[Jibr]

Hello my friends,
 
I am really interested about these nice headphones. But I dont seem to find an europe retailer for these. I live in Luxembourg (if it matters).

 

[DavidA]

  Well guys, last week at my local hi-fi shop ( Chongqing Feixiang HiFi Shop, the shop's online store is here), I had a chance to sample the HE-400i as I was ordering my second pair of M-100s and purchasing my second Cayin C5 amp. (See this post...and this post...to find out why I ordered a second set.)
 
I hate to say it, guys, but the HE-400i didn't impress me in the least. It's totally meant for audiophiles and not at all for bassheads!
 
As I plugged it into my portable handheld rig and listened, the HE-400i's low sensitivity made it seem like I was driving a pair of 150-ohm cans, rather than 30-ish ohms. It also made me realize something else: using an open-backed pair of headphones is like running a subwoofer without a box.
 
I was playing the second-to-last song featured in my long post about my custom EQ presets (on my Rockboxed iPod), which is the first of the two Chinese pop songs at the end of that list (Phoenix Legend's "Fly Freely"). Using the exact same EQ preset for that particular song that I normally use,...not only could I not play it very loud on the HE-400i (through my Cayin C5 amp with its bass-boost switch turned on), but it didn't throb hardly at all, either. I started getting amp clipping from the attempt at driving a lot of sub-bass, and the music wasn't even playing very loud!
 
Of course, if I turned off the EQ in Rockbox and set everything to flat, then I could get the HE-400i to play loud, but it lacked even more of a low end that way.
 
As for soundstage, the HE-400i paled in comparison to the soundstage of the M-100 with my custom EQ presets and Cayin C5 amp running with it. Whether using an EQ or not, the HE-400i just can't deliver the proper amount of low-end sub-bass to support and complement the soundstage and make it seem wider, deeper, and fuller. Of course, without an EQ, the HE-400i has somewhat of a better soundstage than the M-100 without an EQ. But with an EQ, the M-100's soundstage absolutely blows away the HE-400i if done properly.
 
But I will say one other good thing about the HE-400i: at least I can't use my Cayin C5 to make the drivers bottom out and go "snap, crackle, pop," as I could do with the Sennheiser HD 650 at the shop a few months ago! 

 
So the HE-400i must be for audiophiles who crave some extra power handling, I guess. 

 

I think your use of the Cayin C5 is holding the HE-400i back, the M-100 is one of the easiest to drive headphones that I've had, I could get great sound with just a phone or DAP like a Fiio X1.  With the HE-400i I need some thing with a lot of current like a Lyr2, Project Ember or others have suggested a H-10 to get the sound they are capable of.  The HE-400i with the X1 doesn't cut it, the sound is thin and lacks dynamics.
Also, I don't recall anyone saying the HE-400i is a bass head headphone, some call the HE-400 a bass head can but it also needs a good amp to get the bass.
With that said, sorry the HE-400i didn't work out for you.

 

[snellemin]

  Well guys, last week at my local hi-fi shop ( Chongqing Feixiang HiFi Shop, the shop's online store is here), I had a chance to sample the HE-400i as I was ordering my second pair of M-100s and purchasing my second Cayin C5 amp. (See this post...and this post...to find out why I ordered a second set.)
 
I hate to say it, guys, but the HE-400i didn't impress me in the least. It's totally meant for audiophiles and not at all for bassheads!
 
As I plugged it into my portable handheld rig and listened, the HE-400i's low sensitivity made it seem like I was driving a pair of 150-ohm cans, rather than 30-ish ohms. It also made me realize something else: using an open-backed pair of headphones is like running a subwoofer without a box.
 
I was playing the second-to-last song featured in my long post about my custom EQ presets (on my Rockboxed iPod), which is the first of the two Chinese pop songs at the end of that list (Phoenix Legend's "Fly Freely"). Using the exact same EQ preset for that particular song that I normally use,...not only could I not play it very loud on the HE-400i (through my Cayin C5 amp with its bass-boost switch turned on), but it didn't throb hardly at all, either. I started getting amp clipping from the attempt at driving a lot of sub-bass, and the music wasn't even playing very loud!
 
Of course, if I turned off the EQ in Rockbox and set everything to flat, then I could get the HE-400i to play loud, but it lacked even more of a low end that way.
 
As for soundstage, the HE-400i paled in comparison to the soundstage of the M-100 with my custom EQ presets and Cayin C5 amp running with it. Whether using an EQ or not, the HE-400i just can't deliver the proper amount of low-end sub-bass to support and complement the soundstage and make it seem wider, deeper, and fuller. Of course, without an EQ, the HE-400i has somewhat of a better soundstage than the M-100 without an EQ. But with an EQ, the M-100's soundstage absolutely blows away the HE-400i if done properly.
 
But I will say one other good thing about the HE-400i: at least I can't use my Cayin C5 to make the drivers bottom out and go "snap, crackle, pop," as I could do with the Sennheiser HD 650 at the shop a few months ago! 

 
So the HE-400i must be for audiophiles who crave some extra power handling, I guess. 

 

 I'm a part-time basshead nowadays.  Your problem was trying to power low efficiency headphones with an under powered amp.  To get bottomless lowend bass, you will need a manly amplifier for 400i.  In my case, I'm using a full size amplifier(NAD 2140) with some 10W resistors to dig deep into the sub bass regions without ever clipping my amp.  Bass digs so deep, that the back grill vibrates around the cup.
 
I agree with you on the 650.  That is just one sad headphone when trying to play some decent bass.  

 

[DiscoProJoe]

  I think your use of the Cayin C5 is holding the HE-400i back, With the HE-400i I need some thing with a lot of current like a Lyr2, Project Ember or others have suggested a H-10 to get the sound they are capable of. 
some call the HE-400 a bass head can but it also needs a good amp to get the bass.

 

   I'm a part-time basshead nowadays.  Your problem was trying to power low efficiency headphones with an under powered amp.  To get bottomless lowend bass, you will need a manly amplifier for 400i.  In my case, I'm using a full size amplifier(NAD 2140) with some 10W resistors to dig deep into the sub bass regions without ever clipping my amp.  Bass digs so deep, that the back grill vibrates around the cup.

 
Interesting; I didn't realize that. Maybe next time at the shop I can try running my portable rig through one of their desktop headphone amps on display and hear how the HE-400i sounds.
 
But for me, of course, I'm personally not interested in purchasing a desktop amp, though, as this would immobilize my headphones.

 

[WriterHead]

   
I hate to say it, guys, but the HE-400i didn't impress me in the least. It's totally meant for audiophiles and not at all for bassheads!
 
 

Who would have guessed it?

 

[wildwood88]

May I know what's the different between he400i and he400? Now my current set is m50x and hd600... I like hd600 with o2+odac in classical and instrumental song, but listening rock and pop, which is really lacking. I feel is too empty and too thin. Now what I am concern is, what's their diffferent? Is these 2 headphones going to satisfied what I needed? Or I should look to grado/x2??

 

[rovopio]

May I know what's the different between he400i and he400? Now my current set is m50x and hd600... I like hd600 with o2+odac in classical and instrumental song, but listening rock and pop, which is really lacking. I feel is too empty and too thin. Now what I am concern is, what's their diffferent? Is these 2 headphones going to satisfied what I needed? Or I should look to grado/x2??

 
You can get he-400i used for not much more than a New Fidelio X2 so I say skip the X2.
 
he-400 is no longer available new and the he-400i is designed by Hifiman as a replacement for both the he-400 and the he-500 (though it is not that simple).
On your particular question, he-400i has smooth trebles, forward midrange, non-fatiguing sound, and good bass.
he-400 has v-shaped sound, peaky trebles, and great bass.

 

[DavidA]

May I know what's the different between he400i and he400? Now my current set is m50x and hd600... I like hd600 with o2+odac in classical and instrumental song, but listening rock and pop, which is really lacking. I feel is too empty and too thin. Now what I am concern is, what's their diffferent? Is these 2 headphones going to satisfied what I needed? Or I should look to grado/x2??

The 02+0dac may not be the best to drive the HE-400i & HE-400, also the HE-400 is hard to find new since it has been discontinued.  If you mean lacking that it does not have the dynamics then the HE-400i will work but you will need a amp to drive it properly.  I use either a Lyr2 or Ember.  If you mean lacking is sound stage and resolving then I would look at a HD-700 or TH-600, both of which will need a good amp to sound their best, both the Lyr2 and Ember will work for this also.  If you like the Grado sound but want more bass then I would look in to building a SennGrado.

 

[headwhacker]

  The 02+0dac may not be the best to drive the HE-400i & HE-400, also the HE-400 is hard to find new since it has been discontinued.  If you mean lacking that it does not have the dynamics then the HE-400i will work but you will need a amp to drive it properly.  I use either a Lyr2 or Ember.  If you mean lacking is sound stage and resolving then I would look at a HD-700 or TH-600, both of which will need a good amp to sound their best, both the Lyr2 and Ember will work for this also.  If you like the Grado sound but want more bass then I would look in to building a SennGrado.

 
What is it lacking in ODAC+O2 that won't drive the HE-400i compared to others amps you threw in?

 

[DavidA]

   
What is it lacking in ODAC+O2 that won't drive the HE-400i compared to others amps you threw in?

From reading on the HD-650/HE-400/and earlier in this thread many say the O2 does not have the voltage needed to drive the HE-400i its best.

 

[520RanchBro]

Yeah it would seem the O2 has plenty of power to effectively drive the 400i so not sure where that is coming from. If you're talking about sound quality of the amp then I could see it but I have never used an O2 so I don't know. I use the Asgard 2 with both the 400 and 400i and it drives them both quite well.
 
400i has a more mid-forward sound and sounds just a bit smoother without sacrificing detail. Still has solid bass quantity and impact but not as good as the 400. The 400 also has a bit wider soundstage.

 

[WitzyZed]

Was at a meet yesterday & got to run a pair of stock & modded 400i's off my Fiio E12A.
On high gain they sounded plenty good.
Noticed some odd treble stuff going on with the stock pair, that I didn't experience with the modded pair.

 

[mandrake50]

  From reading on the HD-650/HE-400/and earlier in this thread many say the O2 does not have the voltage needed to drive the HE-400i its best.

Not sure what "its best" actually is. The 400i scales well with amplification. One could say that it is not at its best unless one spends X thousand dollars on amps and DACs. Even if that happened to be true, it does not rule out using something less expensive and getting lots of enjoyment form the experience. Besides, I am always skeptical when someone has no personal experience with something and answers definitively based on someone else' opinions.
 
I have the 400i and O2, the combination is just fine actually! Can the 400i sound a bit better, maybe (depending on the users requirements and taste). But if someone likes the pairing, and doesn't have upgradeitis, they could be quite happy to use these together for a long time.
 
Heck, my X5 drives the 400i nicely for what I use that combination for.

 

[john57]

At the Denver meet when I was using the IFI micro iDSD on both the HE560 and the HE400i and was impressed by both for different reasons. The HE-560 is a richer sounding headphone with a bit more high treble extension. The bass is remarkable clear and tight on the HE400i and reminds me more of my Stax headphones, three in fact at one time. The treble is a bit more smoother on the HE400i and would be great for recording that has quite of bit of sibilants in it. The HE400i does not have quite a large sound stage as compared to other headphones but I believe that the way the treble is presented has alot to do with the soundstage. I was hoping that someone was going to bring MrSpeakers Ether but is was a no show. However the Ether at $1500 just too much for me. You can still enjoy listening to music with lower cost headphones and be happy as well. I am going to sell one of my Byers headphones and get the HE400i. I have a few tricks on my sleeve to improve the soundstage of the HE400i as needed. Also at the meet I listen to the LCD-3 and found the treble to be rougher which surprised me since the LCD-2 is way too dark for my needs. Also the HE400i is one of the most comfortable headphones I have the pleasure of using and it is very light from my point of view.

 

[DavidA]

 
Not sure what "its best" actually is. The 400i scales well with amplification. One could say that it is not at its best unless one spends X thousand dollars on amps and DACs. Even if that happened to be true, it does not rule out using something less expensive and getting lots of enjoyment form the experience. Besides, I am always skeptical when someone has no personal experience with something and answers definitively based on someone else' opinions.
 
I have the 400i and O2, the combination is just fine actually! Can the 400i sound a bit better, maybe (depending on the users requirements and taste). But if someone likes the pairing, and doesn't have upgradeitis, they could be quite happy to use these together for a long time.
 
Heck, my X5 drives the 400i nicely for what I use that combination for.

The best I've heard the HE-400i was driven with speaker outputs from a McIntosh amp.

Agree with you about the no personal experience part, I was just passing info that I had seen in some threads and I also have a few friends who have the ODAC+O2 and have told me that its pretty good for the price and will work with the HE-400i but having something like the Lyr2 will be a definite improvement.
 
I've tried my HE-400/HE-400i with my X3 and X3ii and while it sounds good it lacks dynamics compared to driving them with the Lyr2 and Ember.