HD800 - to be or not to be

[grokit]

 
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Concerning the Edition 8.  It doesn't fold, but they do sell them as portable since you get a 4ft cable with mini plug and a leather pullstring bag to store and carry them.  As to their sound, they're definitely different from the HD800's.  I never feel that I have to acclimatize the HD800's.  I usually <sigh> with a 'home sweet home' sort of feeling when I put them on after a period of not listening to them.  However, I have to 'tune in' so to speak, to the Ed8 sound.  Though it's full of detail and clarity, the balance can be great fun and certainly breath's life into some recordings, like say The Beatles, but they're not lasting for me.  However, I don't wish to part with them since I do take them out when I wish to take a vacation from home.  

Whoops, I was thinking of some of the other Ultrasones, the way they fold down into a ball; post edited 

 
Your take on the SQ of the Edition 8 8 is interesting. I know they have a reputation for being somewhat colored sounding, I really need to give them a listen first but that is difficult for me. Good thing I have other great headphones, so I am in no hurry!

 
 
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Anyone who has heard dance and hip-hop music with the HD800s should know how terrible it sounded. The treble was so dominating and bright it literally hurt my ears after a minute or so of listening. Of course one can use an EQ or other methods to trim the highs but that would also alter the sound stage and a lot of the nice things about the HD800s, so I definitely wouldn't say they are good for all genres. One thing that is true about the HD800s is that they are one of the most revealing headphones around, maybe even more revealing than the LCD-2s, but whether it's a good thing or not really depends on the user, as they don't just show up the flaws in bad recordings, they also show you all the flaws in some good-recordings too. For instant, I noticed editing on Hayley Westernra's voice which I've never noticed before with other phones or monitors. Or the musicians breathing, tiny noise from the throat of vocalists, background noise that one would not be able to hear with other headphones or monitors. However, when the HD800s are good, they are really good; with concerto or live acoustic music, the LCD-2s will give you a listening position about 10 rows from the stage, whereas with the HD800s, you would be in the front or 2nd row. With piano music, you'd be listening from the position of the pianist or right next to the soundboard. I think the HD800s are also particularly good for listening to recordings made from analogue tapes, it somehow put back those little bit of highs that are sometimes lost with analogue tape compression.
I wouldn't say the LCD-2s are good, I'd say they are accurate and exactly what I was looking for in a pair of headphones. They present you with whatever you put through them, no enhancement and no detraction, they are more like a pair of reference monitors than a pair of headphones. If the recording was made in a small recording studio, it will not give you the sound stage of a concert hall, whereas the HD800s would sometimes exaggerate, but in a nice way. If I could only have one pair of headphone, I would definitely choose the LCD-2s, but that's just me, I'm a purist.

I guess I go the other way. I think the LCD-2 does some things extremely well, but I do not think they could be my only headphone. I sold mine to another Head-fier, but I think that another set of LCD-2s are in my future. Or perhaps the LCD-3 

 
I think we are in agreement on some levels, as most dance and hip-hop music are not recorded, mixed, or mastered as well as other musical genres. Another issue could be amplification, what are you using to power the HD800? All this is my opinion of course, but I am convinced that you need to go with a full tube amp with the HD800, they really smooth out. Out of my hybrid EF5 they can sound too bright with some music for sure, with tubes you can change the sound to smooth out the highs, and add impact to the bass just by rolling different ones in. Way better than equalizing, which as you pointed out has its drawbacks.
 
The way you compared the soundstage on these two headphones is interesting. Some of the most enthusiastic LCD-2 supporters have posted impressions saying the exact opposite, that the LCD-2 is more front row, and the HD800 is more middle of the concert hall.
 
 
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As to hip hop and dance.... what a landscape of lousy, loudness war recordings!!!  It's difficult to find a recent one that's genuinely good.  So, if the recording is lousy, then you need cans that will not show this up.  Righto....   When the recording is great, just about any can you throw at it will sound listenable at the minimum.   I'm quite picky with the hip hop I listen to and enjoy them immensely with the HD800's. 

 

I'd love to try the LCD-2's, but I can't seem to muster enough interest to get one.... My homely HD800's have killed the vibes to look further.  Let's see how long that lasts.  Maybe by then, there'll be another can that overshadows the LCD-2's.  I remember when the HE-5's were the rage..  Now they're long forgotten.... utterly incredible to witness.

 
That is what the HD800 did for me as well, cured the "headphone jones" for awhile. If anything the HE-5 is also responsible for curing the jones, as it is my beautiful wooden ortho. I never lost enthusiasm for it, it was kind of like the LCD-2 where I couldn't get used to the sound signature at first but I managed to adjust and now I can't imagine parting with them (the HE-5 is more physically comfortable -- to me -- than the LCD-2, that was also a sticking point). I still enjoy my HE-5 as much as any other headphone in my collection, it has become my nightstand/iPad rig along with the EF5 and DAC WOW. 

 

[SP Wild]

I absolutely believe that individual HRTFs have a lot to do with the vastly differing opinions on headphones hence I do not believe in trying to dissuade anybody from their views of what any particular headphones do to any individual.
 
I am very grateful that Senheisser released the HD800 in the end of the day.  The reason being they are the giants, and where they go the flock follows.  Prior to the HD800 there was a much smaller market for hi-end 1k plus cans, as I believe that the market felt that if the HD650 was their flagship, the flock weren't convinced that there was any real improvements in spending more.  Now its different, I believe the HD800 and Senheissers might is one of the reasons that the market for hi-end 1K+ cans have expanded and we now have many manufacturers releasing top notch products in a market that can now support many more hi-end players.  I think it really is a new era in headphones and there are now cans that approach the level of hi-end electrostats at a fraction of the cost, albeit with many flavours...something for everybody. 
 
Its a good time to be in this hobby and I think I am addicted and look forward to trying out all the new hi-end offerings as my budget allows.  I also don't believe the current generation of flagships will be superseded any time soon in terms of raw technical performance so I feel that waiting for the next generation before purchasing would be a long wait.  It generally takes 5+ years for flagships to be superseded by genuine new models as opposed to product refreshments that are more sidegrades with a slight change in subjective tonalities.  Case in point, the HD650 is still rooted to the HD580 DNA...this was released in the early nineties - and it was genuinely superseded only last year.
 
It is so good now that STAX felt it necessary to finally create a genuine new flagship...they must really feel threatened by the resurgence of ultra hi-end cans.  I can't wait to try out the new STAX flagship - I hope its something that is truly an improvement over the O2s.

 

[Danz03]

I think it's debatable what is considered well recorded, mixed and mastered. Most rock and metal records had so much compression in the loudest parts, one can't hear much apart from a mashed-up signal, which is in general the usual way to mix a loud rock track, as the feel and the energy of the music is more important than technical perfection. Whereas most dance or hip-hop music is more carefully compressed to have lesser distortion because a well defined groove and rhythm is the most essential. Also since most of the instruments used in this type of music are actually high quality digital samples played with a keyboard, it could in theory be qualified as well recorded. What's different with dance or hip-hop music, is that they were usually mixed with a more V-shaped EQ emphasis. The emphasis of the high frequencies in combination with the brightness of the HD800s is what made them unbearable for me, and not because of the SQ of the music I think.
 
Since one could hear more high frequencies when one is nearer to a sound source, I'd think my comment on the difference between the soundstage of the 2 headphone seems logical, as a lot of reviewers have commented on how dark the LCD-2s sounded compare to the HD800s. It's like how the sound from a violin is more piercing to the ears when one is nearer to the violinist.
 
I do agreed with you though, a tube amp would definitely improves the HD800s by gently compressing the highs and warming up the sound in general, but I think I'd keep this bright sound signature as it is quite pleasant for classical, jazz and acoustic music. Like I said before, I don't think the LCD-2s are good or better than other headphones, I think they are just very accurate, more like a pair of reference monitors, and that's what I like about them. 

 
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I think we are in agreement on some levels, as most dance and hip-hop music are not recorded, mixed, or mastered as well as other musical genres. Another issue could be amplification, what are you using to power the HD800? All this is my opinion of course, but I am convinced that you need to go with a full tube amp with the HD800, they really smooth out. Out of my hybrid EF5 they can sound too bright with some music for sure, with tubes you can change the sound to smooth out the highs, and add impact to the bass just by rolling different ones in. Way better than equalizing, which as you pointed out has its drawbacks.
 
The way you compared the soundstage on these two headphones is interesting. Some of the most enthusiastic LCD-2 supporters have posted impressions saying the exact opposite, that the LCD-2 is more front row, and the HD800 is more middle of the concert hall.
 
 
Quote:

 
As to hip hop and dance.... what a landscape of lousy, loudness war recordings!!!  It's difficult to find a recent one that's genuinely good.  So, if the recording is lousy, then you need cans that will not show this up.  Righto....   When the recording is great, just about any can you throw at it will sound listenable at the minimum.   I'm quite picky with the hip hop I listen to and enjoy them immensely with the HD800's. 

 

I'd love to try the LCD-2's, but I can't seem to muster enough interest to get one.... My homely HD800's have killed the vibes to look further.  Let's see how long that lasts.  Maybe by then, there'll be another can that overshadows the LCD-2's.  I remember when the HE-5's were the rage..  Now they're long forgotten.... utterly incredible to witness.

 

[aliciaqikj]

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The HD800 does sound better after burn-in.  It's a very fine, balanced, precise headphone that does neutral better than anything I've ever heard.  If you like it better than the other cans you've heard - including the PS1000 and the T1 - buy it.

Thank you! I'm new here, Could you explain it more clearly?

 

[mashimaro]

FYI, I am currently saving for the HD800 + Crytal Piccolino combo.
 

 

[Germancub]

I once had the pleasure of hearing the HD800's out of a Heed Canamp at CanJam in LA. I'm still smiling from that experience lol. 

 

[paradoxper]

For me the 800's have been the biggest buyers remorse purchase to date. So much so in fact I gave them away. If you do enjoy them, that's great. For my pref taste in music they just didn't cut it. They truly do offer a incredible soundstage, but among many dislikes, too bright. I am very partial to darker phones anyway.

 

[korzena]

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[Grant625]

I'd been a visitor of Head-fi for 12months before joining, and have bought all of my recent equipment pretty much based solely on comparisons and reviews from head-fiers and can honestly say my HD800+ALO 18awg Cable paired with Burson HA-160DS absolutely kills it for me ... HD800 - my choice for sure