store before Googling them, here's a link in case anyone else searched Penonaudio.com in vain. The Draco looks like quite a beast!
Another from Rhapsodio just arrived, the Copper Wizard mk2. It's four wires of some sort of copper, with some sort of special shielding, with a very neutral, high-resolution sound. Currently enjoying it on my S-EM9 and I think it's a winning combo. It's a little hard to wrestle into submission though!
I think you misunderstood the intention of the dual connectors. The signal plug can be single-ended or balanced, the other plug is still used for ground shielding only, only question is where do you plug this in to achieve active shielding.
Reminds me of a story I read about HSA Venom's creation from late last year. A fellow audiophile approached HSA with this idea of making a cable with this dual connector design so that he could use one 2.5 mm balanced connector with his AK DAP and a separate 3.5 mm plug that goes to his Mass Kobo amp to provide a cleaner, darker background. HSA took this idea and eventually created the Venom.
This means you can really plug the grounding plug somewhere that's separate from the signal ground, doesn't have to be the same device as long as active shielding is working. You don't want to introduce more noise by plugging this plug to the wrong place of course.
So where would you plug the grounded end into the Hugo2? obviously I need the 3.5 for sound thr question is where to ground. I'd really like to get this resolved. I've put my order on hold until I know the best configuration for the H2. I'm leaning toward dual 3.5's, the only thing I know for sure is that adapters are bad and I dont want to the default cable since it'll require a 2.5 to 3.5 for signal. It would seem to me by plugging the ground into the coaxial on H2, you'd just be introducing more noise since that port has music going to it. Maybe I'm wrong.
So where would you plug the grounded end into the Hugo2? obviously I need the 3.5 for sound thr question is where to ground. I'd really like to get this resolved. I've put my order on hold until I know the best configuration for the H2. I'm leaning toward dual 3.5's, the only thing I know for sure is that adapters are bad and I dont want to the default cable since it'll require a 2.5 to 3.5 for signal. It would seem to me by plugging the ground into the coaxial on H2, you'd just be introducing more noise since that port has music going to it. Maybe I'm wrong.
Let me try to ask HSA for you because I don't have a Hugo 2. When you auditioned the Venom, which device did you use? It seems like the best way to figure this out is to play with the Venom and try to plug/unplug the ground plug to different ports on the Hugo2. Maybe even leaving the ground plug un-plugged for comparison.
So where would you plug the grounded end into the Hugo2? obviously I need the 3.5 for sound thr question is where to ground. I'd really like to get this resolved. I've put my order on hold until I know the best configuration for the H2. I'm leaning toward dual 3.5's, the only thing I know for sure is that adapters are bad and I dont want to the default cable since it'll require a 2.5 to 3.5 for signal. It would seem to me by plugging the ground into the coaxial on H2, you'd just be introducing more noise since that port has music going to it. Maybe I'm wrong.
@Ike1985, I'm not sure if you've reached out to HSA directly, but here is what I know. Again, the dual plug was primarily intended to drain the ground shielding in a–balanced–2.5mm/ 3.5mm configuration. The main point is to keep the RF/EMI noise from the shielding ground out of the (pos/neg) signal channels. The popular 2.5mm balanced connector only has 4 poles. So HSA added a fifth pole via a separate 3.5mm connector as a dedicated, and separate, shield ground.
Since the Hugo2 only has–unbalanced–connectors, the ground is already separated from the signal channels. If you go with the dual 3.5 connectors the only benefit you can achieve is separating the signal ground from the shield ground (of course in a single 3.5 connector they have to share the sleeve). You can plug that into the Hugo2 coax. I don't think it will add noise because you're only using the ground pole.
The question is whether separating the shield ground from the signal ground is actually of benefit. Music Sanctuary responded to me in the affirmative in the email I'm quoting below. However, once you plug both connectors into the same device both grounds are joined to the common ground. You are just joining them in the device instead of at the connector. So, my strong suspicion is that this will only provide a negligible benefit.
The only way that it would truly make a difference is if you don't just–separate–the shield ground but–isolate–the shied ground. That is what was interesting to me about Ayang's post. You could, in theory, plug the shield ground 3.5 connector into an entirely different device altogether. This actually would produce the best result (in theory) of all the configurations because you have a truly isolated ground plane and not just separate grounds going into the common ground plane.
So (in theory) you could buy a second Hugo2 or AK SP1000 (w/ Cu), stack that with your Hugo2, and plug the second connector into that for the best grounding of all (grin). I don't know that does seem like a lot of effort though... then again, I get so easily confused... (grin). (@ayang02, I'm honestly just playing, please don't take any offense).
"If the signal's ground is shared with the shielding ground, the EMI and RF absorbed by the shielding will affect the signal ground at the point of connection. However, the benefit of a dedicated ground in the scenario of single end is not as big as the scenario of balanced signal" (Music-Sanctuary).
"If the signal's ground is shared with the shielding ground, the EMI and RF absorbed by the shielding will affect the signal ground at the point of connection. However, the benefit of a dedicated ground in the scenario of single end is not as big as the scenario of balanced signal" (Music-Sanctuary).
@edwardsean this and what you posted is correct. @Ike1985 I asked HSA about your Hugo 2 situation and it is also possible to omit the dual-connector design and just use a single 3.5 mm plug design where the ground shield shares the same ground as the signal ground. This may be more ideal if your original intention is to use the ground plug on other Hugo 2 ports. It is still a little bit better to isolate the grounds via different devices in your situation, but I think that's too much trouble for the minor potential improvement for all the hassle.
HSA also mentions the Hugo 2's low distortion as a factor and the single 3.5 mm design on the Venom should do pretty well on it.
@edwardsean this and what you posted is correct. @Ike1985 I asked HSA about your Hugo 2 situation and it is also possible to omit the dual-connector design and just use a single 3.5 mm plug design where the ground shield shares the same ground as the signal ground. This may be more ideal if your original intention is to use the ground plug on other Hugo 2 ports. It is still a little bit better to isolate the grounds via different devices in your situation, but I think that's too much trouble for the minor potential improvement for all the hassle.
HSA also mentions the Hugo 2's low distortion as a factor and the single 3.5 mm design on the Venom should do pretty well on it.
It is worth clarifying that isolating the shield ground with–different devices–may be worthwhile. This is what is novel about your idea of dual connectors using different devices. I'm not sure if that was even on the minds of HSA when they thought of this. I was joking, but if you are stationary, this would totally work. When I had time with the Venom I only had a DX200+amp8 with me (single 4.4mm output). So, I assumed I couldn't try out the active shielding. It did not occur to me to plug the 3.5 into a second device to try it out!
If @Ike1985 uses his Hugo2 as a desktop DAC and has other devices within reach, this would guarantee the purest shielding. If I were spending the money to get the Venom, and my use was primarily desktop over mobile, I would at least consider it.
Nevertheless, the Venom cable itself is... sublime. It has got to be among the top world class cables. It has everything: soundstage/imaging, air/separation, extension at both ends, natural timbral beauty, warmth and clarity, and, even without the dual connector, a black background.
I just noticed that In the past, we mostly saw gold plated silver cables as flagship line while in these days, manufacturers are working on using copper and so-called high quality shield as a flagship. Is it a loop cycle of cable technology now. Being copper then silver then add more gold then other valuable metal then come back to copper again.
Thanks for all the input guys. I've got an old Rio pmp3 player, those tiny little apple players and old CD players. Couldnt I just ground into one of them? I dont see why the ground had to be some fancy device. If thats true I'm thinking one of those tiny little apple players should do perfect and go hardly noticed. If the grounding device doesnt matter I'll likely go dual 3.5's with the goal of active grounding and avoiding connectors and would be required for Hugo 2 in the standard 2.5/3.5 version
Thanks for all the input guys. I've got an old Rio pmp3 player, those tiny little apple players and old CD players. Couldnt I just ground into one of them? I dont see why the ground had to be some fancy device. If thats true I'm thinking one of those tiny little apple players should do perfect and go hardly noticed. If the grounding device doesnt matter I'll likely go dual 3.5's with the goal of active grounding and avoiding connectors and would be required for Hugo 2 in the standard 2.5/3.5 version
@Ike1985, I was joking about the second Hugo2 or SP1000! I was going to say you could buy a DAVE to ground the unit but it only has a 6.3mm!
Yes, of course you could use any cheap player with a ground to casing.
I do have to mention just one more time that I'm not sure how much benefit you will be able to detect (vs. imagine). The case of separating shielding from signal in the 2.5mm/3.5mm is more clear. However, given the cost of the cable, and the novelty of the design, I truly understand you wanting to get all you can out of it.
I would be so curious to see your results after you take delivery. Please post back if you get the chance.
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