[mendye770]

So, I got to hear the HEDDphone, and I was surprised how much bass it pushed. The bass pushes a large area type bass similar to headphones of a large area inside the cups. Which a very noticeable bass and very engulfing type. The imaging is the biggest strength of this headphone with it's bass is presented in terms of imaging.

Although the large room inside the cups causes impression of air, but I don't hear much of air from the treble area. The area defines the sound are mainly in the upper-mids, specifically 3-4k, which agrees with the measurements I've been seeing. I also agree with the bass being pretty linear, but what the measurement cannot express is how the bass is express in the large cup presention without failure to provide enough impact. Bass fairly tight in the way it hits, pretty solid. The sound stage is wide, and the way sound decays reminds me of the way a well driven HE-6 decays. It doesn't feel like there is something blocking the sound decay.

I can easily tell it's almost like the HE-6 in terms of drivability. I suspect you'd need something powerful to get the imaging and impact like how the HE-6 was.

I terms of resolution, I didn't find the sound particularly detail rich sound. Pretty avg detailing, but clean sounding. I didn't find the separation to be it's strength either. I find this headphone to sound like a hybrid of Hifiman and Audeze. Audeze like bass presentation with the impact, but more similar to Hifiman planar upper frequencies, and I don't mean the Hifimans with lots of treble. HEDD AMT drivers sound very similar to planar. If I didn't know these were AMT, and I would have thought planar.

I would like to point out (if I may) that the cables that u use makes the whole difference as well.
The stock cable is absolute s**t, excuse my French.
I got a all silver cable from ted Allen and boy oh boy did the sound change!!!!!
It’s literally an entirely new headphone. Everything gets better.

 

[Bucketron]

My Toxic cable SW24V2 arrived after 5 months of waiting. Very good paring with Heddphone.

 

[LCMusicLover]

I would like to point out (if I may) that the cables that u use makes the whole difference as well.
The stock cable is absolute s**t, excuse my French.
I got a all silver cable from ted Allen and boy oh boy did the sound change!!!!!
It’s literally an entirely new headphone. Everything gets better.

Yes, Ted does nice work -- I have several of his cables. Gotta shop local

 

[LCMusicLover]

Got turned on to some new (to me) music which absolutely loves my Hedd:



Especially this track:



Hugo2go streaming from Qobuz via iPad AirPlay is very good. Audio-gd Master 11 ==> Hedd is double-plus good! Not sure if it’s the excess power or the R2R (1704-based) DAC vs Gumby, or the combo. There is something to being able to crank it to “that’s too loud” and still have lots of headroom.

 

[pataburd]

Am currently preferring a 4x 22 AWG Neotech UPOCC solid core copper cable: excellent dimensionality and bass extension . Am expecting an incoming 4x 22 AWG Neotech UPOCC solid core silver [hook-up wire] cable to supersede my other [3] HEDDphone cables.

 

[iFi audio]

Yes, like a single-source passive pre-amp. Will be looking for a pair of Ric Schultz's 24-step "Ultimate Nude Attenuators", too; but they are very difficult to find nowadays.

Have you ever considered building yourself something passive on i.e. Khozmo or something similar?

 

[pataburd]

I have thought about it, but for a single source Scott Endler's or Ric Schultz's attenuators can't be bettered.
Endler did market a passive with 5 or 6 inputs, but I am a "sole source" listener.
On the other hand, I am seriously thinking about starting to make my own cables.

 

[KaiSc]

...I am seriously thinking about starting to make my own cables.

If you think about making your own cables, you must have an idea about what cables do.

I am trying to understand:
Is it, that a bad cable changes the sound, looses some information?
Or is it the other way around, that the good cable adds something that wasn't there before, to improve the sound?

Specially if I read something like this (not your words):

... and boy oh boy did the sound change!!!!!
It’s literally an entirely new headphone. Everything gets better.

If I follow this posting the cable is more important then the headphones themself?

Does the cable length make any difference?

You're the one that's posting the most about cables here, so you ought to know about the mechanism, from a practical side of view?!

 

[pataburd]

The ideal has always been essentially a "straight wire" path between source and speaker; this would include preamp, cable, amplifier, etc.; i.e. everything in between. An effective cable, like any effective component, should maintain [perfect] signal integrity between these two critical points.

mendye770 is mostly expressing his subjective opinion on the new cable; there is no mandatory onus that he also be technically proficient about the science. In much the same manner that a Rolls Royce owner can extol the benefits of ownership without necessarily having to be an expert automotive engineer/technician.

However, I do see your point. To have a subjective perception coupled with an objective, scientifically plausible [and universally applicable] explanation is best, but not always possible.

There is a "sound science" forum on HF that is designed to answer the questions you raise. Plus, the issue of cabling and its efficacy can become a hotly debated topic on these and other audio forums. Either your ears/brain perceive apparent audible differences from cable-to-cable or they do not.

 

[bagwell359]

Headphone cables: I've heard a fair amount - some seem to make a notable difference, some make some, others make none - on different rigs. I can multiply that experience by about 5x if talking interconnects with a somewhat similar result.

My conclusion: listen for yourself. Be aware of the biasing towards more expensive/exotic gear, and listen to pieces you are very familiar with, and use your own rig to decide.

In addition, anyone that claims all cables that they replaced stock ones with are great and those that insist none ever make a difference are to be treated with skepticism.

Finally, all digital parametric EQ makes more of a difference, and if its via streaming it's cheaper. Also pads can make a big difference - for less than headphone cable also.

 

[KaiSc]

...Finally, all digital parametric EQ makes more of a difference, and if its via streaming it's cheaper...

Can you express about how many dB of treble and/or bass EQ e.g. would equal the difference between a bright and dark sounding cable?

...Also pads can make a big difference - for less than headphone cable also.

Did I get you right, cables do more change than earpads?

 

[bagwell359]

Can you express about how many dB of treble and/or bass EQ e.g. would equal the difference between a bright and dark sounding cable?

What measurements are you talking about? Raw frequency, or other? I haven't heard a balanced interconnect sound different from another in over 20 years, OTOH the HFM cans: HE-500, HEX v2, HE-6SE all 3 different aftermarket cables sound quite a bit better than the stock (2 similar/same, the other different). So I prefer to decide on one change at a time (BTW in 2 of 3 of those cases I used an AB testing methodology).

Did I get you right, cables do more change than earpads?

It's not that simple. Some pads sound the same or very similar to other pads. But in the case of the HE-500 which I have tried 13 pads on, the difference between the best and the two worst was epic, whereas say the 3rd "best" and the 9th "best" were not hugely different. So, very much not linear.

So in the case of the HE-500 and its "best" pad the Ether Angled I would say that they make a bigger difference than the cable switch. OTOH if I never came across the Ether Angled I would likely say the cable was a bigger deal.

Also, taking out the rear screen on all HFM (round form) cans I have owned makes a big positive difference. Also find that dynamat applied to the rear outside between the cup and the frame cuts down bass overhang. That's with the MD-4XX, HE-500, HE5-LE, HE5se, and HE6se.

But if I was using a digital parametric EQ 3 years ago I might not have delved into those mods.

 

[KaiSc]

What measurements are you talking about? Raw frequency, or other? I haven't heard a balanced interconnect sound different from another in over 20 years,
...
But if I was using a digital parametric EQ 3 years ago I might not have delved into those mods.

My question is, how much digital EQ equals the amount of sound change between a dark and a bright cable: 1dB, 2dB treble boost/cut - not by measurement, but by listening.


Anyway you say, the differences is only in unbalanced connection, balanced cables do all sound the same, right?

Also, taking out the rear screen on all HFM (round form) cans I have owned makes a big positive difference. Also find that dynamat applied to the rear outside between the cup and the frame cuts down bass overhang. That's with the MD-4XX, HE-500, HE5-LE, HE5se, and HE6se.

But if I was using a digital parametric EQ 3 years ago I might not have delved into those mods.

I have a similar experience with the round grid/cloth back of Hifiman headphones.
There's a bit of sound reflection, replacing it with an accoustical transparent grid smoothes out the treble a bit, in a way that could not be achieved by digital EQ.

I don't find anything wrong with the bass on my Hifiman HE4xx.

The grid, of course, cannot easily be removed on my HE-1000, but might be less problematic, anyhow, it's constructed completely different.

 

[JaZZ]

My question is, how much digital EQ equals the amount of sound change between a dark and a bright cable: 1dB, 2dB treble boost/cut - not by measurement, but by listening.

That's hard to quantify, as it depends on the perceived difference of tonal balance (which isn't reflected in the measurements, BTW), but it can absolutely exceed 1 dB, altough not by much. Let's say in the case of the FiiO LC-3.5C (pure copper) vs. the LC-3.5D (pure silver) I had to reduce the treble by 1.2 dB at 16 kHz and by 0.6 dB at 4 kHz for the silver cable – this for my IEMs.

However, it's not just the tonal balance that's influenced by a cable; it can also make the sound rougher or smoother, sharper or softer, clearer or cloudier, flatter or more threedimensional (to some degree). Gererally speaking solid-core designs and those with separately insulated stranded wires (litz cables) of ultra-pure oxigen-free copper or silver sound smoother and clearer than common braided cables, so these are preferrable. In my experience multiple thin enameled wires provide sharper images than one solid core (→ better high-frequency extension and resolution).

Of course equalizing has a greater effect on the tonal balance, but respecting both elements together has become mandatory for my listening pleasure. And I prefer silver to copper.

That's why I have ordered the Norne Silvergarde S4 for the HEDDphone. I'm glad I did. I'm living with the combo since 2½ weeks now and am convinced by the result – although the magnitude of improvement seems to be smaller than with the HE1000(se) cables (with their rather bad reputation). I still have to do a systematic comparison, though – and will post about it. Moreover I have adapted the EQ curve to the new configuration, which has also paid off.

 

[bagwell359]

My question is, how much digital EQ equals the amount of sound change between a dark and a bright cable: 1dB, 2dB treble boost/cut - not by measurement, but by listening.

That's hard. Anything over 1500 Hz can sound bright. So if a cable is 1 db up from 1500 Hz to 20 kHz, it's going to be audible as brightness. But consider a case like the the HE-500. It's got a dip in frequency response around 9 or 10 kHz, it also rings heavily in an adjacent area. So if one can even that off with an EQ it might sound somewhat even in that area, or if you overdo it - dark or deficient.

Anyway you say, the differences is only in unbalanced connection, balanced cables do all sound the same, right?

Oops, foot in mouth - I meant balanced/XLR interconnect cables (pre to amp for instance) do not sound different to me for over two decades.

All of my headphone cables in use are balanced, I had one that was SE stock, and my balanced replacement sounds better, but my amp operates much better into balanced so I don't count that one as a good case to prove anything - except my amp is better into balanced.

I have a similar experience with the round grid/cloth back of Hifiman headphones.
There's a bit of sound reflection, replacing it with an accoustical transparent grid smoothes out the treble a bit, in a way that could not be achieved by digital EQ.

Right, just like the fuzzor mod on the HE-500 and HE-6 - but moreso.

I don't find anything wrong with the bass on my Hifiman HE4xx.

Pretty easy to prove. Get a test CD that plays 20, 40, 60, 80 Hz (or maybe two since that combo is hard to find in one). Play the 4XX and another can believed to be strong at 20 and 40 Hz, then EQ both at 1K, or better 250, 500, 1000. What you are hearing is rather an under damped planar (gives a thick sound), and the harmonic for say 60 which is 120 Hz, and of course what fundamental there is (lesser than 120 Hz).

The grid, of course, cannot easily be removed on my HE-1000, but might be less problematic, anyhow, it's constructed completely different.

I agree, my only mod on my long cup HFM is a pair of nuggets to raise the drivers. and the cable replacing the very poor excuse for one HFM provides.