[mandrake50]

"some old reviews" ?? Which ones, by who??
Meaning maybe one person, or a couple, out of all of the reviews out there on the 560, uses that 90% baloney. If you are satisfied with the 400i I say, stay with it! When the headphones were at their original pricing, many thought it was well worth the difference to buy the 560. At today's prices, it may not be a no-brainer, but the price of admission is close enough that if you have any level of curiosity, it is not going to break the bank to satisfy that itch!.
The fact is I have no idea what someone means when they talk about 100% of the 560. Does this mean in the areas of timbre, Detail, micro detail, sound stage, bass, midrange, treble, distortion?? How can all of this be combined into one number and called 100%? The 560 is simply a very, very significantly different headphone from the 400i in many ways. For one I don't think that the tonality of the 560 is comparable to the 400i in any reasonable way. They are tuned much differently. Comparatively the 560 is on the bright (upper midrange) side of neutral. I find the 400i to be on the warm side of neutral. In many ways I like listening to more genres of music with the 400i than with the 560.
If we move to soundstage and detail retrieval, I don't feel that the 400i is even 70% of the 560. But these are meaningless numbers, just as the 90% number is. And it is based on one persons perception (mine). Just the same as that 90% that you seem so motivated to throw out there time after time is based on a limited number of personal perceptions. Because one or even a few people said it, just does not make it so. But if it is a convenient rationalization that allows you to save a few bucks, by all means go with it.

BTW, do you have links to the posts that contained this 90% arbitrary number? I would be interested in understanding who said it and what the context was. Just because someone throws out an opinion on Head-Fi or in a review elsewhere does not mean that rises to the level of fact! For me, there are only a handful of people that I have followed for years, and have similar tastes to mine, who would write something like that where I would pay it more than a passing amount of attention, much less take it as gospel.

The best thing you could do in this situation is to get 560 and do some serious listening. Then you can make a decision on what percentage applies.

 

[leeperry]

So nice of you to chime in with you three double question marks and exclamation marks every 2 lines, I am so impressed. There might as well be something wrong with your keyboard, I'd have that looked up if I were you but last I checked I was talking to pataburd

Here's one of those old reviews, "old" as in "SMC": https://www.lifewire.com/hifiman-he-400i-review-3134556

We had a chance to compare the HE-400i to the HE-560 and were happy to hear that both headphones sounded quite similar. we can't say the HE-560 comes across as more detailed, but it does sound more neutral to our ears (with what sounded like a more subdued and smoother peak in the lower treble). Would we pay the extra $400 for the HE-560 (which also has handsome wooden earpieces)? It would be a tough decision for many.

I got that 90% figure from one of the 400i reviews on top of google search results, anyways I guess I'll grab a 560 down the line but pataburd was throwing some subjective impressions so I figured I could ask HIM what he thoughts of the 400i/560 sonic differences.

 

[Raketen]

Sounds great on balanced output with my geekout v2+ high gain. Of course,I haven't tried other powerful amps to compare

^^This! One of the better pairings I've heard with them, portable and desktop included.

Do you guys find the treble on this combo to be a little brittle sounding particularly with acoustic instruments? Curious about this since all my gear is portable & V2+inf is my most powerful so wondering if this is just a property of the headphone or if I am underamping it

Though, I also haven't completed the manual's recommended 150 hrs burn in yet... Not my usual practice (seriously, a ****** week?!) , but hey, if the manual says so!) Otherwise find the sound quite enjoyable.

 

[ZekeAdebayo]

Have any current Aeon owners owned a Hifiman He-560 in the past? I was wondering how those two headphones compare since I own the He-560s. Although it's a bit off topic I'm split on a decision to either upgrade my car stereo system in my 09 Altima ( from stock to higher quality after market) or headphones (whichever doesn't get upgraded now will be updated in the future). The Stereo system I'm thinking of will include the Pioneer avh-4200Nex (can get it for 450) Focal ps165 v1 6.5' as my 6.5" in the fronts (I'm still deciding on the deck speakers and sub though), the sub will be something around the level of the Focals though to have a well rounded system.

Sorry to go off topic like that, any info/feedback will be greatly appreciated though.

 

[mandrake50]

They are hard to directly compare as one is open the other closed. Someone mentioned above the 560 sounding brittle... it can do that with some systems and on some tracks. The Aeon, is a much more pleasant headphone to listen to from my perspective. Bass is fuller and the headphone is just much closer to neutral. For me, the fact that the Aeon is closed has some real advantages... I can actually listen to it at work for one. I think a case can be made for better width and depth from the 560s sound field. But most seem to agree that the Aeon has a very nice presentation of space for a closed headphone. From a tonality standpoint, I would take the Aeon every time. One thing to consider though, at todays pricing, the Aeon is quite a bit more expensive. For me, and having two sets of 560s, I would still buy the Aeon, knowing what I do. Of course this is simply my perception.

 

[Weez]

I’m tempted to order a pair of Electro-Harmonix Gold for my Schiit Lyr 2. Is EH Gold and 560 a good match?

 

[DavidA]

I’m tempted to order a pair of Electro-Harmonix Gold for my Schiit Lyr 2. Is EH Gold and 560 a good match?

Decent tubes for the price, I prefer 74-75 Reflektor, Siemens or Telefunkens with the HE560 but these tubes are over priced these days.

 

[Weez]

Thanks, for the input. I’m currently not willing to pay the asking price for Siemens and Telefunken tubes, however the Reflector tubes are within my budget and they seem like an interesting alternative to the EH Gold tubes. Time to read up on tubes

 

[DavidA]

Thanks, for the input. I’m currently not willing to pay the asking price for Siemens and Telefunken tubes, however the Reflector tubes are within my budget and they seem like an interesting alternative to the EH Gold tubes. Time to read up on tubes

Agree about the current asking price for Telefunken and Siemens tubes these days since its about 4 times what I got them for 2/3 years ago. One thing I would suggest for the HE560 is tubes that are slightly on the warmer side or very clean in the higher frequencies since the HE560 can get sibilant/harsh in the highs with some tracks/genres.

 

[peter123]

Fwiw I've got EH Gold pins in my tube DAC that I like to use with the HE560, I've got some NOS Ei tubes for it as well but haven't tried them with the HE560 yet.

About the Geek Out V2+ I don't find it to make the top end more strident than other quality amps and I'm sure it has enough power for the HE560.

 

[LCMusicLover]

Even with tubes, the HE-560 can sound somewhat lifeless to my ears. Very detailed? Yes. Are the players well placed in space? Yes. But tonally . . . wanting. When I a/b the HE-560 with the Martin Logan Mikros 90, the ML easily better the HfM in terms of verve and especially tonality. While the MLs cannot reproduce the levels of detail, they provide a more musically complete and satisfying listen for me.

This is one reason our hobby is so interesting. We all value different things in our sound, and we all hear different things.

You state that (to your ears ) the MLs beat the 560s in terms of tonality and verve. To me, the tonality part is very subjective. One guy want a bass-head set, another wants a treble-cannon, while another wants very forward mids to bring the vocals out front and center. So saying that the 560s' tonality is wanting leaves us wondering 'wanting what?' As far as verve, the dictionary says 'vigor and spirit or enthusiasm' and lists energy, dynamism, liveliness, sparkle and pizzazz as synonyms. So, I infer that you were dissatisfied with the 560s highs. Amusing that other reviewers have mentioned the 560s being bright or even sibilant. I wonder if this is source-dependent or ear-dependent.

Personally, I care a great deal about detail and sound stage, and I find the HE-560s very musical. To me, neutral is not lifeless. There are times when I want something more 'energetic', in which case I'll switch to my Beyer T1g2. But at night, when I just want to be wrapped up in the sound, the 560s are wonderful.

When I read you comments, I though 'hmm...maybe I should try a pair of those'. But after reading your review and others, comments about the bass and detail turned me off. Also, the fact that they don't appear to be available new anywhere (including the ML site) finished the deal.

But hey, you've got headphones you really love, I've got headphones I really love, so it's all good

 

[pataburd]

I have owned and enjoyed the HE-5LE and the HE-6. The HE-500, for me, were not an improvement over the HE-5LE (although, I believe that the 500 were probably designed in another direction--both sound- and market-wise). The 500 were more mid-centric (but not too extremely) yet lacked the neutrality I had come to prefer in the 5LE and the 6. The latter conveyed both neutrality and commensurate musicality/listener involvement.

The 560 is a funny bird for me, and seems to err in the direction of being inequitably analytical: i.e., emphasizing certain aspects of the recording (like the brush strike right on top of the head of the snare drum) while at the same time de-emphasizing other aspects (like the round-body acoustic from inside the snare drum on the same brush strike).

It could be source/amp dependent, too, with the HE-560; I'm not sure. But having owned and enjoyed the likes of the HE-5LE and the HE-6, and knowing HifiMAN's capabilities, the 500--and now the 560--fall just a bit short of the mark for me.

The Mikros 90--I kept the best two (one stock, the other modified) of seven pairs that I had originally purchased--have been consistent performers for me over the last several years. [I am listening to them right now: Mose Allison: "Fool's Paradise".] Aside from the general derision that the MLs tend(ed) to incur on the HF threads, they continue to be one of my all time favorite sets of headphones. They are not perfect by any means, nor are they the "endgame" in the endless game of headophilia. Consistency and longevity, however, in this hobby, are notable and even admirable qualities for headphones.

More recently, in my quest for truly musical neutrality--or is it truly neutral musicality?--I have been returning to electrostatics.

 

[LCMusicLover]

I have owned and enjoyed the HE-5LE and the HE-6. The HE-500, for me, were not an improvement over the HE-5LE (although, I believe that the 500 were probably designed in another direction--both sound- and market-wise). The 500 were more mid-centric (but not too extremely) yet lacked the neutrality I had come to prefer in the 5LE and the 6. The latter conveyed both neutrality and commensurate musicality/listener involvement.

The 560 is a funny bird for me, and seems to err in the direction of being inequitably analytical: i.e., emphasizing certain aspects of the recording (like the brush strike right on top of the head of the snare drum) while at the same time de-emphasizing other aspects (like the round-body acoustic from inside the snare drum on the same brush strike).

It could be source/amp dependent, too, with the HE-560; I'm not sure. But having owned and enjoyed the likes of the HE-5LE and the HE-6, and knowing HifiMAN's capabilities, the 500--and now the 560--fall just a bit short of the mark for me.

The Mikros 90--I kept the best two (one stock, the other modified) of seven pairs that I had originally purchased--have been consistent performers for me over the last several years. [I am listening to them right now: Mose Allison: "Fool's Paradise".] Aside from the general derision that the MLs tend(ed) to incur on the HF threads, they continue to be one of my all time favorite sets of headphones. They are not perfect by any means, nor are they the "endgame" in the endless game of headophilia. Consistency and longevity, however, in this hobby, are notable and even admirable qualities for headphones.

More recently, in my quest for truly musical neutrality--or is it truly neutral musicality?--I have been returning to electrostatics.

It's definitely truly neutral musicality

As far as source dependency, I have noticed that among my portable amps, the RSA Shadow left me dissatisfied with the bass impact of the 560s, while my Topping NX5 and AlgoRhythm Duet (especially balanced) drive them very well.

Inequitably analytical took me quite a few processor cycles to parse. In any case, here's to headophilia.

(I have to say that headophilia made me think of Hannibal Lecter for just a minute -- he said with a shudder.)

 

[Raketen]

It's definitely truly neutral musicality

As far as source dependency, I have noticed that among my portable amps, the RSA Shadow left me dissatisfied with the bass impact of the 560s, while my Topping NX5 and AlgoRhythm Duet (especially balanced) drive them very well.

Inequitably analytical took me quite a few processor cycles to parse. In any case, here's to headophilia.

(I have to say that headophilia made me think of Hannibal Lecter for just a minute -- he said with a shudder.)

I was surprised by the bass due to so many comments I had seen describing them as bass light. They haven't seemed bass light at all in any of the sources I have yet tried- even compared to the very bassy MDR Z7: I dont' think 560 extend as deep, but in some areas they have more impact as the Z7 bass is of more soft/diffuse character.

 

[pataburd]

With capable amplification, the HE-560 can produce ample, deep bass.