[Zurv]

here is the "can i run this" question

first a story.

I was going to get the Woo Wa33 (and ordered it), but then reality checked myself after seeing that i'd have to buy another $4k-$5k in tubes.
So i cancelled it and ordered a Wa22. That should be fine. (I moved my PrimaLuna EVO 400 to the Sopra N2 speakers, but still wanted some tube love'n at my desktop.)
With the money I "saved" by cancelling the Wa33 i order a Susvara.

I don't doubt that the Wa22 can drive this. Even on Woo's website if you lookup the Susvara one of the suggestions is the Wa22. But does it run it well?
the Wa22 is only 1.5 @ 60Ohm (right? 60 is what i'm looking at, right?)
(also... no one should buy the Susvara on woo's site. Holy cow don't buy these for $6k. You can get them for $1500-$2000 cheaper. Maybe more... but i couldn't find those deals.)

I'm never going to play very loud.

Here are the tubes i'm using, but i can't tell if changing the tubes changes the power output. (it does on the PL)
Tubes i'm going to use:
Tung Sol 5998 (NOS)
274B Sophia <-- cause it looks cool
CBS/Hytron 5692 (NOS)


I have the SPL Phonitor X which should have zero problems driving the Susvara. It is over 3w @60 ohms. But no tubey love.

Thoughts? Am i find at 1.5w? The "internet" seems to think I need min 1.6w.
Any tube changes that would bump the output?
Am i stressing this for no reason as i'm not going to play very lound?

(I could also use the wa22 as the pre to the phonitor x or pre to a amp. But that seems like a lot of extra work.)
Also.. i almost never use headphones too speakers>>>> * ... yes i know i'm on head-fi - but not getting yelled at by wife > *

 

[ThanatosVI]

here is the "can i run this" question

first a story.

I was going to get the Woo Wa33 (and ordered it), but then reality checked myself after seeing that i'd have to buy another $4k-$5k in tubes.
So i cancelled it and ordered a Wa22. That should be fine. (I moved my PrimaLuna EVO 400 to the Sopra N2 speakers, but still wanted some tube love'n at my desktop.)
With the money I "saved" by cancelling the Wa33 i order a Susvara.

I don't doubt that the Wa22 can drive this. Even on Woo's website if you lookup the Susvara one of the suggestions is the Wa22. But does it run it well?
the Wa22 is only 1.5 @ 60Ohm (right? 60 is what i'm looking at, right?)
(also... no one should buy the Susvara on woo's site. Holy cow don't buy these for $6k. You can get them for $1500-$2000 cheaper. Maybe more... but i couldn't find those deals.)

I'm never going to play very loud.

Here are the tubes i'm using, but i can't tell if changing the tubes changes the power output. (it does on the PL)
Tubes i'm going to use:
Tung Sol 5998 (NOS)
274B Sophia <-- cause it looks cool
CBS/Hytron 5692 (NOS)


I have the SPL Phonitor X which should have zero problems driving the Susvara. It is over 3w @60 ohms. But no tubey love.

Thoughts? Am i find at 1.5w? The "internet" seems to think I need min 1.6w.
Any tube changes that would bump the output?
Am i stressing this for no reason as i'm not going to play very lound?

(I could also use the wa22 as the pre to the phonitor x or pre to a amp. But that seems like a lot of extra work.)
Also.. i almost never use headphones too speakers>>>> * ... yes i know i'm on head-fi - but not getting yelled at by wife > *

Actually imo stock tubes on Wa33 would have been the better choice, than going for the Wa22.

When you don't go loud you"ll be totally fine with 1.5W. However general consensus is that there is still untapped potential in that case.
In other words it will be good, but the worst enemy of something good is something better...

 

[Pashmeister]

here is the "can i run this" question

first a story.

I was going to get the Woo Wa33 (and ordered it), but then reality checked myself after seeing that i'd have to buy another $4k-$5k in tubes.
So i cancelled it and ordered a Wa22. That should be fine. (I moved my PrimaLuna EVO 400 to the Sopra N2 speakers, but still wanted some tube love'n at my desktop.)
With the money I "saved" by cancelling the Wa33 i order a Susvara.

I don't doubt that the Wa22 can drive this. Even on Woo's website if you lookup the Susvara one of the suggestions is the Wa22. But does it run it well?
the Wa22 is only 1.5 @ 60Ohm (right? 60 is what i'm looking at, right?)
(also... no one should buy the Susvara on woo's site. Holy cow don't buy these for $6k. You can get them for $1500-$2000 cheaper. Maybe more... but i couldn't find those deals.)

I'm never going to play very loud.

Here are the tubes i'm using, but i can't tell if changing the tubes changes the power output. (it does on the PL)
Tubes i'm going to use:
Tung Sol 5998 (NOS)
274B Sophia <-- cause it looks cool
CBS/Hytron 5692 (NOS)


I have the SPL Phonitor X which should have zero problems driving the Susvara. It is over 3w @60 ohms. But no tubey love.

Thoughts? Am i find at 1.5w? The "internet" seems to think I need min 1.6w.
Any tube changes that would bump the output?
Am i stressing this for no reason as i'm not going to play very lound?

(I could also use the wa22 as the pre to the phonitor x or pre to a amp. But that seems like a lot of extra work.)
Also.. i almost never use headphones too speakers>>>> * ... yes i know i'm on head-fi - but not getting yelled at by wife > *

My opinion is that Wa22 is not enough. Sorry, I know you said you already ordered it but I think you’ll also find several others who would agree that Wa22 will not drive the Sus to its full potential.

 

[Zurv]

Actually imo stock tubes on Wa33 would have been the better choice, than going for the Wa22.

When you don't go loud you"ll be totally fine with 1.5W. However general consensus is that there is still untapped potential in that case.
In other words it will be good, but the worst enemy of something good is something better...

what the what? what happened to your fancy german tube thingy. I thought that was your end game.

I can always use the SPL.. that has tons of power. The wa22 can be for the Utopia (and the crappy empy. *poke* *poke* I know you like them.. )
If i had picked up the wa33 i would not have bought the susvara. remember, I'm saving money..

I could always use the susvara on the PrimaLuna evo 400 (with the KT150s)

hrmm.. maybe the mj2 too. But i was planning to put that in storage. But i did just get some sexy tubes for it.


Anyone connecting the Susvara to Schiit amps? schiit aegir? ie, wa22 as a pre. Or maybe the susvara doesn't like the tubes as much other other headphones.


Another reason for no wa33 was it is huge. That is part of reasoning to moved the PL from my desktop area. I was starting to look silly.
to much going on!

 

[ThanatosVI]

what the what? what happened to your fancy german tube thingy. I thought that was your end game.

I can always use the SPL.. that has tons of power. The wa22 can be for the Utopia (and the crappy empy. *poke* *poke* I know you like them.. )
If i had picked up the wa33 i would not have bought the susvara. remember, I'm saving money..

I could always use the susvara on the PrimaLuna evo 400 (with the KT150s)

hrmm.. maybe the mj2 too. But i was planning to put that in storage. But i did just get some sexy tubes for it.


Anyone connecting the Susvara to Schiit amps? schiit aegir? ie, wa22 as a pre. Or maybe the susvara doesn't like the tubes as much other other headphones.


Another reason for no wa33 was it is huge. That is part of reasoning to moved the PL from my desktop area. I was starting to look silly.
to much going on!

My fancy german tube thingy is awesome, why do you think something happened?
This is my endgame.
I won't replace it like ever... maybe I add more amps like the Wa33 but currently even that urge is quite low.

I might add a few new tubes though

Your PrimaLuna will drive the Susvara fine though, plenty of power for the energy moloch

 

[FLTWS]

... Your PrimaLuna will drive the Susvara fine though, plenty of power for the energy moloch...

I have the EVO 400 as well with KT88's. Could the speaker taps be a better alternative with Susvara as opposed to the 1/4" output?
Thanks.

 

[llamaluv]

On a different note, chances are that Resolve / Andrew will be re-doing a Susvara review but this time driven by the Bakoon 13r as well as speaker amps.

I noticed that his comparison of the Utopia and the Susvara (with comments on the Bakoon along the way) is up.

Wow though, this is the first time I've seen a video of his, and I agree, he's thoughtful and articulate, really impressed.

 

[ThanatosVI]

I have the EVO 400 as well with KT88's. Could the speaker taps be a better alternative with Susvara as opposed to the 1/4" output?
Thanks.

I'm not entirely sure how the resistor on the headphone out is implemented.

Potentially it could be better, but if doing so you should put a parallel resistor on the speaker taps, so that it "looks" like 8 Ohm load to the amp.

It is also possible that this is the only thing that happens on the headphone out and the results will be exactly the same.

 

[FLTWS]

I'm not entirely sure how the resistor on the headphone out is implemented.

Potentially it could be better, but if doing so you should put a parallel resistor on the speaker taps, so that it "looks" like 8 Ohm load to the amp.

It is also possible that this is the only thing that happens on the headphone out and the results will be exactly the same.

 

[Zurv]

oh poopy... even less money saved. I'm going to change my order to the to the Wa5-LE. My dealer must hate me.. (well.. a little .. because i'm still spending money.)

 

[geoffalter11]

You may have a LEX as the LE intimates. I have a X2 although I've heard all of his variations and feel all but the X6 are really supreme.

So, I did some more research. The HE-5 used for my Code X is not a HE-LE. It is a HE-5 re-issue. I believe that makes it a Code X3. My HE-5 just says HE-5, there is no LE on the gimbals. Does that make sense? Not that it matters that much, it sounds amazing nonetheless.

My demo time with the Susvara has ended. I loved spending a couple weeks with it. The best way to explain it is through food and restaurants since that is my profession. The Susvara is like eating at Per Se or The French Laundry. The Code X3 is like eating at Zuni Cafe or Chez Panisse. Per Se and French Laundry are arguably the best restaurants in the US. I want to eat at Zuni or Chez Panisse every day.

I couldn't get the Susvara to sound great every day. It is so picky. My Code X3 sounds great at all times. But, my Stellia and Bottlehead Mainline together are my favorite. It matches my system better. The Susvara was the most detailed headphone I have ever heard. So happy to spend that time learning and evolving. My next demo will be the LCD-4z. I will have to find that thread for my impressions. Thanks all for the spirited conversation.

 

[tunes]

What is the best/easiest way to detect a defective Susvara with channel imbalance issues??!

 

[thecrow]

What is the best/easiest way to detect a defective Susvara with channel imbalance issues??!

Would there be some video on youtube that has a guide/test where it moves sound from one earcup to the other and in between? and hence you can determine where the sound is coming from when sound is supposed to be in the middle.

i’ve never looked for one but there probably is

just a thought

 

[sahmen]

What is the best/easiest way to detect a defective Susvara with channel imbalance issues??!

This could be a tough one, if the perceived imbalance is coming from some place in the chain other than the Susvara itself (i.e. DAC, Amp, or even the listeners own ears). Personally, I would begin by reversing the position of the caps on the ears, i.e. by positioning the left cap on the right and vice versa, and see whether the perceived imbalance also reverses its order or stays the same... Next I will flip the headphone plugs as well, sending the right plug to the left and the left one to the right, and see whether the perceived imbalance also switches sides or whether the balance remain skewed in the same way...

Another quick way would be to listen to the same tracks on the same system with a different headphone, so that you can compare the sense of balance in the two presentations... If you could borrow someone else's Susvara to try out on your system, that might be the best and quickest way to find out whether one of them is defective. But I think other headphones too might work.

Here's a related anecdote : There was a time when I thought either my Susvara or one of my amps was exhibiting channel imbalance. The problem is that i only used to feel that sense of imbalance when the Susvara was paired with that particular amp and not the others. I even sent that amp back to the dealers, who tested it for free. When they did, they found it to be free of any imbalance. So I chalked it down to the way the Susvara handles imaging (or the positioning of certain instruments) when paired with that particular amp. The bottom line seemed to be that this particular amp (which I am not naming, because it is a great amp with a good reputation, and should not be judged "poor" simply on the basis of how well it drives the Susvara or not) was not driving the susvara in a way that allows it to flex its muscles in an optimal manner, even though it is otherwise a powerful amp. A more recent amp I got (the Pathos InPol Ear) drives the Susvara more effortlessly, and allows it to distribute instruments and sounds in a way that sounds more "natural" and "true to life;" The center of gravity of the sound field might seemingly swing from left to right on occasion, and from right to left when it is called for by the music as it is mixed at the source.... Likewise, the sonic weights also distributes themselves evenly on each side in a nicely balanced way, when such a balance is called for by the source. I should say that this "balance is the more predominant pattern. Either way, the music sounds "natural," and seems to emerge naturally from the sound field, and does not give rise to any sense that something is "skewed," a feeling which could be quite irksome under certain circumstances.

These are just practical ideas that occurred to me as I read your question. I am no expert, so take it for what its worth .

 

[sahmen]

So, I did some more research. The HE-5 used for my Code X is not a HE-LE. It is a HE-5 re-issue. I believe that makes it a Code X3. My HE-5 just says HE-5, there is no LE on the gimbals. Does that make sense? Not that it matters that much, it sounds amazing nonetheless.

My demo time with the Susvara has ended. I loved spending a couple weeks with it. The best way to explain it is through food and restaurants since that is my profession. The Susvara is like eating at Per Se or The French Laundry. The Code X3 is like eating at Zuni Cafe or Chez Panisse. Per Se and French Laundry are arguably the best restaurants in the US. I want to eat at Zuni or Chez Panisse every day.

I couldn't get the Susvara to sound great every day. It is so picky. My Code X3 sounds great at all times. But, my Stellia and Bottlehead Mainline together are my favorite. It matches my system better. The Susvara was the most detailed headphone I have ever heard. So happy to spend that time learning and evolving. My next demo will be the LCD-4z. I will have to find that thread for my impressions. Thanks all for the spirited conversation.

Interesting! Reminds me of what my He6SE makes me feel sometimes about the Susvara, although I do feel lucky to have both, as they provide me with tickets to a French Laundry and a Chez Panisse, both excellent choices

By the way, interesting culinary metaphors!